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For God’s sake, I cannot believe how many Demonlanders are suggesting trading Brayshaw! 🤬 Brayshaw is our ‘culture’!  obviously, many have not watched Gus’s weekly session with Gawn to realise how pop

He is completely different.  Merrett is mainly just outside and has very good skills.  The bloke would compliment our midfield perfectly 

Good player but I'd target Lachie Ash if the rumours are true he wants to move back to Victoria. That dash out of the backline is tantalising...

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1 hour ago, Pollyanna said:

I'm basing this idea on the belief that Viney has re-signed, I can see arguments both ways about that outcome ...

I think my trade is like for like based on 2020 roles - Brayshaw wing-mid and Harmes half-back, although I acknowledge Harmes can be effective in the midfield.

Oliver, Petracca, Viney, Merrett, Langdon.  This means a couple of VDB, Melksham, ANB, Sparrow, Jordon and Baker (and Hannan?) have to play midfield in the 22 and I acknowledge depth does looks a bit thin.  Using Tomlinson in the backline and adding Saad may free Salem or Rivers into the midfield.

I believe that we can't trade our remaining 2020 picks because we traded already pre-traded our 1st this year - that's the rule on future picks and I'm not sure whether the restriction carries over into the next year.  If that is the case then the only trade currency we've got is players or 2021 picks.

Think we can trade our picks. The rule is designed to stop clubs blowing their future in one offseason. 

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Would Brayshaw + future 1st for Merrett work? Perhaps with later pick swaps. I'm hesitant about losing Brayshaw but as others have already touched on Merrett would complement our mids better and would perform more consistently I feel. Can't see Essendon giving him up to be honest but a big bodied mid + first rounder might get them thinking.

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6 minutes ago, Nascent said:

Would Brayshaw + future 1st for Merrett work? Perhaps with later pick swaps. I'm hesitant about losing Brayshaw but as others have already touched on Merrett would complement our mids better and would perform more consistently I feel. Can't see Essendon giving him up to be honest but a big bodied mid + first rounder might get them thinking.

Overs 

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I’m pretty sure the gap between Merrett and Brayshaw isn’t a 1st rounder, even if we do swap later picks. Brayshaw has been played out of position due to being behind Oliver, Petracca & Viney in the guts, so his form doesn’t indicate his trade value unlike a player that has been played in the right position. Surely a 2nd rounder + Brayshaw will get it done.

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3 minutes ago, adonski said:

Overs 

Probably, hence the line "perhaps with later pick swaps."

There could be a few permutations of a deal but say Brayshaw + Future first for Merrett and Future 2nd. Depending on ladder position could just mean sliding back in the draft by 10 spots or so. 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, xman97 said:

I’m pretty sure the gap between Merrett and Brayshaw isn’t a 1st rounder, even if we do swap later picks. Brayshaw has been played out of position due to being behind Oliver, Petracca & Viney in the guts, so his form doesn’t indicate his trade value unlike a player that has been played in the right position. Surely a 2nd rounder + Brayshaw will get it done.

I doubt it, with what Brayshaw has produced over the last 2 years we won't be getting a first rounder for him. His value currently probably lies in the second round in my view. Late first round at best. If Brayshaw = 2nd round pick then I can't see Essendon doing a deal for "2" X second rounders for Merrett, arguably their best player.

Would you take say a Parish and 2nd rounder for either Oliver or Petracca?

Despite all his potential and being played out of position, a club that identifies that isn't going to pay a premium for someone that they would argue can't crack centre bounce midfield time for our team. Our whip hands is that he is contracted for another 2 years so we won't be giving him away, but we always take a holistic approach to drafting and trading and a mutually beneficial outcome might see a deal done if it improves the balance of our team.

Just my thoughts anyway. 

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3 minutes ago, Nascent said:

I doubt it, with what Brayshaw has produced over the last 2 years we won't be getting a first rounder for him. His value currently probably lies in the second round in my view. Late first round at best. If Brayshaw = 2nd round pick then I can't see Essendon doing a deal for "2" X second rounders for Merrett, arguably their best player.

