Mitch at the Cats

[Elusive Tunbridge 795]

Maybe Crossy feels like he owes the club something for giving him a contract, and he is repaying that by training his arse off and playing selfless football.

I think Crossy is just doing what he does, and did at Footscray. Apparently he wants a career in football beyond retirement, and he's making every post a winner in that pursuit. I'm sure he's grateful to MFC for giving him the chance, but there's also enlightened self-interest operating there.

[Bombay Airconditioning 6,369]

I think Crossy is just doing what he does, and did at Footscray. Apparently he wants a career in football beyond retirement, and he's making every post a winner in that pursuit. I'm sure he's grateful to MFC for giving him the chance, but there's also enlightened self-interest operating there.

Surely there's a role for Cross somewhere at Casey.

[monoccular 17,417]

'Macca', I have no problem with Clark moving on but I do have a big problem with him using the depression card. He did so many people a disservice with that one.

An insult to anyone struggling with depression to try that one on.

This might have nothing to do with it, but when Trengove nearly was traded to Richmond before his foot injury to me that seems like Roos is after a solid durable team. If he was willing to trade Trenners I have no doubt Mitch could have been in the same boat and they did what they could to ensure we get something in return. If the media and teams caught wind we didn't want him, clubs could have played hard ball.

..or boot?

[chook fowler 19,447]

Depression should never be an excuse for bad behaviour or character flaws.

The result is genuine people with depression get unfairly judged.

[Moonshadow 17,675]

Not sure we're ever going to know the full story or be able to call judgement on what decisions he or the club have made. Who's never made a decision that has caused some pain? The media and social media can be harsh critics, albeit sometimes self inflicted. Better to let it go and enjoy the positives of the deal, ie, HL.

[Alcho Dee 269]

In my circles depression is not looked upon well, it's like playing the soft card or throwing in the towel. A typical response when depression is mentioned if talking about someone is "give him a cup of concrete"

I think we have all been through hard times and anyone of us could give into it.

Sometimes it can be seen as someone only caring about themselves instead of caring about others.

Let's be honest, Clark going to Geelong is never going to sit well with the majority of Melbourne supporters.

[rjay 24,898]

In my circles depression is not looked upon well, it's like playing the soft card or throwing in the towel. A typical response when depression is mentioned if talking about someone is "give him a cup of concrete"

I think we have all been through hard times and anyone of us could give into it.

Sometimes it can be seen as someone only caring about themselves instead of caring about others.

Let's be honest, Clark going to Geelong is never going to sit well with the majority of Melbourne supporters.

You are way off track here and have no idea what you are talking about.

[Alcho Dee 269]

You are way off track here and have no idea what you are talking about.

So what's your view on it and how have you responded when someone you know has depression. Edited January 20, 2015 by J VINEY FAN

[Alcho Dee 269]

You are way off track here and have no idea what you are talking about.

Let me guess, put them straight on a heavy dose of anti-depressants.....

[Wilbur 447]

http://www.beyondblue.org.au/

[Salems Lot 2,493]

Let me guess, put them straight on a heavy dose of anti-depressants.....

You should really stop this line; it makes you appear extremely ill informed. This is a football forum; I suggest keeping it on that subject matter

[Arrow 1,257]

In my circles depression is not looked upon well, it's like playing the soft card or throwing in the towel. A typical response when depression is mentioned if talking about someone is "give him a cup of concrete"

I think we have all been through hard times and anyone of us could give into it.

Sometimes it can be seen as someone only caring about themselves instead of caring about others.

Let's be honest, Clark going to Geelong is never going to sit well with the majority of Melbourne supporters.

I'll give you a tip for life. If the circle of people you hang around with think beating depressing requires a bucket of cement, it'd be in your best interests to find a new circle.

Depression is an illness affecting and potentially killing as many people as cancer and there's a large chance it affects many people in your own group that you probably treat with the exact attitude that only exacerbates their own feelings. Read up and you might save someone's life

[nutbean 8,838]

I'm not sure why we must connect Mitch's depression issues with his ultimate decision.

Like most, I have had people close to me suffer from depression and I wish Mitch all the best on his recovery.

Like most, I struggle with the decisions he made and behaviors around the decision. I am not a mental health professional but I cannot agree with the advice he was given. The number one driver for him leaving being a "fresh start" doesn't sit well with me. I could agree with this logic if our club was the rabble it had been under the likes of CS but the MFC from a "health" perspective has never been in a better place and is moving forward. It could almost be considered a new club. AFL is a pressure cooker and it wont be any easier at Geelong where I believe the pressure to perform will be greater than it may have been at the MFC.

For these reasons I wish Mitch well for his ongoing recovery from his health issues and at the same time say that the decisions you have made surrounding you future will forever be a stain on your reputation.

