On 17/07/2023 at 02:48, Webber said:

 

As best I can glean, they’ve determined he’s got a tear at the Musculo-tendinous junction, or M-T junction (where the ‘white’ tissue meets the ‘red’) of 2 (of his 3) hamstrings. These are more complicated than a simple mid-belly tear (3 week rule) and not as bad as a tear in the tendon pure (3 month +). Hence the time taken. Why they couldn’t determine this at first diagnosis, who knows (imaging isn’t perfect by any means), but it just means a longer timeframe, and longer still the more ‘tendon’ than ‘muscle’. This far into his rehab though, it’s now all about his symptom reportage, whether he can repeat sprint, accelerate, jump and land without pain, so we’ll just have to wait. Cherry ripe for finals I’m thinking. 

Thank god you’re back 

  On 17/07/2023 at 02:51, kev martin said:

I support your sentiment.

Never have I thought they make poor decisions deliberately, I put it down human nature. 

My two cents worth. When the umps enter the oval and the broadcaster ask us to welcome them, I am regularly the only one in the area to applaud them. I would have thought, given the hostility they face by some of the spectators, that more support would be gained. The parents, I would expect to at least show something, in order to install in their youngs ones a sense of respect. I am continually disappointed. I guess they come from the school of Boo's.

The umpires do a tough job across all levels, and we wouldn't have a game without them. They need our respect and less derogatory calls towards them.

My moto when a howler happens is, we can win without the benefit of frees. Though inconsistency can damage the entertainment. 

Keep up the support and sensibilities Macca, I am on board with you.

Thank you

It's not an easy thing to do but I've always enjoyed taking on a minority view when outnumbered!  haha

My frustration with footy has always been that we never seemed to have enough good players

Thankfully, the clubs mindset is to always improve a good list.  No sitting back

And you know what, you do that and the luck can start going your way

Possibly Pick 4 from Freo?  We can now get another star midfielder through the draft (as well as trade for a gun forward with our other picks)

Peaches & Cream

  On 17/07/2023 at 02:14, layzie said:

I’ve watched the last quarter twice and am still stumped how we did it. We started winning a bit more contested footy and clearances but it's so hard to see what changed. We took some more risks.

I think Brisbane did go into their shell a bit too early and after looking so confident since the end of the first quarter they started looking scared, missing short options and just banging it long out of their backline. A comeback almost always coincides with a 'come apart'. They definitely choked.

I thought we completely changed it up.  In qtrs 1 to 3 we were content to zone back and left easy kicks for them coming out of our forward 50, especially on the switch.  They had it pretty easy coming out and that style was different to what we did against the Pies and others recently.  We let them play on their terms.

But in the last, we didn’t let them have any easy kicks out of d50 and they had few options other than kicking long usually to Max.  It was totally on our terms.

  On 17/07/2023 at 01:31, Macca said:

Re the 2016 GF, I thought that the Doggies took advantage of the then rules & interpretations.  They did nothing illegal as I reckon they just played to the whistle

As for the May incident, Daniher may well have accentuated the contact but from my vantage point (forward pocket 40 metres away) I saw a hefty shove from May

My first reaction was ... "Why do that May?"

Now, you and others can see things differently but I urge people to look at the replay ... 3 minutes into the last quarterI

And our players accentuate contact as well ... Kozzie, Spargo, Clarrie, ANB etc

I'll say it again, aim to be a good team that plays well and is well coached ... do that and you will win

So if you're not a good team, you leave yourself open to being beaten by the grey area rules, umpire interpretations and the like

In other words, take as much doubt out as possible.  Be a 5 goal better team

 

 

Tripping and pushing and holding was never in the forefront until posters started to get the benefit of being able to ask legitimate questions.

  On 17/07/2023 at 03:37, Macca said:

....

Go and umpire the sport yourself ... but you wouldn't last 5 minutes because of the abuse that would come your way

 

I expect I'd be able to handle a lot of abuse because I haven't put you on ignore.

  On 17/07/2023 at 03:34, Watson11 said:

I thought we completely changed it up.  In qtrs 1 to 3 we were content to zone back and left easy kicks for them coming out of our forward 50, especially on the switch.  They had it pretty easy coming out and that style was different to what we did against the Pies and others recently.  We let them play on their terms.

But in the last, we didn’t let them have any easy kicks out of d50 and they had few options other than kicking long usually to Max.  It was totally on our terms.

Yeah good point Watson. We were really allowing them to keep the ball moving by letting them hit the easy targets and allowing the round the back quick handball. We definitely got up in their face much more in the last. No point letting them chip it around and then go.

  On 17/07/2023 at 03:42, sue said:

I expect I'd be able to handle a lot of abuse because I haven't put you on ignore.