Would you take say a Parish and 2nd rounder for either Oliver or Petracca?

Despite all his potential and being played out of position, a club that identifies that isn't going to pay a premium for someone that they would argue can't crack centre bounce midfield time for our team. Our whip hands is that he is contracted for another 2 years so we won't be giving him away, but we always take a holistic approach to drafting and trading and a mutually beneficial outcome might see a deal done if it improves the balance of our team.

Just my thoughts anyway. 

Unlike Parish, Brayshaw has had one genuinely elite season, I reckon his true value is mid first round to a team prepared to play him as a pure midfielder and let him do what he does best. I do agree that Brayshaw & a second won't pry a contracted Merrett out of Essendon, it's probably a reasonable fair trade, but Essendon can't afford to lose Merrett so won't give him up (yet) unless it's for significant overs.

I would try to trade Brayshaw for the Saints 1st rounder this year, then draft the best outside player personally. 

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2 minutes ago, Nascent said:

I doubt it, with what Brayshaw has produced over the last 2 years we won't be getting a first rounder for him. His value currently probably lies in the second round in my view. Late first round at best. If Brayshaw = 2nd round pick then I can't see Essendon doing a deal for "2" X second rounders for Merrett, arguably their best player.

Would you take say a Parish and 2nd rounder for either Oliver or Petracca?

Despite all his potential and being played out of position, a club that identifies that isn't going to pay a premium for someone that they would argue can't crack centre bounce midfield time for our team. Our whip hands is that he is contracted for another 2 years so we won't be giving him away, but we always take a holistic approach to drafting and trading and a mutually beneficial outcome might see a deal done if it improves the balance of our team.

Just my thoughts anyway. 

I do agree on some of what you're saying. Though, I would rate Brayshaw a very late 1st rounder/very early 2nd (Picks 15-22). He's still only 24 yrs old. Merrett is nearly a year older, so that would come into account a tiny bit. Brayshaw can crack our centre bounce time but is normally 4th banana due to the elite inside mids we have (probably the best inside mids in the comp). He would be in every other teams preferred centre bounce rotations in a heart beat. We have just got so much of an unbalance of spread of talent across the field. Too many of our better players are inside mids. 

In my view:

-Merrett (worth Pick 8-15).

-Brayshaw (worth Pick 15-22).

The difference in my opinion is: 5 to 9 picks. Of course 5 to 9 picks late in the 1st round is valued very high, but it isn't worth more than an early/mid round 2 pick. 

Another way to look at it is, the draft points difference of a pick 8 (Merrett) to 15 (Brayshaw) is equivalent to pick 40, and the difference of a pick 15 to 22 is equivalent to pick 51. Worst case scenario IMO is If Merrett is Pick 8 and Brayshaw Pick 22 (the difference is equivalent to pick 27.

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46 minutes ago, adonski said:

Unlike Parish, Brayshaw has had one genuinely elite season, I reckon his true value is mid first round to a team prepared to play him as a pure midfielder and let him do what he does best. I do agree that Brayshaw & a second won't pry a contracted Merrett out of Essendon, it's probably a reasonable fair trade, but Essendon can't afford to lose Merrett so won't give him up (yet) unless it's for significant overs.

I would try to trade Brayshaw for the Saints 1st rounder this year, then draft the best outside player personally. 

  

Interesting idea, Saints could use another heavy hitter in the middle. I wonder if there is a talent in the mid to late first round of the draft that would see us happy to offload Brayshaw for a pick.

27 minutes ago, xman97 said:

I do agree on some of what you're saying. Though, I would rate Brayshaw a very late 1st rounder/very early 2nd (Picks 15-22). He's still only 24 yrs old. Merrett is nearly a year older, so that would come into account a tiny bit. Brayshaw can crack our centre bounce time but is normally 4th banana due to the elite inside mids we have (probably the best inside mids in the comp). He would be in every other teams preferred centre bounce rotations in a heart beat. We have just got so much of an unbalance of spread of talent across the field. Too many of our better players are inside mids. 

In my view:

-Merrett (worth Pick 8-15).

