How's that?

Because finishing last means you performed worse than every other team in that season, and that is bad.

Players have every right to seek the best possible deal for themselves as this is their career, and for many of them the only major source of income they are ever likely to receive.

Take emotion out of it, from a business point of view they would be silly not to try to sell themselves to the highest bidder.

Every time they step out on the field they are literally risking their necks for the jumper, so the least we can do as supporters is not question their loyalty when it's contract negotiation time.

Loyalty is a romantic notion, but that's all.

At the point of really couldn't give two shits one way or the other. He stays - awesome we have a solid tall defender who can swing forward when needed. if he leaves for greener pastures who could blame him, I couldn't. We get compensated with what should be an adequate draft pick (early first round) which for the first time in a longtime doesn't feel like it will be squandered. If the rumours of potentially luring Cameron or Shiel are true, we may well be better off losing him but I'm an old school loyal type and I think the spud farmers are too and he wouldn't be leaving lightly. It would be a massive life choice for him, stay for the benefit of being a one club player and seeing the good times after the crap or jump ship and land on the coat tails of others. I'd stay but that's me - other blokes have successfully changed allegiances for success and are very well received universally. As I said at the start if he stays great, if he leaves - good luck to him and I have faith in Roos and co to deliver replacements

what he said

Can't blame Frawley if he departs to a better resourced club that plays finals regularly and even wins flags.

I hope he stays at the right price which is obviously not $800,000 a year.

"Don't it always seem to go

That you don't know what you've got
Till it's gone"

Quality key defenders are both hard to find and essential to sustained success which is borne out by the teams reportedly pursuing Frawley which seem to include Hawthorn, Geelong, Sydney and Collingwood who between them have won 8 of the past 9 flags. To me that says something.

Players have every right to seek the best possible deal for themselves as this is their career, and for many of them the only major source of income they are ever likely to receive.

Take emotion out of it, from a business point of view they would be silly not to try to sell themselves to the highest bidder.

Every time they step out on the field they are literally risking their necks for the jumper, so the least we can do as supporters is not question their loyalty when it's contract negotiation time.

Loyalty is a romantic notion, but that's all.

maybe.....but "take emotion out of it" and you have no demonland

and where does that leave many fans? next we will see fans changing clubs every season or so

is that what we want? (rhetorical question)

The lower we finish, the more likely Chip will go (or be encouraged to go). It is certainly unlikely Melbourne will go anywhere near an extravagant offer.

Because finishing last means you performed worse than every other team in that season, and that is bad.

Oh noes! Finishing last instead of third last.

What a disaster...

Interesting though when you look at the Pies talls and compare them to ours. We need a Frawley type far more than them.

Cloke, Reid, Brown, Frost, White, Keefe, Lynch and Hogan, Dawes, Tom Mac, Pederson and Dunn.

Hopefully a few clubs will continue a bidding war for frawley which will give him a much better return for playing for them and will maximise the possible depletion of at least one of these sides salary caps and we get an early draft pick replacement which we trade to GWS for a disgruntled talented giant. win, win, win, win situation.

Some people hold this club to such a low standard.i know we don't have the best list going around but when did the possibility of winning the spoon become such an acceptable thing?

maybe.....but "take emotion out of it" and you have no demonland

and where does that leave many fans? next we will see fans changing clubs every season or so

is that what we want? (rhetorical question)

I think what is not fully appreciated on here is there are two different sets of expectations - one, being us supporters and the other being the players. And many posters place ( or misplace) the emotional side of the equation back onto players.

We, the fans, do bleed "red and blue" - we PAY for the privilege to see our team play and our loyalty ( for most) is set in concrete.

The players on the other hand are professional athletes with limited career lifespans and in the main they are loyal to the team and teamates whilst they are contracted ( some have pointed out that Scully had departed mentally the year before he left). But the decision to continue to play for a club weighs up this loyalty against two major factors being finances and team success.

So when I hear that a player delaying a contract has such a huge impact - it is,in my opinion, only something that leaves a bad taste in supporters mouths. Teamates understand the system and decisions that need to be made as to their futures, as do the administrators. I don't think it matters in the slightest to the teamates. The only person that can be affected is the player himself.

I have seen claims that Frawley delaying his contract is a bad look for club and he is carrying himself poorly both on and off the field. Roos himself has said - welcome to the world of free agency, its the players right to do exactly what Frawley is doing - he gets it. Roos has said that Frawley has been ok both on and off the field. The only people who are really affected by this prolonged contract situation is we, the supporters.