I say it to a lot people ... go and umpire if you think you can do it properly

Good money but even at junior level, you'll get abused. It's a toxic environment

I read recently where a 14yo female umpire had been abused and threatened by a 6'2" male.  Try google for the story

Now if it wasn't footy, should that male be charged with an offence?  I say yes whether it's at the footy or not

On this site, an AFL female umpire was called a B and a M by 2 posters here

Is that somehow ok?

I'm starting to sound like Stuie here but his heart was in the right place (apart from all the facepalms!)

  On 16/07/2023 at 01:34, jnrmac said:

Don't forget Melk's Carlton game last year when he took an enormous pack mark against 4 Blues and kicked a goal with 2min left. Gets forgotten because of Kozzie's miracle goal a minute later to win the match. 

… the ball having been fed out to Kozzie by Melksy who was lying under the pack! 🙂

  On 17/07/2023 at 01:57, Jontee said:

As an aside, I have heard the Pope barracks for the Saints.

I think he used to, but then he changed to Brisbane after Fitzroy died, because he likes a resurrection story.

  On 17/07/2023 at 04:04, Macca said:

I say it to a lot people ... go and umpire if you think you can do it properly

Good money but even at junior level, you'll get abused. It's a toxic environment

I read recently where a 14yo female umpire had been abused and threatened by a 6'2" male.  Try google for the story

Now if it wasn't footy, should that male be charged with an offence?  I say yes whether it's at the footy or not

On this site, an AFL female umpire was called a B and a M by 2 posters here

Is that somehow ok?

I'm starting to sound like Stuie here but his heart was in the right place (apart from all the facepalms!)

Of course it is not OK to abuse umpires.    But why do I have to say it 1000 times - I DO NOT THINK UMPIRING IS EASY.  I suspect very few who criticise umpiring think it is easy.   Most of us want the AFL to looks more thoughtfully at rule changes and "interpretations" and avoid the "rule of the week" rather than just pile on individual umpires.  

I note that players vigorously disputing umpire's decisions seems now OK almost all of the time, unlike Round 1.  I presume you would criticise those current decisions?  Unless we know the AFL has issued a directive to now ignore that which they said was so essential for recruiting/retaining more junior umpires, we can ony criticise the umpires for making bad decisions when they ignore it.

  On 17/07/2023 at 04:42, sue said:

Of course it is not OK to abuse umpires.    But why do I have to say it 1000 times

 

What? About female umpires being abused & threatened?

 You should be leading the charge against that type of abuse

1000 times

 

I dont think the umps are nearly as much to blame as the AFL itself and its continual mucking around and rolling agendas.

Used to be a fairly straightforward game....one most 7 yo in the school yard could fathom....   Now...who the f knows the rules from one week to another...

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:18, beelzebub said:

I dont think the umps are nearly as much to blame as the AFL itself and its continual mucking around and rolling agendas.

Used to be a fairly straightforward game....one most 7 yo in the school yard could fathom....   Now...who the f knows the rules from one week to another...

And of course ..... there is "Rule of the week " to take into consideration.

 

( BTW Well done with your score prediction bb ! )

Edited July 17, 20231 yr by Bitter but optimistic

  On 17/07/2023 at 02:42, Macca said:

We've had these discussions before but full time umpires and clearly defined rules with way less grey areas would help enormously

But how do we arrive at clearly defined rules unless we make the game easier to umpire?

And to make things easier we need to play 14 or 15 a side ... but who wants to watch bruise-free football?

AFLX was farcical but that boring version of footy showed us how the game can be umpired without much controversy

Doubt we'll ever see it again

So unfortunately, I don't see much changing at all but with all the flopping & staging, I can see things getting worse

And the error rate is aleady at 2 or 3 out of 10 (that includes non decisions when there could be a decision)

So I see what everyone else sees but have a different reaction because I just see it all as a clusterxxxx

Be the best team and play to your best and then you win ... take the umps out of it as Smith probably did (way back when)

I think you are in for a rude shock Macca. Game will be unrecognizable in 15-20 years time.

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:41, Gawndy the Great said:

I think you are in for a rude shock Macca. Game will be unrecognizable in 15-20 years time.

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:16, Macca said:

What? About female umpires being abused & threatened?

 You should be leading the charge against that type of abuse

1000 times

 

I don't want umpires, male or female, threatened.  

But I'd be interested in you responding to my question to you about the change in dissent ruling during the year.  Who do we criticise when the AFL have not announced a change in the rule? Or are you happy with the apparent change?

  On 15/07/2023 at 05:59, Fork 'em said:

Another reason Underwood is unlistenable.
Saw them enthusiastically embrace at the final siren.

To me it is just the tone of her voice, let alone what she says that soooo grates with me. (I presume she was one of the commentators on ABC- if not apologies to Underwood)

I listen to the footy when I’m at the footy (put one ear piece only so I still get the atmosphere). My normal first choice station is by default the ABC, bit out of habit and because it tends to get the better reception at the G on my little radio. As a backup I have the other footy stations preprogrammed as other options.

