Training Ground?

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,224]

4 minutes ago, mauriesy said:

A decent sized football oval is about 20,000 m2 if you include sufficient area around the perimeter. If you look at the racing club's plan, the ovals they propose in the middle of the track are far wider than the land proposed for the school.

They would actually be crazy to not use these facilities, given they wouldn't have to pay for the construction side just a lease for use. Would give them access to two soccer fields and two AFL fields.... that would be any schools dream.

[Dee Viney Intervention 1,963]

1 hour ago, Grr-owl said:

Princes Park?

Used by Caulfield Bears who play in Southern FNL.  I think Caulfield Park could be a good solution for Caulfield Grammarians to relocate to but you would have to sweeten the deal for them. Not sure that they would want to relocate but I guess everybody has a price. 

Edited December 9 by Dee Viney Intervention

[Fuchsias Forever 55]

It appears that the proposed relocation of the Caulfield Racecourse as a home base was nothing more than a performative exercise orchestrated by the board and CEO. The project seemingly lacked genuine intent, yet the club expended significant time and financial resources on a feasibility study and concept drawings. Was there any consultation with the Caulfield Racecourse Board, particularly given reports that the Mount Scopus agreement has been under negotiation since late 2023.

If the club were genuinely committed to securing a new home base, it is conceivable that any well-informed board member could have foreseen the impracticality of this concept at minimal cost.

The pertinent question, therefore, is whether the former CEO or President breached their fiduciary duties, thereby causing measurable harm to the football club. This matter may warrant closer scrutiny in light of potential continued governance failures.

 

[Oxdee 438]

28 minutes ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Out of curiosity what's the benefit to the racing club of having the MFC in the middle of the track. They're not a charity

I believe they are trying to get outside entities to invest in the new master plan. They won’t be able to fund this themselves. In addition there is push by government to utilise the middle of the track better than it currently is 

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,224]

1 minute ago, Fuchsias Forever said:

It appears that the proposed relocation of the Caulfield Racecourse as a home base was nothing more than a performative exercise orchestrated by the board and CEO. The project seemingly lacked genuine intent, yet the club expended significant time and financial resources on a feasibility study and concept drawings. Was there any consultation with the Caulfield Racecourse Board, particularly given reports that the Mount Scopus agreement has been under negotiation since late 2023.

If the club were genuinely committed to securing a new home base, it is conceivable that any well-informed board member could have foreseen the impracticality of this concept at minimal cost.

The pertinent question, therefore, is whether the former CEO or President breached their fiduciary duties, thereby causing measurable harm to the football club. This matter may warrant closer scrutiny in light of potential continued governance failures.

 

You do realise the project isn't dead right? They are currently working on the funding model.

[joeboy 3,166]

As a matter of interest does anyone know if the MFC has investigated the availability and practicality of the Caulfield Hospital site which Mount Scopus didn’t proceed with?

[Whispering_Jack 30,640]

13 minutes ago, Dee Viney Intervention said:

Used by Caulfield Bears who play in Southern FNL.  I think Caulfield Park could be a good solution for Caulfield Grammarians to relocate to but you would have to sweeten the deal for them. Not sure that they would want to relocate but I guess everybody has a price. 

The Caulfield Bears moved elsewhere6 or 7 years ago and Old Haileybury were given the lease of Princes Park on an annual basis with Ajax Juniors playing there on Sundays. Some people associated with Old Haileybury have voiced their concerns about the size of the ground and distance from their own heartland. 

[whatwhat say what 22,934]

14 minutes ago, Fuchsias Forever said:

It appears that the proposed relocation of the Caulfield Racecourse as a home base was nothing more than a performative exercise orchestrated by the board and CEO. The project seemingly lacked genuine intent, yet the club expended significant time and financial resources on a feasibility study and concept drawings. Was there any consultation with the Caulfield Racecourse Board, particularly given reports that the Mount Scopus agreement has been under negotiation since late 2023.

If the club were genuinely committed to securing a new home base, it is conceivable that any well-informed board member could have foreseen the impracticality of this concept at minimal cost.

The pertinent question, therefore, is whether the former CEO or President breached their fiduciary duties, thereby causing measurable harm to the football club. This matter may warrant closer scrutiny in light of potential continued governance failures.

 

knee jerk, reactionary, and po-faced negative take 

[Elwood 3184 1,338]

14 minutes ago, Fuchsias Forever said:

It appears that the proposed relocation of the Caulfield Racecourse as a home base was nothing more than a performative exercise orchestrated by the board and CEO. The project seemingly lacked genuine intent, yet the club expended significant time and financial resources on a feasibility study and concept drawings. Was there any consultation with the Caulfield Racecourse Board, particularly given reports that the Mount Scopus agreement has been under negotiation since late 2023.

If the club were genuinely committed to securing a new home base, it is conceivable that any well-informed board member could have foreseen the impracticality of this concept at minimal cost.

The pertinent question, therefore, is whether the former CEO or President breached their fiduciary duties, thereby causing measurable harm to the football club. This matter may warrant closer scrutiny in light of potential continued governance failures.