The only thing I will say is that Frawley not being too clever should have been coached by his manager to say the following when his contract was mentioned the first time and every subsequent time - " I will not be making a decision until I am ready - this is something between myself and the club and I won't discuss it any further". As much as this would still infuriate supporters I think that this is what he should say.

Some people hold this club to such a low standard.i know we don't have the best list going around but when did the possibility of winning the spoon become such an acceptable thing?

sweet dee have you given up on Benell coming home? I'm with you. I'd hate for the dees to get the spoon. St Kilda or GWS can have it! I can only assume we will be going all out to beat both GWS and Lions and if we bring our game and intensity and one of the Hawks, Roos or Wet Coke don't we are a chance of snagging another win on top.

Wouldn't it be great to beat two hoodoos in one go in the last round. Beat North at ES, with Hogan kicking a bag.

I never wanted Bennell to come home, that was just a g up to another poster on here but they never took the bait. Oh well.

The only 2 winnable ones left IMO is the GWS and the brizy game. Can't see us winning in Paterson, we never beat north and we also have the hawks. I can see us snagging at least one of our winnable games and can't see Brisbane or GWS winning 2 more each that would be necessary to relegate us to stone cold last.

"sweet dee" Love it. Highlights your gentle disposition and overall sensitivity!

I think what is not fully appreciated on here is there are two different sets of expectations - one, being us supporters and the other being the players. And many posters place ( or misplace) the emotional side of the equation back onto players.

We, the fans, do bleed "red and blue" - we PAY for the privilege to see our team play and our loyalty ( for most) is set in concrete.

The players on the other hand are professional athletes with limited career lifespans and in the main they are loyal to the team and teamates whilst they are contracted ( some have pointed out that Scully had departed mentally the year before he left). But the decision to continue to play for a club weighs up this loyalty against two major factors being finances and team success.

So when I hear that a player delaying a contract has such a huge impact - it is,in my opinion, only something that leaves a bad taste in supporters mouths. Teamates understand the system and decisions that need to be made as to their futures, as do the administrators. I don't think it matters in the slightest to the teamates. The only person that can be affected is the player himself.

I have seen claims that Frawley delaying his contract is a bad look for club and he is carrying himself poorly both on and off the field. Roos himself has said - welcome to the world of free agency, its the players right to do exactly what Frawley is doing - he gets it. Roos has said that Frawley has been ok both on and off the field. The only people who are really affected by this prolonged contract situation is we, the supporters.

The only thing I will say is that Frawley not being too clever should have been coached by his manager to say the following when his contract was mentioned the first time and every subsequent time - " I will not be making a decision until I am ready - this is something between myself and the club and I won't discuss it any further". As much as this would still infuriate supporters I think that this is what he should say.

all very true nut from a logical point of view

however my "loyalty" and connection to the club is based on emotion, like it or not

as the relentlessnes of professionalism and money-first continues to march on, my loyalty and connectedness is gradually eroded

it's not just me having these thoughts i'm starting to hear similar things from others

afl footy is starting to become just another media-based reality show run for the sake of making money and exploiting a great and uniquely australian dream

and no i don't blame the players

maybe d-l and flanagan will understand

"sweet dee" Love it. Highlights your gentle disposition and overall sensitivity!

For the Bennell call? Just some harmless fun.

On another note where has our friend Stuie gone? I see another poster in demonland is trying to take over the throne as biggest and most effective troll in internet history..

I never wanted Bennell to come home, that was just a g up to another poster on here but they never took the bait. Oh well.

The only 2 winnable ones left IMO is the GWS and the brizy game. Can't see us winning in Paterson, we never beat north and we also have the hawks. I can see us snagging at least one of our winnable games and can't see Brisbane or GWS winning 2 more each that would be necessary to relegate us to stone cold last.

I tend to agree, although a win for the Lions in the Q Clash could make our game in two weeks very interesting. Christian Petracca Cup or a chance to end our Etihad hoo doo?

maybe.....but "take emotion out of it" and you have no demonland

and where does that leave many fans? next we will see fans changing clubs every season or so

is that what we want? (rhetorical question)

We're wedded to the club, not the players.

What nutbean said

I never wanted Bennell to come home, that was just a g up to another poster on here but they never took the bait. Oh well.

