On 22/10/2020 at 20:00, Better days ahead said:

SEN (i think) reported the club offered $500k which is unders imv. Brown hasn't committed and will talk to Essendon and Freo. You'd think the bombers will throw money at him because they're desperate so we will have to up our offer.

TMac has to go to free up cap. If we have to pay half his salary next year so be it.

Brown will go where the money is. 

  On 22/10/2020 at 20:27, Half forward flank said:

Brown will go where the money is. 

I think we have to be in the ball park salary wise.  We’re a good option from a footy perspective especially compared to the bombers and Freo but he has a wife and family and it’s a short career.

IF we’re competitive with our offer then he should come to us. If his decision is solely based on money then we’re better off without him. I really hope that’s not the case because imv he could make a huge difference for us.

  On 22/10/2020 at 20:35, Better days ahead said:

I think we have to be in the ball park salary wise.  We’re a good option from a footy perspective especially compared to the bombers and Freo but he has a wife and family and it’s a short career.

IF we’re competitive with our offer then he should come to us. If his decision is solely based on money then we’re better off without him. I really hope that’s not the case because imv he could make a huge difference for us.

He made a massive error not taking Norths big $$$ last year. This year got involved in Club/Board politics.

  On 22/10/2020 at 13:07, Die Hard Demon said:

Can someone please explain to me how the heck we are struggling to fit Ben Brown within our salary cap? We must have a side full of superstars..... fmd

We are paying two defenders (May/Lever) about 11-12% of our salary cap; one who is earning his keep and one who isn't.  Add TMac and our salary profile is skewed.  All 3 have at least 2 years on their contracts so our salary cap is burdened for a few more years.

We also need to re-sign Salem, Oliver, Brayshaw, Weideman, Gawn in the next year or two so we need to keep space in the sal cap for them. 

And we have some expensive players who probably aren't best 22 eg Tomlinson couldn't hold down the job he was brought in to do, was dropped, came back in defence and may be out of the team again when Petty comes back.  Even if Tomlinson stays in the team it is clear we have a disproportionate amount of the sal cap invested in the backline.

If Brown wants 3/4 years and we don't move out TMac, they and Lever and May will take up about 20% of our salary cap for at least 2 more years. 

We are trading players out and will delist some but they are fringe players so probably don't give us enough sal cap space for Brown and others.

In a nutshell we have too much of our sal cap invested in too few players some of whom are nowhere near our best players/earning their packages.

Edited October 22, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

Can he chop out in the Ruck? 

  On 22/10/2020 at 13:07, Die Hard Demon said:

Can someone please explain to me how the heck we are struggling to fit Ben Brown within our salary cap? We must have a side full of superstars..... fmd

We have 3 of the top 10 players in the league (champion data)

We paid overs to extract May and Lever and I assume Langdon and Tomlinson to a lesser extent.

We unfortunately triggered contracts on TMac, Brayshaw and Harmes and peak form that we have not seen since.

We have kept fringe players too long on deals too good (hence the clear out this year I anticipate).

 

  On 22/10/2020 at 21:29, big_red_fire_engine said:

We have 3 of the top 10 players in the league (champion data)

We paid overs to extract May and Lever and I assume Langdon and Tomlinson to a lesser extent.

We unfortunately triggered contracts on TMac, Brayshaw and Harmes and peak form that we have not seen since.

We have kept fringe players too long on deals too good (hence the clear out this year I anticipate).

 

Mismanagement.   TMac, harmes and Brayshaw reads very badly.

Deceipt                     Selling Tomlinson to Members as a wingman.

Mis-judgement        Lever

  On 22/10/2020 at 21:29, big_red_fire_engine said:

We have 3 of the top 10 players in the league (champion data)

We paid overs to extract May and Lever and I assume Langdon and Tomlinson to a lesser extent.

We unfortunately triggered contracts on TMac, Brayshaw and Harmes and peak form that we have not seen since.

We have kept fringe players too long on deals too good (hence the clear out this year I anticipate).