Edited January 20, 2015 by nutbean

[nutbean 8,838]

I think we have all been through hard times and anyone of us could give into it.

If this is your idea of depression then I think further education is required.

[jnrmac 20,055]

You are way off track here and have no idea what you are talking about.

He talked about 'his circles'. What would you know about his circles?

[stuie 7,374]

I'm not sure why we must connect Mitch's depression issues with his ultimate decision.

Like most, I have had people close to me suffer from depression and I wish Mitch all the best on his recovery.

Like most, I struggle with the decisions he made and behaviors around the decision. I am not a mental health professional but I cannot agree with the advice he was given. The number one driver for him leaving being a "fresh start" doesn't sit well with me. I could agree with this logic if our club was the rabble it had been under the likes of CS but the MFC from a "health" perspective has never been in a better place and is moving forward. It could almost be considered a new club. AFL is a pressure cooker and it wont be any easier at Geelong where I believe the pressure to perform will be greater than it may have been at the MFC.

For these reasons I wish Mitch well for his ongoing recovery from his health issues and at the same time say that the decisions you have made surrounding you future will forever be a stain on your reputation.

From what I've heard and read, the "fresh start" approach is a common treatment and is not about the current environment being a bad one, it's about removing yourself from the surroundings you were in when you had depression. So they're not saying it's a matter of saying MFC and it's performances contributing to it, they're saying let's take the person out of the surroundings that hold the memories of that time.

Can't understand how you seemingly sympathise with his condition, and then say his decisions will "stain his reputation".

[nutbean 8,838]

From what I've heard and read, the "fresh start" approach is a common treatment and is not about the current environment being a bad one, it's about removing yourself from the surroundings you were in when you had depression. So they're not saying it's a matter of saying MFC and it's performances contributing to it, they're saying let's take the person out of the surroundings that hold the memories of that time.

Can't understand how you seemingly sympathise with his condition, and then say his decisions will "stain his reputation".

I get the fresh start but I don't agree that it is a fresh start. Football clubs are football clubs - to me it is the GAME that is environment that should be questioned in regard to Mitch's illness not the CLUB. It is the GAME that is the pressure cooker with the sometime unhealthy expectation of supporters not the CLUB.

As I said, if it was going back to the Neeld/Schwab club then I also understand that - but how many times have we heard from players under the Roos/Jackson structure about it being a new club heading in a positive direction. This can only be a good environment to be in.

If the fresh start was to move from AFL to playing local footy then I get that.

He has already had his first setback with a calf injury. He has mentioned the contribution injuries and inability to get on the ground and earn his keep had on his illness. Yet has he taken himself out of that environment ? The rigors of training at the highest level combined with his body caused his injuries not the club. So if his body continues to fail him at this level - is that good for his recovery ?

Maybe I will retreat from "stained reputation" statement and just say that I disagree with his decisions and to the non professional understand why there is a far bit of angst as to the way this has transpired.

(I havent even touched on his manager apparently shopping him around without the knowledge of the club whilst the club is doing everything in its power to help him get fit and healthy again)

[stuie 7,374]

I get the fresh start but I don't agree that it is a fresh start. Football clubs are football clubs - to me it is the GAME that is environment that should be questioned in regard to Mitch's illness not the CLUB. It is the GAME that is the pressure cooker with the sometime unhealthy expectation of supporters not the CLUB.

As I said, if it was going back to the Neeld/Schwab club then I also understand that - but how many times have we heard from players under the Roos/Jackson structure about it being a new club heading in a positive direction. This can only be a good environment to be in.

If the fresh start was to move from AFL to playing local footy then I get that.

He has already had his first setback with a calf injury. He has mentioned the contribution injuries and inability to get on the ground and earn his keep had on his illness. Yet has he taken himself out of that environment ? The rigors of training at the highest level combined with his body caused his injuries not the club. So if his body continues to fail him at this level - is that good for his recovery ?

Maybe I will retreat from "stained reputation" statement and just say that I disagree with his decisions and to the non professional understand why there is a far bit of angst as to the way this has transpired.

(I havent even touched on his manager apparently shopping him around without the knowledge of the club whilst the club is doing everything in its power to help him get fit and healthy again)

You missed the whole point and went back to your original point.

The point of the treatment is to change the specific surroundings associated with the period of time when his depression was worst. They're not saying the club caused it, Neeld caused it, Schwab caused it etc etc, so there's no point talking about any of that. They're saying change the surroundings so the memories associated with the particular environment are no longer triggered on a daily basis.

I'll take the doctor's opinion over a bunch of jilted lovers on Demonland who in this very thread have show the maturity level they're capable of.

[Dr John Dee 1,057]

You missed the whole point and went back to your original point.

The point of the treatment is to change the specific surroundings associated with the period of time when his depression was worst. They're not saying the club caused it, Neeld caused it, Schwab caused it etc etc, so there's no point talking about any of that. They're saying change the surroundings so the memories associated with the particular environment are no longer triggered on a daily basis.

