An external review of the Melbourne Football Club is required!

[Supreme_Demon 3,815]

I haven't been on Demonland for a while due to work commitments and family matters.

However, I thought I should make a post about the serious issues the Melbourne Football Club is facing.

After finally breaking our 57 year Premiership drought in 2021, things are now looking grim and we need to fix the serious problems that the Melbourne Demons are currently facing.

This is why I support former Demons champion in David Schwarz about having an entire review of the Melbourne Football Club.

I don't think CEO Gary Pert should do a mere internal review as I don't think that will be enough.

We need both internal and external people investigating the problems the Melbourne Football Club has and look to identify these problems and find solutions to them.

Kane Cornes actually wrote a good news article discussing our issues the other week: https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/the-demons-stand-at-the-gates-of-footy-hell-these-are-the-five-mistakes-that-got-them-there-20240808-p5k0ms.html

I actually agreed with many of the unpleasant truths that he identified about the Melbourne Demons.

An external review is the only way to get to the bottom of all our problems at the Melbourne Demons.

Some of the problems have been out of our control like Luke Jackson wishing to leave the Demons and return home to WA. Others, have been due to rotten luck, like poor Angus Brayshaw being knocked out by Brayden Maynard and then forced to medically retire due to all his concussion injuries.

Why the Demons players didn't seek vengeance for what happened against Angus Brayshaw still bitterly disappoints me. But I guess I have a more bloodthirsty attitude compared to others and would of liked to see football played the way it was in the good ol' days of the 1980's with brawls and pay back against any of our players that were hurt by an opposition player with "an eye for an eye" mentality. Sadly, our attitude against Collingwood on King's Birthday this year was as soft as butter on a hot summer's day in my opinion and was humiliating to witness.

Nevertheless, other issues have to do with poor list management and recruitment. The foolish trade for Brodie Grundy, with the experiment given up after one mere season of trying to see if it could work and then trading away both James Jordon and James Harmes. Not trading in a tall forward or a forward-ruck to help Max Gawn was a big mistake. I don't think we bothered using Tom Fullarton at all either.

Losing Alex Neal-Bullen is disappointing too, but family comes first and hopefully we can arrange a fair trade for him to either the Crows or Power.

Then there are cultural problems and the poor behaviour of Demons players. Obviously, some of these matters cannot be mentioned. But the most important factor is the need to raise the level of the professionalism of a significant portion of our players. David Schwarz even mentioned this on the radio with Demons players allegedly mucking around during their preseason camp down at Anglesea.

Most importantly, we also certainly don't want to see one of our greatest Demons players ever and Norm Smith medallist in Christian Petracca leave the Club. Losing Christian Petracca would be as bad as Ronald Dale Barassi leaving for Carlton at the end of 1964. So reconciling with Christian Petracca is a crucial matter that needs resolving.

The stagnation regarding our Home Base development at Caulfield Racecourse has also been incredibly frustrating and this also needs to see further progress.

In the end, I don't think I am alone with these concerns and the entire Melbourne Football Club (from boot studder to President) has a lot of pertinent questions to answer.

We as Melbourne supporters and members deserve answers and explanations for how things have fallen into disarray so rapidly in season 2024.

Anyway, we still have 2 rounds to go. So let's see what happens....

 

[KozzyCan 764]

I would ask Peter Jackson to do it. He knows the place and many of the people. Isn't afraid to call a spade a spade and is trusted by the members.

[waynewussell 5,523]

KNEE JERK!

[waynewussell 5,523]

Just a reminder... In seasons 2022 & 2023 MFC slipped out of the top 4 for a total of two rounds. That's post our Premiership year. Even in 2024 we have been in the top 4 for 7 rounds. This record has been the envy of every other club. Compare this to the records of Collingwood, Geelong, Richmond, West Coast & Bulldogs, post recent Premierships. Our recent slip from grace is hardly a matter for a 'Royal Commission'. I also note that at least 21 of the current list are signed beyond 2025, add another 9 if you include 2025.

[chookrat 4,247]

What if Demonland did the internal review. We should compile a list of questions they can ask:

1. Why is Simon Goodwin so stubborn?

2. What is the plan B and C?

3. Why do we lose games at the selection table?

4. Why didn't the President remonstrate with the Collingwood players after the Maynard hit?

5. If our culture was better would we have made up on the scoreboard the less than a single kick losses vs Carlton, Brisbane, GWS and Port Adelaide to be in the top 4?

6. Why haven't we been able to cover the loss of Brayshaw, Trac, Melksham and Olivers injuries/form through first, second and third year players?

7. Why doesn't Goodwin blame close losses on the umpiring like the coach of last years premiers?

8. Our ruckman forward coach failed to deliver more goals in our 2023 finals campaign which had nothing to do with the loss of Melksham, Petty and Fritsch's injury/form. This is the case, no?