 

I don’t think we would have over paid Langdon and Tomlinson.   They would be  on good wages but nothing extraordinary I wouldn’t have thought.  

  On 22/10/2020 at 20:27, Half forward flank said:

Brown will go where the money is. 

Which won’t be us. We need to get TMac back to some level of fitness, whilst developing Jackson and Weideman.

  On 22/10/2020 at 21:09, Deeminion said:

Can he chop out in the Ruck? 

Yeah, but gets pushed off the ball quite easily . . .

 

 

  On 22/10/2020 at 21:51, Demons11 said:

I don’t think we would have over paid Langdon and Tomlinson.   They would be  on good wages but nothing extraordinary I wouldn’t have thought.  

It was reported at the time Tomlinson's contract was about $500k pa. 

For the giants to get a 2nd round FA comp pick our package had to be well above average.  Given the AFL average was about $380k pa it is reasonable to think Tomlinson would be on at least the mid $400's. 

Edited October 22, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

An additional thought on our tight sal cap especially as it relates to TMac.  He would be on a contract where he is paid whether he plays on not.  A number of our 'lesser' players (and draftees) are on contracts that include payments per match played.  So if TMac doesn't play his replacement could cost us double.  

I would guess this also applies to Tomlinson, Jones, Jetta, AvB and maybe a few others.  They can all hurt the sal cap if they don't play.

Of course players and their managers love these contracts but it means the club carries the risk. 

Edited October 22, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

  On 22/10/2020 at 07:06, Half forward flank said:

Offical. Ben brown has someone running his life and has changed priorities.. More interested in being a PC warrior than just doing his job as a player. Not just letting the player into the Club.

 

So there's a dysfunctional relationship between NMFC and Ben Brown?

Take a good look at NMFC right now and tell me which one is likely to be dysfunctional.

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:37, Pollyanna said:

 

So there's a dysfunctional relationship between NMFC and Ben Brown?

Take a good look at NMFC right now and tell me which one is likely to be dysfunctional.

Sorry, but it is both. Brown got involved in Board politics and other......

  On 22/10/2020 at 20:27, Half forward flank said:

Brown will go where the money is. 

Not necessarily true. If rumours are to be believed, he is having issues with North Melbourne and it has nothing to do with money. He may look at a club where he feels to be a good cultural fit, one where the coaches will support him and his family. There’s a group of young dads at the club who may make him feel welcomed. There are a few “alternative” players who he may click with, as he’s a bit different to your traditional meat head footballer. 
Brown and his wife strike me as a couple who cares about more than money. I may be totally wrong, but that is the vibe I get from what I’ve heard about them. 
Besides, losing a baby can have a profound impact on you and none of us can judge someone who may want a change of scenery after something like that. 

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:50, Jaded said:

Not necessarily true. If rumours are to be believed, he is having issues with North Melbourne and it has nothing to do with money. He may look at a club where he feels to be a good cultural fit, one where the coaches will support him and his family. There’s a group of young dads at the club who may make him feel welcomed. There are a few “alternative” players who he may click with, as he’s a bit different to your traditional meat head footballer. 
Brown and his wife strike me as a couple who cares about more than money. I may be totally wrong, but that is the vibe I get from what I’ve heard about them. 
Besides, losing a baby can have a profound impact on you and none of us can judge someone who may want a change of scenery after something like that. 

Knocking back four years at 750 and wanting more. tells us they are a couple that very much care about money. Nothing wrong with that but let us stick to the facts. 

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:46, Half forward flank said:

Sorry, but it is both. Brown got involved in Board politics and other......

Who gives a toss. He’ll come to us on good coin and bag 40plus goals and all will be right with the world. Of course we paid overs to recruit players, all clubs do, it’s what drives player movement. Lever makes our backline far better and will continue to improve. Tomlinson will find a place in our best 22 and is certainly better than what some on here think. As for Brayshaw, TMac and Harmes, one finished 3rd in the Brownlow, one kicked us into a prelim final and the other was one of our leading players in 2018. What exactly do you propose the club should of done differently. Offered them 2 year contracts on low money??