I'll take the doctor's opinion over a bunch of jilted lovers on Demonland who in this very thread have show the maturity level they're capable of.

Who are they?

Which doctor?

[nutbean 8,838]

You missed the whole point and went back to your original point.

The point of the treatment is to change the specific surroundings associated with the period of time when his depression was worst. They're not saying the club caused it, Neeld caused it, Schwab caused it etc etc, so there's no point talking about any of that. They're saying change the surroundings so the memories associated with the particular environment are no longer triggered on a daily basis.

I'll take the doctor's opinion over a bunch of jilted lovers on Demonland who in this very thread have show the maturity level they're capable of.

I haven't missed point at all.

The point I am making is my questioning of the specific surrounding associated with period of time when the depression was the worst. The point I am making is to me the most important specific surrounding is the AFL football field and all that is required to constantly play the game.

I had this very discussion with a couple of health professionals and whilst they made the disclaimer of not having talked to Mitch, they both suggested that whilst you cannot discount how being in a constant losing environment will have an impact, that having a body that is failing to stand up to the demands of AFL football and not being able to get on the park and taking money for nothing (in Mitch's own words) is the biggest trigger to his illness and this will not dissipate by moving clubs.

You will note that I have not been vitriolic in my posts regarding Clark as it is very complex. Playing in a fresh successful club will ultimately be better for your mental health but ( apparently) it was not the constant losing or the club that was the catalyst for his illness.

As to taking the Doctors opinions - give these same parameters to three doctors and you will probably get three different courses of action.

(Stuie - I get that the "fresh start" is part of the treatment - to me though it has only addressed a small part of the issue and I can't see this move ending up happily - preseason training and injury has already struck and they are not even up to full body contact or match conditions. For Mitch's sake I hope I am wrong)

Edited January 20, 2015 by nutbean

[binman 42,759]

Which doctor?

An unfair characterization of psychologists and psychiatrists

[stuie 7,374]

I haven't missed point at all.

The point I am making is my questioning of the specific surrounding associated with period of time when the depression was the worst. The point I am making is to me the most important specific surrounding is the AFL football field and all that is required to constantly play the game.

I had this very discussion with a couple of health professionals and whilst they made the disclaimer of not having talked to Mitch, they both suggested that whilst you cannot discount how being in a constant losing environment will have an impact, that having a body that is failing to stand up to the demands of AFL football and not being able to get on the park and taking money for nothing (in Mitch's own words) is the biggest trigger to his illness and this will not dissipate by moving clubs.

You will note that I have not been vitriolic in my posts regarding Clark as it is very complex. Playing in a fresh successful club will ultimately be better for your mental health but ( apparently) it was not the constant losing or the club that was the catalyst for his illness.

As to taking the Doctors opinions - give these same parameters to three doctors and you will probably get three different courses of action.

Ok, you missed the point again.

I'm talking about the physical surroundings, the particular places, not the general environment of an AFL club.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

You missed the whole point and went back to your original point.

The point of the treatment is to change the specific surroundings associated with the period of time when his depression was worst. They're not saying the club caused it, Neeld caused it, Schwab caused it etc etc, so there's no point talking about any of that. They're saying change the surroundings so the memories associated with the particular environment are no longer triggered on a daily basis.

I'll take the doctor's opinion over a bunch of jilted lovers on Demonland who in this very thread have show the maturity level they're capable of.

While I am not alone, I have been associated with clinical depression, via a member of my family. While changing the environment that was prevalent with the onset of depression is a great idea, you don't ditch the very support networks that gave so much time, effort and care to a valued member of the "family". It is not a debt that is owed, but rather a sense of knowing you had people around you for a considerable period, who cared about you.

That's all I'll say on that topic. Of course, any even handed person would wish Mitch well, into the future, but in recovery, let's hope he does not forget those who supported him so strongly in the past.

[stuie 7,374]

While I am not alone, I have been associated with clinical depression, via a member of my family. While changing the environment that was prevalent with the onset of depression is a great idea, you don't ditch the very support networks that gave so much time, effort and care to a valued member of the "family". It is not a debt that is owed, but rather a sense of knowing you had people around you for a considerable period, who cared about you.

That's all I'll say on that topic. Of course, any even handed person would wish Mitch well, into the future, but in recovery, let's hope he does not forget those who supported him so strongly in the past.

He's still mates with the players, has the same doctor, and the same family. Not sure why you would think that would change.

[iv'a worn smith 1,979]

He's still mates with the players, has the same doctor, and the same family. Not sure why you would think that would change.

Did I say that? Yes he has the same Doctor. A Doctor provided to him by the MFC.

Edited January 20, 2015 by iv'a worn smith