 

Yes - by all means, let's carry out a full and transparent investigation and if it's discovered that what you have written above is complete and utter bulltish, you will make a public apology in front of the members on the opening game of the season.

[DeeSpencer 26,080]

21 minutes ago, joeboy said:

As a matter of interest does anyone know if the MFC has investigated the availability and practicality of the Caulfield Hospital site which Mount Scopus didn’t proceed with?

The Scopus plan was to take over a chunk of the site as a hospital redevelopment shrunk the footprint of medical services. I'd imagine it was based around pretty much taking up what is currently the car parking areas once a new hospital with underground or high rise parking is constructed.

To fit and oval in that area as well as a club facility you'd have to relocate and condense a lot of the hospital facilities, probably more than the school plans and that would be prohibitively expensive. Maybe 100-150 million or more worth of land costs alone.

It's a better location than the race course for the Jewish community so I'd expect they'd have done it if it were feasible, especially if Deakin would take over their Burwood campus.

The least feasible part of the process is getting 500-1Bill to redevelop the hospital with the states current finances. Buying 150 million worth of land for a footy facility doesn't really inspire the government to rebuild a community health/rehab hospital.

 

 

[Damo 3,374]

30 minutes ago, Fuchsias Forever said:

It appears that the proposed relocation of the Caulfield Racecourse as a home base was nothing more than a performative exercise orchestrated by the board and CEO. The project seemingly lacked genuine intent, yet the club expended significant time and financial resources on a feasibility study and concept drawings. Was there any consultation with the Caulfield Racecourse Board, particularly given reports that the Mount Scopus agreement has been under negotiation since late 2023.

If the club were genuinely committed to securing a new home base, it is conceivable that any well-informed board member could have foreseen the impracticality of this concept at minimal cost.

The pertinent question, therefore, is whether the former CEO or President breached their fiduciary duties, thereby causing measurable harm to the football club. This matter may warrant closer scrutiny in light of potential continued governance failures.

 

I agree. Where was the Risk assessment that this might happen? Where was the tested plan and consultation with MRC? The project is well under way, well that is what I hadunderstood. Now it really looks like no one will take responsibility for this seemingly utter stuff up. 

[daisycutter 29,735]

33 minutes ago, joeboy said:

As a matter of interest does anyone know if the MFC has investigated the availability and practicality of the Caulfield Hospital site which Mount Scopus didn’t proceed with?

there are no plans to relocate/vacate the hospital

its availability is zero

[DeeSpencer 26,080]

1 hour ago, Diamond_Jim said:

Out of curiosity what's the benefit to the racing club of having the MFC in the middle of the track. They're not a charity

Its not their land. It's the Caulfield Trusts land and the Caulfield Trust is broke because the racing club leases what they actually genuinely use (track and grand stand area) at a very discount rate.

Having redeveloped their track and booted out all the horse trainers there's no incentive for the racing club to make a genuine offer to pay to use the infield area or precinct 5 (south east former stables earmarked for indoor sports) or 6 (vacant wedge proposed for MFC use).

By far the best use of an open unused space that can't be developed with any height is for sporting ovals/general recreation on non race days.

 

[DeeSpencer 26,080]

30 minutes ago, Whispering_Jack said:

The Caulfield Bears moved elsewhere6 or 7 years ago and Old Haileybury were given the lease of Princes Park on an annual basis with Ajax Juniors playing there on Sundays. Some people associated with Old Haileybury have voiced their concerns about the size of the ground and distance from their own heartland. 

Where's the heartland for a school with campuses in Brighton, Keysborough, Berwick, West Melbourne, Darwin and Tianjin!

[Stu 969]

11 minutes ago, Damo said:

I agree. Where was the Risk assessment that this might happen? Where was the tested plan and consultation with MRC? The project is well under way, well that is what I hadunderstood. Now it really looks like no one will take responsibility for this seemingly utter stuff up. 

I'm not sure if you've read the original update re. Mt Scopus and then commented, but there has been a range of information provided by other posters over the last few hours that should allay yours and @Fuchsias Forever's concerns about the project now being dead in the water. 

[DeeSpencer 26,080]

18 minutes ago, Damo said:

I agree. Where was the Risk assessment that this might happen? Where was the tested plan and consultation with MRC? The project is well under way, well that is what I hadunderstood. Now it really looks like no one will take responsibility for this seemingly utter stuff up. 

What might happen?

The only thing that has happened is land MRC had for sale has been sold to a school not property developers. 

The competition for access to develop and use ovals is and will always be red hot. Perhaps it just got even hotter. Perhaps we just found a mutual beneficiary who will strengthen our case.

 

[Damo 3,374]

6 minutes ago, Stu said:

I'm not sure if you've read the original update re. Mt Scopus and then commented, but there has been a range of information provided by other posters over the last few hours that should allay yours and @Fuchsias Forever's concerns about the project now being dead in the water. 

Please let me know what the actual [censored] range of information is that you are referring to? It was critical that at the start of this investigation, cost and scope of this project that we were to be in close consultation with the MRC. Mt Scopus has guzumped us and no one had it on their radar. Im normally a happy clapper like most of you but in my work I train people how to run projects using IT. But scope costings, research and risk assessment are primary work for a project team. This looks to me as if it is just hope and intention around a couple of beers. As Billy Bob thornton says, hold out one hand for hope and the other for [censored] and see which one fills up first.