When I heard the voice, the tone snd the dribble coming out I auto pilot without thinking switch to another radio station.

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:52, sue said:

I don't want umpires, male or female, threatened.  

But I'd be interested in you responding to my question to you about the change in dissent ruling during the year.  Who do we criticise when the AFL have not announced a change in the rule? Or are you happy with the apparent change?

I'm happy that they have found a happy balance with regards to dissent

And was advocating as much when the dissent issue raised it's ugly head last year

There's a line that can't be crossed and its an arbitrary one

Again, players need to behave themselves ... they are well paid professionals so they need to act like pro's

Right across the board, umpires need to be respected.  It's not just the domain of males anymore

I reckon it's great that we now have female players and female umpires

The males will have to behave themselves

By the way, I set a great example to others ... if we all toned it down, there would be no issue

You should be right behind my way of thinking (and actions)

Accept the impires decision and get on with it

 

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:27, Bitter but optimistic said:

And of course ..... there is "Rule of the week " to take into consideration.

 

( BTW Well done with your score prediction bb ! )

Thanks Uncle Bitters 😉 kind of you to have noticed... 

Two weeks running....going to retire now...lol

  On 17/07/2023 at 06:08, Macca said:

I'm happy that they have found a happy balance with regards to dissent

And was advocating as much when the dissent issue raised it's ugly head last year

There's a line that can't be crossed and its an arbitrary one

Again, players need to behave themselves ... they are well paid professionals so they need to act like pro's

Right across the board, umpires need to be respected.  It's not just the domain of males anymore

I reckon it's great that we now have female players and female umpires

The males will have to behave themselves

By the way, I set a great example to others ... if we all toned it down, there would be no issue

You should be right behind my way of thinking (and actions)

Accept the impires decision and get on with it

 

My strong recollection is that you were all for strict no dissent at all at the start of the year based on wanting to protect junior umpires etc. and criticised me and others for instead wanting the happy balance we seem to now have. Maybe my memory is wrong.  Glad we are in agreement now.

So we must criticise the AFL for not supporting the umpires in their new interpretation since we haven't heard a peep out of the AFL on the subject.

  On 17/07/2023 at 04:04, Macca said:

I say it to a lot people ... go and umpire if you think you can do it properly

Good money but even at junior level, you'll get abused. It's a toxic environment

I read recently where a 14yo female umpire had been abused and threatened by a 6'2" male.  Try google for the story

Now if it wasn't footy, should that male be charged with an offence?  I say yes whether it's at the footy or not

On this site, an AFL female umpire was called a B and a M by 2 posters here

Is that somehow ok?

I'm starting to sound like Stuie here but his heart was in the right place (apart from all the facepalms!)

#gonebutnotforgotten 

  On 17/07/2023 at 04:42, sue said:

Of course it is not OK to abuse umpires.    But why do I have to say it 1000 times - I DO NOT THINK UMPIRING IS EASY.  I suspect very few who criticise umpiring think it is easy.   Most of us want the AFL to looks more thoughtfully at rule changes and "interpretations" and avoid the "rule of the week" rather than just pile on individual umpires.  

I note that players vigorously disputing umpire's decisions seems now OK almost all of the time, unlike Round 1.  I presume you would criticise those current decisions?  Unless we know the AFL has issued a directive to now ignore that which they said was so essential for recruiting/retaining more junior umpires, we can ony criticise the umpires for making bad decisions when they ignore it.

I'm perfectly fine with a general conversation about umpiring decisions it's just frustrating when that's the main talking point in the heat of the moment while watching a game when in my opinion there should be higher priorities.

The dissent rule is a good example of the  rule of the week garbage that is making it harder to watch. We can do without the flavour of the week stuff.

 

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:41, Gawndy the Great said:

I think you are in for a rude shock Macca. Game will be unrecognizable in 15-20 years time.

You might be right but who would watch it?  (Bruise-free AFLX type footy)

  On 17/07/2023 at 06:20, sue said:

Maybe my memory is wrong. 

It is wrong

My attitude to dissent was that frivolous acts should not be punished but obvious dissent should be punished.  And everything inbetween needs to be judged correctly

So get your facts straight and stop twisting my words

Try as you might, you'll never catch me out.  I'm nothing but consistent with my views on all things umpiring

Edited July 17, 20231 yr by Macca

  On 17/07/2023 at 05:27, Bitter but optimistic said:

And of course ..... there is "Rule of the week " to take into consideration.

 

( BTW Well done with your score prediction bb ! )

BBO am I right in saying you were strangely missing after the big win Friday night. I got a fair way through reading the after game posts and couldn't recall reading any of yours?