1 hour ago, BLWNBA said:

Exactly, and this is one of the irreconcilable issues for us thus far. The MFC stated that this was their intention and goal, as a result, they have set themselves up (based on current results), as failing that goal.

its one of those no-win situations. i don't think you can come out of the start of the season and say, we are rebuilding on the run. Of course the team will push for finals and it will continue to drive them until its unachievable.

With so many gaping holes and players out of form, it shouldn't surprise any of us that the coaching dept knew exactly where they were after 0-5.

1 hour ago, KozzyCan said:

I find it really frustrating that the members were told we were aiming to play finals this year and contend deep into finals and the story has now completely shifted to 'rebuilding on the run'. If we were told we were rebuilding on the run at the start of the year that would have made this year a lot more palatable but it's pretty clear we've failed in our ambitions and are trying to spin it a different way in the back end of the season.

Umm, so just come out and say we were aiming at 11th? Wouldn't even West Coast have been aiming for the flag this year? Of course they wouldn't admit it but if out of nowhere they had had Adelaide's year they'd still be aiming for the highest and never have been telling their players to aim low.

Maybe nothing should have been said ( though then there's complaints the club doesn't engage with supporters). But I'd hope we started the year aiming to go deep and I'd expect every team to adjust their goals as the year progresses.

(BTW I hope even when teams go into games as huge underdogs that the coaches and players haven't already decided they'll lose. I'm not sure how it's different for seasons, except between them when list management needs to factor in where the team sits)

10 minutes ago, poita said:

Or perhaps we massively overrated the quality and depth of our list and subsequently realised that we can't progress with the current group?

Did we? Many of our players are noticeably below their best this year. Should we have expected that?

Just now, Ollie fan said:

Er, um, perhaps goals can change as time passes? Perhaps we were aiming for finals, rebuilding along the way, until the horror start to the year kiboshed that intention? Perhaps the focus in rebuilding then intensified?

Mate, seriously are you incapable of critically judging the club on anything? All you seem to do is provide excuse after excuse for continued poor performance and often just end up providing a strawman argument as to why 'criticism' is boring.

There is a distinguished difference between strategically pivoting and simply using a goal-shift bias to shift goals when they become too challenging - but goals shouldn't be shifted on the run purely because the current output isn't aligning with the desired end result.

The goal set by the club, at least via external messaging, was that we had the set goal of returning to finals. That is an explicit statement, once again, at least based on external messaging. At the end of the day, whether there were extraneous results that impacted that (I'd argue that there haven't really been measurable extraneous circumstances which have), don't change whether something is a failure or not; all it does is provide a potential explanation, or causative reason on why that failure occurred.

But the continued focus on excuses for these failures since 2021 by many on here, only continues to promote blame avoidance. The Club needs to take responsibility for these results, whether they are deemed failures, or mistakes, or even a combination of both. If we continue down the path of defensive routines, this will only continue to protect individuals within the club, or the club as an entity itself, from any threat to their self-image (essentially, as a form of self-protection). Denial, distortion and distraction are constantly practiced on this very forum by many who do not want to acknowledge the poor results post 2021.

The other factor which I would raise, is this goal was so unrealistic, than to even commit to it, indicates an embarrassing lack of root cause analysis and foresight by the FD and Administration, ineffective problem solving and honestly a lack of transparency and trust between the club and member base.

I don't think you can make an argument that this was a stretch goal; rather it likely indicates a mixture of over optimism, a fear of underachievement, and some wider cultural and organisational factors that have continued to drive this club out of finals contention.

3 minutes ago, Go Ds said:

Umm, so just come out and say we were aiming at 11th? Wouldn't even West Coast have been aiming for the flag this year? Of course they wouldn't admit it but if out of nowhere they had had Adelaide's year they'd still be aiming for the highest and never have been telling their players to aim low.

Maybe nothing should have been said ( though then there's complaints the club doesn't engage with supporters). But I'd hope we started the year aiming to go deep and I'd expect every team to adjust their goals as the year progresses.

(BTW I hope even when teams go into games as huge underdogs that the coaches and players haven't already decided they'll lose. I'm not sure how it's different for seasons, except between them when list management needs to factor in where the team sits)

It's fine to say we are going through a transition phase but we don't put any limits on what we can achieve. It's exactly what Goodwin said last night. The problem is the club sold the members the vision that we were expecting to compete deep into finals. Unless you think they were lying they totally missed the mark.

Last year we were trying to get Dan Houston through the door and refused to trade Oliver. We planted our flag in the ground about our ambitions at the end of last year and the start of this year. It's a very clear failure and the narative is now being moved in a different direction.

Would much rather the club just admit we're not where we thought we were at the start of the year and we're moving in a different direction.