As Demonlander's what other questions would we ask if we conducted the review?

[waynewussell 5,523]

1 minute ago, FreedFromDesire said:

This is broader than just on field results.

Do tell!

[KozzyCan 764]

I don't understand why some are so resistant to the club getting a review. We keep hearing about how great everything is, how great our culture is, to judge the club on their actions. But the sideshow has popped up again and again. If the club believes they're that good then why should they be afraid of a review?

If there are no issues then the club gets vindicated and it brings peace of mind to the members if there are serious issues they can be exposed and dealt with properly.

[waynewussell 5,523]

In round 22 we lost by 2 points to PA. In round 20 we lost by two points to GWS. In round 16 we lost by 5 points to Brisbane. You will have to rely on your own memory regarding how those results hinged on flip of the coin moments in the final seconds of the game. Reverse those three losses and MFC would currently be equal 3rd on the ladder! I'm not against the type of review that every team conducts post season and agree wholeheartedly that change is required. I simply aren't buying in to the Culture, Shock-Jock scenario!

[chook fowler 19,457]

the review should be done by a proctologist, someone who understands a/holes.

[waynewussell 5,523]

8 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

I don't understand why some are so resistant to the club getting a review. We keep hearing about how great everything is, how great our culture is, to judge the club on their actions. But the sideshow has popped up again and again. If the club believes they're that good then why should they be afraid of a review?

If there are no issues then the club gets vindicated and it brings peace of mind to the members if there are serious issues they can be exposed and dealt with properly.

Has it ever occurred to you that you may be part of the sideshow?

[whatwhat say what 22,731]

18 minutes ago, chookrat said:

What if Demonland did the internal review. We should compile a list of questions they can ask:

1. Why is Simon Goodwin so stubborn?

2. What is the plan B and C?

3. Why do we lose games at the selection table?

4. Why didn't the President remonstrate with the Collingwood players after the Maynard hit?

5. If our culture was better would we have made up on the scoreboard the less than a single kick losses vs Carlton, Brisbane, GWS and Port Adelaide to be in the top 4?

6. Why haven't we been able to cover the loss of Brayshaw, Trac, Melksham and Olivers injuries/form through first, second and third year players?

7. Why doesn't Goodwin blame close losses on the umpiring like the coach of last years premiers?

8. Our ruckman forward coach failed to deliver more goals in our 2023 finals campaign which had nothing to do with the loss of Melksham, Petty and Fritsch's injury/form. This is the case, no?

As Demonlander's what other questions would we ask if we conducted the review?

you forgot...

1. is goodwin the right guy?

ii. is roffey the right gal?

c) is pert a stooge inserted into our club by eddie?

[KozzyCan 764]

2 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

Has it ever occurred to you that you may be part of the sideshow?

What does this even mean?

[waynewussell 5,523]

1 minute ago, KozzyCan said:

What does this even mean?

"... but the sideshow has popped up again and again" Your words, perhaps you should tell us what YOU mean!

[KozzyCan 764]

Just now, waynewussell said:

"... but the sideshow has popped up again and again" Your words, perhaps you should tell us what YOU mean!

Been living under a rock the last twelve months?

[waynewussell 5,523]

Just now, KozzyCan said:

Been living under a rock the last twelve months?

You're avoiding the question!

[KozzyCan 764]

Just now, waynewussell said:

You're avoiding the question!

I'm not going to reiterate every spotfire the club has had over the past year just because you want to play coy. If you don't think our off-field issues bear any significance then that's your right.

But it doesn't really matter what you or I think. The clubs reputation has taken a significant beating across the league in a way that has had real consequences to our ability to function as an AFL club. Look no further than Houston getting cold feet after we courted him for weeks.

[Dee*ceiving 1,674]

On field results aside, noting we have had some poor luck this year with close losses and injury, an external review would be a wise move. 

David Shwarz is as subtle rusty chainsaw but there would definitely be justification for his concern and he legitimately wants what is best for the club. 

Player behaviours, football department structures, list management, our high performance strategy, injury management, player welfare, board structure/delivery capability, leadership and club alignment all require a good look in my view. 

We also need to understand why the media seems to lavish airing our dirty laundry more than any other. Are there leaks? Is it trumped up? Do the media know more than they are allowed to say so they continually point to what they can say to keep the heat on? Is AFL house using the media as a tool against us? 

Publicly Max, Simon, Pert and Richo come across as steady, likeable, reasonable and smart leaders yet we seem to lurch from drama to turmoil to chaos to embarrasment and then back to the start again. Why? 

[gs77 4,063]

32 minutes ago, whatwhat say what said:

you forgot...

1. is goodwin the right guy?

ii. is roffey the right gal?

c) is pert a stooge inserted into our club by eddie?

And add...

\delta:  Where the *f* is our home base?