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:54, Half forward flank said:

Knocking back four years at 750 and wanting more. tells us they are a couple that very much care about money. Nothing wrong with that but let us stick to the facts. 

Nothing to do with his manager of course. You write history to suit your narrative. Life sucks when that’s your narrative 

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:56, Roost it far said:

Nothing to do with his manager of course. You write history to suit your narrative. Life sucks when that’s your narrative 

Brown and wife want to be known as an educated independent thinking couple. It is their decision to weigh up the merits of a contract. 

Are some demons supporters so fragile that you need to defend the actions of an opposition player, just on the basis that we have some interest in acquiring him. I am saying he comes with baggage. Time will tell if that effects his career if we get him. In the meantime you and the others can continue to bury your head in the sand and say, jackpot every time a player is linked with the Club, and in this case one we may not of needed if the Club had not stuffed up on a contract for Tmac and his body shape. Pathetic.

  On 22/10/2020 at 22:08, Lucifer's Hero said:

It was reported at the time Tomlinson's contract was about $500k pa. 

For the giants to get a 2nd round FA comp pick our package had to be well above average.  Given the AFL average was about $380k pa it is reasonable to think Tomlinson would be on at least the mid $400's. 

I didn’t actually mention the average.  You’d expect a best 22 player player to be on around 500, which I don’t think is overs 

  On 22/10/2020 at 23:05, Half forward flank said:

Brown and wife want to be known as an educated independent thinking couple. It is their decision to weigh up the merits of a contract. 

Are some demons supporters so fragile that you need to defend the actions of an opposition player, just on the basis that we have some interest in acquiring him. I am saying he comes with baggage. Time will tell if that effects his career if we get him. In the meantime you and the others can continue to bury your head in the sand and say, jackpot every time a player is linked with the Club, and in this case one we may not of needed if the Club had not stuffed up on a contract for Tmac and his body shape. Pathetic.

I couldn’t care less if we get brown or not that’s not my point, unsurprisingly you’ve missed my point. 

  On 22/10/2020 at 23:09, Demons11 said:

I didn’t actually mention the average.  You’d expect a best 22 player player to be on around 500, which I don’t think is overs 

Using 'average' was my way of giving a reference point to Tomlinson's package. 

I guess I have a different view on Tomlinson being a best 22 when Petty returns and if we get Brown/Smith.  Especially as he still has 3 years to run on his contract.  

If we paid all our best 22 around $500k we would blow our sal cap by quite a few million.

Edited October 22, 20204 yr by Lucifer's Hero

  On 22/10/2020 at 02:34, Pollyanna said:

I understand your reservations with Brown, Weid, Jackson and Fritsch in the forward line.

If Brown doesn’t come where do you see Petty playing next year?  I like him back in place of Tomlinson and I know you're not Tomlinson fan.  If Brown comes then Petty can definitely play back. 

I think Brown and Weid can work together, it's not really any different to the previously planned TMac and Weid.  If Jackson and Fritsch are there too then we have to get crumbiing and pressure from the other forward - Pickett and ???

Of course I'd love that to be Viney but concede that's unlikely.  I think we need to trade in a pressure forward if we get Brown.

All this talk about not being able to fit Weeds, Brown, LJ and Fritsch into our side works in our favour. Lets face it Blokes have been gifted games for far too long on average form. Let them fight for a spot in the side for a change and see who wants it more. The actual bloke most under pressure from all this would be Melksham!!

Hnmm fight for a spot, immediately makes us better , much much better!!

Guys. It's all about posturing. The dees know NMFC want our pick 23. They have offered a modest low ball offer $$$ in a hope north pay some of his salary, just as we are trying to do with Tmac to move him on. 

The cash is there if we move the below players on. 

ANB - $350K

TMAC - $800K

OMAC - $300K

HANNAN - $250K

PRUESS - $350K

it's a game of who blinks first

 

  On 22/10/2020 at 23:17, Roost it far said:

I couldn’t care less if we get brown or not that’s not my point, unsurprisingly you’ve missed my point. 

Go argue with someone else. i could not care less about you if you are going to be arrogant.