1 hour ago, KozzyCan said:

I find it really frustrating that the members were told we were aiming to play finals this year and contend deep into finals and the story has now completely shifted to 'rebuilding on the run'. If we were told we were rebuilding on the run at the start of the year that would have made this year a lot more palatable but it's pretty clear we've failed in our ambitions and are trying to spin it a different way in the back end of the season.

I thought that last year we were rebuilding on the run before it became something that lots of people said. I'm not claiming special insight but that was how it looked to me with Luke and Gus gone. I don't think the expression excludes making the finals, however. If you are easing a few kids in you'd still be looking to make finals for the opportunity to bring the young ones on as quickly as possible so I don't see it as the club spinning anything.

It's a frank admission of where we are at given our losses since the flag are substantial: Brayshaw, Jackson, Brown, Hibberd, Harmes, Jordon, effectively this year Spargo, and more importantly Burgo and Ooze. That is a lot of talent and fitness and footy smarts we are missing.

10 minutes ago, GS_1905 said:

its one of those no-win situations. i don't think you can come out of the start of the season and say, we are rebuilding on the run. Of course the team will push for finals and it will continue to drive them until its unachievable.

With so many gaping holes and players out of form, it shouldn't surprise any of us that the coaching dept knew exactly where they were after 0-5.

I actually agree partially with what you've said, it's definitely a rock and hard place and regarding the supporter base, a response was never going to please everyone.

But were the results this year really that unexpected against the previous three seasons? I'm not really sure that they were/are.

Edited July 16Jul 16 by BLWNBA

The club's goal was to play finals this year, that is a fact. They made it clear that this was the focus.

However, it's obvious now that this new game plan, which is very necessary if we are to move with the times, is taking a lot longer to implement and is harder for our core senior group to execute. It's not what we planned, but it's where we are.

There is no point denying that we misjudged where the list is at, but thankfully we've gone to the draft the last two years to top up with high quality talent.

Imagine if we got Houston instead of Langford or Lindsay!!!

4 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

It's fine to say we are going through a transition phase but we don't put any limits on what we can achieve. It's exactly what Goodwin said last night. The problem is the club sold the members the vision that we were expecting to compete deep into finals. Unless you think they were lying they totally missed the mark.

Last year we were trying to get Dan Houston through the door and refused to trade Oliver. We planted our flag in the ground about our ambitions at the end of last year and the start of this year. It's a very clear failure and the narative is now being moved in a different direction.

Would much rather the club just admit we're not where we thought we were at the start of the year and we're moving in a different direction.

Finals was expected, we knew our H&A fixture would be easy.

42 minutes ago, Jaded No More said:

The club's goal was to play finals this year, that is a fact. They made it clear that this was the focus.

However, it's obvious now that this new game plan, which is very necessary if we are to move with the times, is taking a lot longer to implement and is harder for our core senior group to execute. It's not what we planned, but it's where we are.

There is no point denying that we misjudged where the list is at, but thankfully we've gone to the draft the last two years to top up with high quality talent.

Imagine if we got Houston instead of Langford or Lindsay!!!

And Clarry and Trac both taking a bit longer to get back to their best...and just a horrible year in front of goals. Im expecting the club to finish this year with 10 wins and rebound hard in 26.

15 hours ago, Chook said:

This guy seems to have a great head for footy. Has someone tapped him to become a coach at all or no?

Why would they? He’s already got a coaching gig for 2026… head coach of the MFC 🎉🥳😁

3 hours ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

I know it's a shadow, but at first glance James Hird looks like he's stacked on junk in the trunk. Or he's wearing a bustle.

Nothing a few walks won't straighten out.

Like Boston to Rio and back.( Not that I would ever body shame anyone).

Edited July 16Jul 16 by Previously known as LITD.

1 hour ago, GS_1905 said:

its one of those no-win situations. i don't think you can come out of the start of the season and say, we are rebuilding on the run. Of course the team will push for finals and it will continue to drive them until its unachievable.

With so many gaping holes and players out of form, it shouldn't surprise any of us that the coaching dept knew exactly where they were after 0-5.

It's definitely a no-win situation. If we had come out at the beginning of the season saying we were "rebuilding on the run" every loss would have been viewed through the prism of tanking.

(Not only that, what would such a statement have meant for the playing group? Why would they have had any incentive to try their hardest? And why would supporters bother to attend matches? or take out memberships?)

1 hour ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

It's definitely a no-win situation. If we had come out at the beginning of the season saying we were "rebuilding on the run" every loss would have been viewed through the prism of tanking.

(Not only that, what would such a statement have meant for the playing group? Why would they have had any incentive to try their hardest? And why would supporters bother to attend matches? or take out memberships?)

Well no, because we traded our first round pick. What exactly would we be tanking for?

4 hours ago, The Taciturn Demon said:

I'd watch an upstairs-downstairs drama where the manor matriarch is in fact a foppish man in drag who spends much of the day seeking out illegal 'tanning' tinctures.