[Demonland 71,868]

We welcome and encourage open discussions on all the topics mentioned, provided that they are conducted in a respectful and responsible manner.

When discussing sensitive cultural issues, we kindly ask that you refrain from mentioning specific players, incidents, or any identifying details that could lead to harm or undue focus on individuals. Our goal is to ensure that conversations remain constructive and considerate.

Please be aware that posts containing content we deem harmful to individuals or detrimental to the integrity of this platform may be removed, regardless of the context or content of the rest of the post.

Additionally, as a precautionary measure, certain words or phrases may be automatically flagged by our moderation system. If your post is held for review, it doesn't necessarily mean you've done anything wrong; it simply means that further assessment is required to ensure the content aligns with our community standards.

We encourage you to think carefully before posting. Remember, only share content that you would feel comfortable having associated with your real name in a public forum. Let's work together to create a space where meaningful and respectful dialogue can thrive.

[waynewussell 5,523]

21 minutes ago, KozzyCan said:

I'm not going to reiterate every spotfire the club has had over the past year just because you want to play coy. If you don't think our off-field issues bear any significance then that's your right.

But it doesn't really matter what you or I think. The clubs reputation has taken a significant beating across the league in a way that has had real consequences to our ability to function as an AFL club. Look no further than Houston getting cold feet after we courted him for weeks.

I'll have to answer for you...

"Sideshow" - a minor or diverting incident or issue, especially one which distracts attention from something more important. 

Do you think there would be calls for an external review if we were currently sitting 3rd on the ladder? And yet, it is quite clear that we have slipped to our current position because of on-field lapses in the final moments of the games I have referred to previously.

For me, the modus operandi of mainstream media is to create an outrage over some individual, event or issue that will attract an audience. Then, to fan the flames with a series of possible connecting factors or public opinions, not always supported by the facts or more in-depth research. The aim is to sell the specific media product; to keep the 'clicks' coming for as long as possible, before moving on to some other 'outrage', some other individual, event or issue that will draw a crowd. Global ridicule of Raygun's Olympic performance is another current example.

I was asking whether you were simply fanning the flames!

[Colm 2,150]

6 minutes ago, Demonland said:

We welcome and encourage open discussions on all the topics mentioned, provided that they are conducted in a respectful and responsible manner.

When discussing sensitive cultural issues, we kindly ask that you refrain from mentioning specific players, incidents, or any identifying details that could lead to harm or undue focus on individuals. Our goal is to ensure that conversations remain constructive and considerate.

Please be aware that posts containing content we deem harmful to individuals or detrimental to the integrity of this platform may be removed, regardless of the context of the rest of the post.

Additionally, as a precautionary measure, certain words or phrases may be automatically flagged by our moderation system. If your post is held for review, it doesn't necessarily mean you've done anything wrong; it simply means that further assessment is required to ensure the content aligns with our community standards.

We encourage you to think carefully before posting. Remember, only share content that you would feel comfortable having associated with your real name in a public forum. Let's work together to create a space where meaningful and respectful dialogue can thrive.

 

Colm is my real name. Can I say what I want?!😂

[Demonland 71,868]

1 minute ago, Colm said:

Colm is my real name. Can I say what I want?!😂

Please provide your address and Tax File Number. 😜

[D Rev 629]

8 hours ago, Supreme_Demon said:

I haven't been on Demonland for a while due to work commitments and family matters.

However, I thought I should make a post about the serious issues the Melbourne Football Club is facing.

After finally breaking our 57 year Premiership drought in 2021, things are now looking grim and we need to fix the serious problems that the Melbourne Demons are currently facing.

This is why I support former Demons champion in David Schwarz about having an entire review of the Melbourne Football Club.

I don't think CEO Gary Pert should do a mere internal review as I don't think that will be enough.

We need both internal and external people investigating the problems the Melbourne Football Club has and look to identify these problems and find solutions to them.

Kane Cornes actually wrote a good news article discussing our issues the other week: https://www.theage.com.au/sport/afl/the-demons-stand-at-the-gates-of-footy-hell-these-are-the-five-mistakes-that-got-them-there-20240808-p5k0ms.html

I actually agreed with many of the unpleasant truths that he identified about the Melbourne Demons.

An external review is the only way to get to the bottom of all our problems at the Melbourne Demons.

Some of the problems have been out of our control like Luke Jackson wishing to leave the Demons and return home to WA. Others, have been due to rotten luck, like poor Angus Brayshaw almost being killed by that vile thug Brayden Maynard and then forced to medically retire due to all his concussion injuries.

Why the Demons players didn't seek vengeance for what happened against Angus Brayshaw still bitterly disappoints me. But I guess I have a more bloodthirsty attitude compared to others and would of liked to see football played the way it was in the good ol' days of the 1980's with brawls and pay back against any of our players that were hurt by an opposition player with "an eye for an eye" mentality. Sadly, our attitude against Collingwood on King's Birthday this year was as soft as butter on a hot summer's day in my opinion and was humiliating to witness.