-Brayshaw (worth Pick 15-22).

The difference in my opinion is: 5 to 9 picks. Of course 5 to 9 picks late in the 1st round is valued very high, but it isn't worth more than an early/mid round 2 pick. 

Another way to look at it is, the draft points difference of a pick 8 (Merrett) to 15 (Brayshaw) is equivalent to pick 40, and the difference of a pick 15 to 22 is equivalent to pick 51. Worst case scenario IMO is If Merrett is Pick 8 and Brayshaw Pick 22 (the difference is equivalent to pick 27.

Fair points from both of you. Particularly agree with the bolded xman. The good thing in our position is we have Brayshaw contracted for another two years so it would have to be a good deal in our eyes to let him go. Ultimately I don't think we'll land Merrett and the speculation consistently, like Hogan, seems to be Freo as the likely suitor. Haven't picked over their list in a while so not sure what could be on offer there. Personally I'd prefer to secure a mature guaranteed best 22 player but trades rarely involve player for player swaps.

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6 minutes ago, Nascent said:

  

Interesting idea, Saints could use another heavy hitter in the middle. I wonder if there is a talent in the mid to late first round of the draft that would see us happy to offload Brayshaw for a pick.

Fair points from both of you. Particularly agree with the bolded xman. The good thing in our position is we have Brayshaw contracted for another two years so it would have to be a good deal in our eyes to let him go. Ultimately I don't think we'll land Merrett and the speculation consistently, like Hogan, seems to be Freo as the likely suitor. Haven't picked over their list in a while so not sure what could be on offer there. Personally I'd prefer to secure a mature guaranteed best 22 player but trades rarely involve player for player swaps.

Archie Perkins is around the 12-15 mark in most draft guides I've seen which ticks the boxes we're looking for  

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On 9/26/2020 at 11:35 AM, Hannibal Inc. said:

Merrett is a gun.  I'd love to get him, but it's obviously unlikely.

His disposal was always exceptional, but it has dropped off recently.  I've seen enough to know it's far from an issue.  A happy mind would fix things pretty quickly.

Brayshaw is an interesting trade proposition.  To get Merrett you'd do it in a heartbeat.  I've not pined over a single player that's left us recently (including Howe), because I've known what you're going to get.  Brayshaw is the one player that would have me nervous.  Why ?  Because I'm not sure what he could become.  He has the natural talent to be elite.  For me it's above the shoulder with Angus.  If the penny ever truly drops he could come back to make you regret trading him.  But for a player of Merrett's quality you'd definitely take the gamble.  With Merrett you're certain what you're getting and he'd add exactly the polish we lack.

This pretty much covers my thoughts on this right now.

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On 9/26/2020 at 10:17 PM, Nascent said:

  

Interesting idea, Saints could use another heavy hitter in the middle. I wonder if there is a talent in the mid to late first round of the draft that would see us happy to offload Brayshaw for a pick.

Fair points from both of you. Particularly agree with the bolded xman. The good thing in our position is we have Brayshaw contracted for another two years so it would have to be a good deal in our eyes to let him go. Ultimately I don't think we'll land Merrett and the speculation consistently, like Hogan, seems to be Freo as the likely suitor. Haven't picked over their list in a while so not sure what could be on offer there. Personally I'd prefer to secure a mature guaranteed best 22 player but trades rarely involve player for player swaps.

If Freo were a trading partner, I wouldn't mind Darcy Tucker coming back the other way...or Hogan.

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On 9/26/2020 at 11:35 AM, Hannibal Inc. said:

Merrett is a gun.  I'd love to get him, but it's obviously unlikely.

His disposal was always exceptional, but it has dropped off recently.  I've seen enough to know it's far from an issue.  A happy mind would fix things pretty quickly.

Brayshaw is an interesting trade proposition.  To get Merrett you'd do it in a heartbeat.  I've not pined over a single player that's left us recently (including Howe), because I've known what you're going to get.  Brayshaw is the one player that would have me nervous.  Why ?  Because I'm not sure what he could become.  He has the natural talent to be elite.  For me it's above the shoulder with Angus.  If the penny ever truly drops he could come back to make you regret trading him.  But for a player of Merrett's quality you'd definitely take the gamble.  With Merrett you're certain what you're getting and he'd add exactly the polish we lack.