I only hope your not referring to our Uncle Bitters from that salubrious town of Romsey

Full segment

8 hours ago, Jaded No More said:

There is no point denying that we misjudged where the list is at,

I don't believe we misjudged where the list is at, quite the reverse - thus the extensive trades to get into the pointy end of the draft over the past couple of seasons.

Interesting that the professionals gawn and Goodwin were caught on the go by the rule change.

I was at that game and it was gobsmacked how Gawn did nothing to counteract Grundys tactics. And why didn't the assistant coaches or Goodwin address it during the game. It was blindingly obvious what Grundy was doing.

3/4 time we were only a kick down and it was a shock when we lost.

Perplexing

9 hours ago, jnrmac said:

Interesting that the professionals gawn and Goodwin were caught on the go by the rule change.

I was at that game and it was gobsmacked how Gawn did nothing to counteract Grundys tactics. And why didn't the assistant coaches or Goodwin address it during the game. It was blindingly obvious what Grundy was doing.

3/4 time we were only a kick down and it was a shock when we lost.

Perplexing

Not really 🙄

20 hours ago, KozzyCan said:

I find it really frustrating that the members were told we were aiming to play finals this year and contend deep into finals and the story has now completely shifted to 'rebuilding on the run'. If we were told we were rebuilding on the run at the start of the year that would have made this year a lot more palatable but it's pretty clear we've failed in our ambitions and are trying to spin it a different way in the back end of the season.

So would you like them to still push for finals?

Was pretty clear to me after round 10 that we said we needed to look towards the future

37 minutes ago, Tracca said:

So would you like them to still push for finals?

Was pretty clear to me after round 10 that we said we needed to look towards the future

Opportunistic revisionism.

The powers that be were/are deluded

It does not matter what Goody says after each dismal fail, i don't think supporters are buying into his [censored]. We don't seem to have reserve players who can step , perhaps we cannot not be bothered with putting time into these players. Perhaps the reserve players don't try as as hard or are frustrated with the club ( no light at the end of the tunnel). Goody does not punish senior players enough who constantly put in bad performances , it is like he has his favs.

1 hour ago, Tracca said:

So would you like them to still push for finals?

Was pretty clear to me after round 10 that we said we needed to look towards the future

I already answered this but I'm really making the point about how the narrative has been re-written. The club was trying to trade out picks last year for senior players, when that didn't work we said that we invested in top end talent to help us get to finals now. The story is now that we're investing in the draft to 'rebuild on the run'.

I don't think the club planned the list management decisions with that goal in mind. They were clearly trying to get us back to finals now. The notion that we always saw this as a development year and that finals isn't the point for our team is a complete revision.

I would much rather they just be honest with us and say they misread where the team is at and we're now focussed on building our list to get back to the pointy end of the ladder.

49 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

I already answered this but I'm really making the point about how the narrative has been re-written. The club was trying to trade out picks last year for senior players, when that didn't work we said that we invested in top end talent to help us get to finals now. The story is now that we're investing in the draft to 'rebuild on the run'.

I don't think the club planned the list management decisions with that goal in mind. They were clearly trying to get us back to finals now. The notion that we always saw this as a development year and that finals isn't the point for our team is a complete revision.

I would much rather they just be honest with us and say they misread where the team is at and we're now focussed on building our list to get back to the pointy end of the ladder.

There's no point in raising this fallacy or pointing out this inconsistency because it's largely the same people who drove home the notion that the acquisition of Houston would deliver us a flag and we needed players for the now - not draft picks, but now speak of the goal-posts being rightfully moved during what is a 'development' year.

Honestly, the desire from the FD to actively recruit Houston speaks volumes of where they assessed this list was at.

Edited July 17Jul 17 by BLWNBA

1 hour ago, BLWNBA said:

There's no point in raising this fallacy or pointing out this inconsistency because it's largely the same people who drove home the notion that the acquisition of Houston would deliver us a flag and we needed players for the now - not draft picks, but now speak of the goal-posts being rightfully moved during what is a 'development' year.

Honestly, the desire from the FD to actively recruit Houston speaks volumes of where they assessed this list was at.

Yep.. certainly wasn't rebuild at start of the season.

The only semi successful rebuild this season has been the narrative and even that's not persuasive.

Smacks of make it up as you go along.

I'm always fascinated that why any FD would attempt a 'new' game plan where upon you don't have the requisite skillsets in enough players. My feeling is you don't and this is why I've always thought that the brain's trust has thought the essential plan was OK, just needed tweaking.

That this hasn't panned out to me only reinfthe idea there is much wrong about our footy.

On some days our hamfisted approach kinda works... for a while. Better teams pull it apart.

So are we still trying to find a version of our game that holds fast , or is it still evolving ( steered or unstirred) and do we know which players can make it work ?

Strangely I wholeheartedly believe Goody believes he's onto a winner and we have a core of players to do it.

I just happen to disagree