The only 2 winnable ones left IMO is the GWS and the brizy game. Can't see us winning in Paterson, we never beat north and we also have the hawks. I can see us snagging at least one of our winnable games and can't see Brisbane or GWS winning 2 more each that would be necessary to relegate us to stone cold last.

I tend to agree, although a win for the Lions in the Q Clash could make our game in two weeks very interesting. Christian Petracca Cup or a chance to end our Etihad hoo doo?

all very true nut from a logical point of view

however my "loyalty" and connection to the club is based on emotion, like it or not

as the relentlessnes of professionalism and money-first continues to march on, my loyalty and connectedness is gradually eroded

it's not just me having these thoughts i'm starting to hear similar things from others

afl footy is starting to become just another media-based reality show run for the sake of making money and exploiting a great and uniquely australian dream

and no i don't blame the players

maybe d-l and flanagan will understand

Couldn't agree more.

My point is simply there is a major disconnect between supporter expectation and player reality.

You DC, acknowledge this but many on here don't.

I am with you 100% but to keep my sanity I try (with varying success) to distance myself from the emotional love for a player especially when it comes around to contract renewal time.

There is no doubt in mind that you and I and most supporters have much more love for players that don't wait until seasons end or explore FA options but sign up because they "love playing for the club". My affection for the game always gets worn down by players exercising this right because unlike players am 100% committed to the club - I can't be traded or tempted to by the lure of money or success elsewhere.

What I won't do though is look at a player like Frawley and hang my emotional bias on his actions and declare him a meh footballer who is conducting himself poorly both on and off the field. This is just not the case.

For the Bennell call? Just some harmless fun.

On another note where has our friend Stuie gone? I see another poster in demonland is trying to take over the throne as biggest and most effective troll in internet history..

I'm sure Stu realises we all miss him sweet. And, as for those other pretenders, Stuie still holds "the throne"! At least from the point of view of we discerning posters.

I tend to agree, although a win for the Lions in the Q Clash could make our game in two weeks very interesting. Christian Petracca Cup or a chance to end our Etihad hoo doo?

That is true, but with GC having so much to play for I can't see them dropping that one. Would make for an interesting etihad clash the following week.

I have a feeling whoever gets pick one does a deal with GWS for Cameron- assuming its saints or Brisbane. GWS then use 1 for the best mid and we use our highest pick to get a highly fancied mid either from GWS or another club who has excess stock and wants a bite at one of the promising KPF stocks. Or of course we don't deal with anyone and keep our first and possible frawley comp for the draft.

Hogan will be enough to cover frawley leaving if it was our intention to turn spud into a fwd

I'm sure Stu realises we all miss him sweet. And, as for those other pretenders, Stuie still holds "the throne"! At least from the point of view of we discerning posters.

Sayriconholme is giving it a mighty shake-up

We're wedded to the club, not the players.

What nutbean said

if you read my post it was not about the players, it was more about the direction of the game

it was about how the game is being hi-jacked and FA is just one part of that

the club changes as time goes on in order to comply with the dictates of the afl and the"stakeholders" (profiteers)

as the game changes then the club changes with it until it just erodes my attachment to the afl and hence the club little by little

that is not hard to understand

when it gets like nrl with players swapping around willy nilly you start to question whether it is a club or just another receptacle of transient players

it's just an opinion (and not that uncommon) plus i'm probably feeling a bit maudlin today and peeved with posters who just analyse it from a real-politik, pragmatic, logical point of view and ignore the emotional allegiance aspect of it which is so important to the traditional club supporter

rant over

if you read my post it was not about the players, it was more about the direction of the game

it was about how the game is being hi-jacked and FA is just one part of that

the club changes as time goes on in order to comply with the dictates of the afl and the"stakeholders" (profiteers)

as the game changes then the club changes with it until it just erodes my attachment to the afl and hence the club little by little

that is not hard to understand

when it gets like nrl with players swapping around willy nilly you start to question whether it is a club or just another receptacle of transient players

it's just an opinion (and not that uncommon) plus i'm probably feeling a bit maudlin today and peeved with posters who just analyse it from a real-politik, pragmatic, logical point of view and ignore the emotional allegiance aspect of it which is so important to the traditional club supporter

rant over

Spot on dc

I can easily see the day ahead when I will not be interested in Aussie rules at AFL level.