Nevertheless, other issues have to do with poor list management and recruitment. The foolish trade for Brodie Grundy, with the experiment given up after one mere season of trying to see if it could work and then trading away both James Jordon and James Harmes. Not trading in a tall forward or a forward-ruck to help Max Gawn was a big mistake. I don't think we bothered using Tom Fullarton at all either.

Losing Alex Neal-Bullen is disappointing too, but family comes first and hopefully we can arrange a fair trade for him to either the Crows or Power.

Then there are cultural problems and the poor behaviour of Demons players. Obviously, some of these matters cannot be mentioned. But the most important factor is the need to raise the level of the professionalism of a significant portion of our players. David Schwarz even mentioned this on the radio with Demons players allegedly mucking around during their preseason camp down at Anglesea.

Most importantly, we also certainly don't want to see one of our greatest Demons players ever and Norm Smith medallist in Christian Petracca leave the Club. Losing Christian Petracca would be as bad as Ronald Dale Barassi leaving for Carlton at the end of 1964. So reconciling with Christian Petracca is a crucial matter that needs resolving.

The stagnation regarding our Home Base development at Caulfield Racecourse has also been incredibly frustrating and this also needs to see further progress.

In the end, I don't think I am alone with these concerns and the entire Melbourne Football Club (from boot studder to President) has a lot of pertinent questions to answer.

We as Melbourne supporters and members deserve answers and explanations for how things have fallen into disarray so rapidly in season 2024.

Anyway, we still have 2 rounds to go. So let's see what happens....

 

Firstly, it's great that you have obviously taken so much time to consider your thoughts for sharing.  Everyone here cares about the Dees, which is why we are here.

I absolutely agree that a review needs to be done of the club every year, and Pert has indicated this is what will be done.  If the board deems it necessary, the review will be external (which I believe it is?).  If the AFL believes we are too much of a basket case, which they did in 13/14, they will remove the board and bring in some pros (ala. Peter Jackson).

We are clearly not in the basket case territory.  We won the flag after 57 years in 2021 in a year when we only had 1 real injury (Tommo, who was superfluous) and were clearly the fittest team in the comp.

Since then we have finished top 4 twice, but come into the finals absolutely battered. I would take a top 4 finish every day of the week.

List management is an issue, but it is for every club.  I think you have missed the point on Grundy, there is no way we could have kept him and it hasn't cost us anything.  Would we have let Jordan go if we knew Brayshaw was going to be forced into retirement?  Probably not.  The point is that these things are more complex than you are representing.

My main issues with list management relate to the lack of recruitment of a back up ruck, though am not sure what was available.  We have the same salary cap issues as they other clubs and need to balance immediate and future needs. Not easy.

Similarly, this season has been ridiculously close and unpredictable.  That we almost beat the team that are now 2nd last weekend, sending us to 13th, shows that.  Have we under-performed THIS season?  I think we have actually done well given the injuries / availability's we have had, particularly to our top 6 players.

Is this finish what we want? No.  Is it understandable? Yes.

The review will highlight areas of improvement and I am 100% confident that our Premiership winning coach and leaders will be able to identify the issues and respond.

 

 

 

[Bring-Back-Powell 14,813]

3 hours ago, KozzyCan said:

I would ask Peter Jackson to do it. He knows the place and many of the people. Isn't afraid to call a spade a spade and is trusted by the members.

He should be the first bloke we call.

[KozzyCan 764]

11 minutes ago, waynewussell said:

I'll have to answer for you...

"Sideshow" - a minor or diverting incident or issue, especially one which distracts attention from something more important. 

Do you think there would be calls for an external review if we were currently sitting 3rd on the ladder? And yet, it is quite clear that we have slipped to our current position because of on-field lapses in the final moments of the games I have referred to previously.

For me, the modus operandi of mainstream media is to create an outrage over some individual, event or issue that will attract an audience. Then, to fan the flames with a series of possible connecting factors or public opinions, not always supported by the facts or more in-depth research. The aim is to sell the specific media product; to keep the 'clicks' coming for as long as possible, before moving on to some other 'outrage', some other individual, event or issue that will draw a crowd. Global ridicule of Raygun's Olympic performance is another current example.

I was asking whether you were simply fanning the flames!

You can shoot the messenger all you want but the media don't go after clubs when their house is in order and they have no issues, they chase stories. You are mad if you think this is simply about ladder position. Look at the last two premiers after us, Geelong finished 12th last year and it wasn't a story, Collingwood are two rungs above us this year and it isn't a story.

You seem to think the club is in tip-top shape so I would ask you why you are so afraid of a review? Surely you would love to see yourself and the leaders at the club vindicated.