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,224]

3 minutes ago, Damo said:

Please let me know what the actual [censored] range of information is that you are referring to? It was critical that at the start of this investigation, cost and scope of this project that we were to be in close consultation with the MRC. Mt Scopus has guzumped us and no one had it on their radar. Im normally a happy clapper like most of you but in my work I train people how to run projects using IT. But scope costings, research and risk assessment are primary work for a project team. This looks to me as if it is just hope and intention around a couple of beers. As Billy Bob thornton says, hold out one hand for hope and the other for [censored] and see which one fills up first.

The Mt Scopus project is for a completely different parcel of land and has nothing to do with what our plans are, other than potentially wanting use of the sports fields potentially being built. They were probably aware of this to some capacity, but wouldn't have been allowed to discuss due to confidentiality.

The club has also been fairly transparent in this, stressing that the feasibility report does not guarantee anything will go ahead given they then have to work out the funding model.

[daisycutter 29,735]

5 minutes ago, Damo said:

Please let me know what the actual [censored] range of information is that you are referring to? It was critical that at the start of this investigation, cost and scope of this project that we were to be in close consultation with the MRC. Mt Scopus has guzumped us and no one had it on their radar. Im normally a happy clapper like most of you but in my work I train people how to run projects using IT. But scope costings, research and risk assessment are primary work for a project team. This looks to me as if it is just hope and intention around a couple of beers. As Billy Bob thornton says, hold out one hand for hope and the other for [censored] and see which one fills up first.

mt scopus is looking at different land to what we are looking at

their's is freehold, ours is crown land under trust

[Dee Viney Intervention 1,963]

1 hour ago, Whispering_Jack said:

The Caulfield Bears moved elsewhere6 or 7 years ago and Old Haileybury were given the lease of Princes Park on an annual basis with Ajax Juniors playing there on Sundays. Some people associated with Old Haileybury have voiced their concerns about the size of the ground and distance from their own heartland. 

Thanks WJ, was unaware they have moved from the “Bear Cave”. Genuinely sad that is the case considering the connection to that ground and history with the Caulfield VFL team back in the day. 

[DeeSpencer 26,080]

9 minutes ago, Damo said:

Please let me know what the actual [censored] range of information is that you are referring to? It was critical that at the start of this investigation, cost and scope of this project that we were to be in close consultation with the MRC. Mt Scopus has guzumped us and no one had it on their radar. Im normally a happy clapper like most of you but in my work I train people how to run projects using IT. But scope costings, research and risk assessment are primary work for a project team. This looks to me as if it is just hope and intention around a couple of beers. As Billy Bob thornton says, hold out one hand for hope and the other for [censored] and see which one fills up first.

Error 1. MRC don’t control the land, Caulfield trust do. We seemingly have a strong relationship with Caulfield trust.

Error 2. Scopus bought land we were never intending to buy. Our wedge of land isn’t impacted by this sale in any large way.

The main complication here is more competiton to be the developer/controller/anchor tenant of the planned ovals. 

That comes down to relationships with the Caulfield trust, the local council (who will likely assume responsibility for community access/use) and any local sporting clubs including the large and influential Ajax footy club.

Im generally a pessimist and expect the competition for the ovals to be incredibly fierce with Scopus next door. But it was never going to be easy and no one ever expected it was. 

[Deeko2 844]

Its marked pretty clearly within our feasibility study that the land we're interested in for our base isn't the freehold land.

Feasibility study complete | Creating our home

You can wander down to the image of the layout and you will see the freehold land the school has purchased.  Definitely doesn't impact us.

 

 

[Damo 3,374]

We cant just have ovals, which now look compromised in design. We need offices which I had read were going to be in the accessible land on Booran Rd. There is/was no plan for them to be inside the track IMV for many reasons. One reason being you cannot use public land for offices. Second reason is accessibility. Its a small entrance to get inside the track. But Im not going to argue. Im just very disappointed but not surprised.

[DistrACTION Jackson 9,224]

3 minutes ago, Damo said:

We cant just have ovals, which now look compromised in design. We need offices which I had read were going to be in the accessible land on Booran Rd. There is/was no plan for them to be inside the track IMV for many reasons. One reason being you cannot use public land for offices. Second reason is accessibility. Its a small entrance to get inside the track. But Im not going to argue. Im just very disappointed but not surprised.

But this is what everyone is trying to explain, where the school would be built isn't taking away this area for our administration offices. You seem to be purposely ignoring what everyone is saying?

[No. 31 1,306]

The Scopus purchase rather than property developers doesn't really effect what the Demons are trying to do at the Caulfield RC. One possible impact is Scopus pushing for use of one or both of the ovals. There is also the Glen Huntly public oval that can play a role too. A regime of use to satisfy all could be still feasible given that the Dees still intend on using Casey into the future as well.

Caulfield Bears now play at Koornang Park in Carnegie (near where the 67 tram terminates).

Edited December 10 by No. 31