 

I'd hypothesise that Merrett's kicking efficiency has gone down as a result of being forced into an inside mid role because they're so lacking in quality inside mids. The same as how Brayshaw's numbers have dropped being played on the outside. Both player's have the potential to have spikes if they swapped because they would both get moved into roles they are more suited for.

That said I have doubts Brayshaw would agree to that deal, I suspect it is Freo or stay. As for Harmes who was mentioned by others, I suspect his long term contract would decrease his trade value in a deal like this. I like Harmes and don't have a problem with his deal for us, but if I was Essendon I wouldn't be so keen.

I like to look at what Essendon want, If Joe leaves there's interest in Ben Brown and North has interest in TMac. If we were able to facilitate a deal where we could offer Essendon Ben, a future first (or Viney compensation should that eventuate) and probably a little more. We might at least get them to the table. We'd need to find who/what Essendon actually wants and exploit it. Of course this is all academic because the chances are slim to none that they'd deal on anything. 

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I really hope the club is trying everything to get him out of Essendon, I think he is a bloody good player and would compliment our other midfielders nicely. It was mentioned on SEN yesterday that he has genuine issues with how Essendon handled his removal from the leadership group. They also mentioned that it was more a watch this space for next year rather than this year because of the contract. But I say let’s try and get him this year.

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On 9/26/2020 at 8:49 PM, Nascent said:

Would Brayshaw + future 1st for Merrett work? Perhaps with later pick swaps. I'm hesitant about losing Brayshaw but as others have already touched on Merrett would complement our mids better and would perform more consistently I feel. Can't see Essendon giving him up to be honest but a big bodied mid + first rounder might get them thinking.

I think a straight swap would be about right but as most clubs over value their players, I can’t see it happening.

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1 hour ago, trout said:

I really hope the club is trying everything to get him out of Essendon, I think he is a bloody good player and would compliment our other midfielders nicely. It was mentioned on SEN yesterday that he has genuine issues with how Essendon handled his removal from the leadership group. They also mentioned that it was more a watch this space for next year rather than this year because of the contract. But I say let’s try and get him this year.

I can’t see Essendon letting him go whilst in contract, I dare say they don’t even entertain offers 

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1 hour ago, Demons11 said:

I can’t see Essendon letting him go whilst in contract, I dare say they don’t even entertain offers 

Yeah your more than likely correct. I would still like us to try and convince Zac  he wants out and put forward fair trade offers for him. Even if Essendon don’t look at them it might at least put uncertainty around him for all of next year. If I was another club I would be doing the same thing with Oliver.

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3 minutes ago, trout said:

Yeah your more than likely correct. I would still like us to try and convince Zac  he wants out and put forward fair trade offers for him. Even if Essendon don’t look at them it might at least put uncertainty around him for all of next year. If I was another club I would be doing the same thing with Oliver.

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I'm not even entertaining this as an option. He is a gun and is exactly the type of midfielder we need to add to our mix, but I can't see it happening. Worst case, we should definitely be sweet talking him for his free agency year, but so will most sides in the comp.

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On 9/27/2020 at 8:56 PM, ChaserJ said:

If Freo were a trading partner, I wouldn't mind Darcy Tucker coming back the other way...or Hogan.

Would love Zac Merrett in our midfield just can't see the Bombers doing it. Although you've got to give something good to get something good back. They are desperate for a big bodied mid.

If I'm dealing with Freo the player I want before he hits the elite levels I think he can is Adam Cerra.

Hayden Young is another in some kind of deal, his ball use and decision making is very good 

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I'd trade Gus and a future first for Merrett. Would Essendon? If we could convince him, I reckon they would.

Edited by A F
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28 minutes ago, A F said:

I'd trade Gus and a future first for Merrett. Would Essendon? If we could convince him, I reckon they would.

I'd want something else in return a 2nd rounder for our 3rd

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