2 weeks ago I would have had McKenzie comfortably in front of Nicholson as the team's preferred tagger but after watching Nicholson play on Griffin on Saturday I am now not so sure.

Nicholson appears to have more pace and endurance whilst McKenzie has more size and strength. The team cant carry both if it wants to improve and it will be interested to see who will last longer.

Wasn't there already a thread for this? A thread where it was pointed out Griffen had 31 disposals and 3 goals?

If we're genuinely improving, neither of these guys will make the cut.

Broken arm or broken leg? They are both not up to it in the long run and the quicker we replace them on the list the better.

We have such a substandard list it's not funny and these guys contribute a lot to that status.

I have been a huge fan of Jordie, and still remain in great admiration of him for truly giving his absolute all and getting every ounce from himself over the journey.

However I am, some would say belatedly, coming to the conclusion that he won't make the grade as our team matures and we hopefullly make a push for high honours. His work ethic unfortunately far outreaches his talents, it seems.

IF every player on our list, and I refer particularly to the likes of Colin, put in his effort every minute of every game, we would be in a far better place than we are.

I also agree that Nicho seems to have passed him, though still not an A or even B grader; I think he does have more likelihood of getting towards B than does Jordie.

Thanks.

Do chickens have talons?

About guys like McKenzie, can I ask the obvious question?

If they work so damn hard, why do they always have shitty skills? I mean, you'd think that their work ethic might mean they'd practice a lot on their kicking and stuff, but it never seems like they do.

I can see some people not being tall or strong or whatever, but there's no gene for kicking the ball well. So what's the deal?

I have been a huge fan of Jordie, and still remain in great admiration of him for truly giving his absolute all and getting every ounce from himself over the journey.

However I am, some would say belatedly, coming to the conclusion that he won't make the grade as our team matures and we hopefullly make a push for high honours. His work ethic unfortunately far outreaches his talents, it seems.

IF every player on our list, and I refer particularly to the likes of Colin, put in his effort every minute of every game, we would be in a far better place than we are.

I also agree that Nicho seems to have passed him, though still not an A or even B grader; I think he does have more likelihood of getting towards B than does Jordie.

Thanks.

I'm in your camp I've loved the way that Jordie has absolutely given his all and literally thrown himself at the opposition, but I'm also coming to the realisation he just isn't up to it. Perhaps we can carry a tagger like him or Nicho if we have a bit more quality in the Midfield and even both on the list but not in the same team at once.

You just hate to lose a player that gives his all every week it weakens the group as a whole I believe.

About guys like McKenzie, can I ask the obvious question?

If they work so damn hard, why do they always have shitty skills? I mean, you'd think that their work ethic might mean they'd practice a lot on their kicking and stuff, but it never seems like they do.

I can see some people not being tall or strong or whatever, but there's no gene for kicking the ball well. So what's the deal?

Jordie has had a lot of injuries over the years and has spent a lot of time out of the game, maybe that's what hasn't helped.

Nicho has the speed on Jordie, takes the game on but that's it.

Jordie is a better kick (not that that's saying much), better at tackling, better handball / vision / decision maker (see previous brackets). He goes in and gets the hard ball without hesitating - have never seen him shirk a contest.

Jordie is a long way a head of Nicho in my books.

If we are ever to be a good team again, neither will be considered for selection

Nicho has the speed on Jordie, takes the game on but that's it.

Jordie is a better kick (not that that's saying much), better at tackling, better handball / vision / decision maker (see previous brackets). He goes in and gets the hard ball without hesitating - have never seen him shirk a contest.

Jordie is a long way a head of Nicho in my books.

If we are ever to be a good team again, neither will be considered for selection

That list line is pretty much it. If they were in our worst few players we'd have a pretty damn good list but the fact is they are both borderline best 22 which means we just don't have the players required.

I'd pick McKenzie over Nicho any day of the week. Its true that neither are very good though.

I could actually see Trengove becoming the teams run with player over time, he's a good tackle and has a good tank. His pace issues are well documented

Perhaps his little chats with Ling can aid him with the role too. He'd be a roles royce version of whatever McKenzie and Nicho currenlty offer.

I have said before that when we compare these guys we are comparing degrees of the ordinary at best.

The first requirement is to be someone who gives 100% and are frearless for the contast.

Both get high marks I cannot fault them.

However they are both serious short in the skill department.

Both will constantly let us dowm in the disposal area resulting in turn overs that hurt and in the end cost us games.

Both will be around the MFC for the next couple of years until we get better players.

When we have a better midfield they will struggle to get games.

Until then I grit my teeth when they get the ball as I know the what the next action is most likely to produce.

If you are going to have a tagger, its handy if he has a bit of pace, so he can hurt the opposition going the other way.

Mckenzie just doesn't do enough with the ball for mine.

Griffin has killed the best of taggers this year.

We can work with Nicho, he has pace, run and carry, breaks the lines and isn't short of confidence.

They are both terrible kicks, Jordie doesn't have much scope for improvement - whereas Nicho does IMO.

McKenzie can't stick tackles, is poor by hand - and foot - and is a turn over merchant.

I have said before that when we compare these guys we are comparing degrees of the ordinary at best.

The first requirement is to be someone who gives 100% and are frearless for the contast.

Both get high marks I cannot fault them.

However they are both serious short in the skill department.

Both will constantly let us dowm in the disposal area resulting in turn overs that hurt and in the end cost us games.

Both will be around the MFC for the next couple of years until we get better players.

When we have a better midfield they will struggle to get games.

Until then I grit my teeth when they get the ball as I know the what the next action is most likely to produce.

Agree completely...

I think players like Clisby and Terlich are proof that we really did have a shocking period of recruiting. That's all it comes down to.

Nicholson and JM would never get games in a decent side as others have pointed out. We need to keep turning the list over.

Who agrees that our draftees of this year, (not including the recycled players) have proven that the recruiting of the past has been shambolic?

I mean it's just incredible. Jones, Terlich, Kent and Clisby have shown more than a handful of shitkickers we still have running around on the park and this is on the back of one limited AFL standard pre-season and which is the same excuses people use to protect the shitkickers we have running around out there under-performing!!!

Amazing.

Edited July 3, 201312 yr by stevethemanjordan

I think players like Clisby and Terlich are proof that we really did have a shocking period of recruiting. That's all it comes down to.

Nicholson and JM would never get games in a decent side as others have pointed out. We need to keep turning the list over.

Who agrees that our draftees of this year, (not including the recycled players) have proven that the recruiting of the past has been shambolic?

I mean it's just incredible. Jones, Terlich, Kent and Clisby have shown more than a handful of shitkickers we still have running around on the park and this is on the back of one limited AFL standard pre-season and which is the same excuses people use to protect the shitkickers we have running around out there under-performing!!!

Amazing.

McKenzie and Nicholson - both rookie selections

Clisby was also.

All that has proven anyway was our inability to draft over a number of seasons. McKenzie and Nicholson have almost been best 22 for the past few seasons.

That is a major worry.

Edited July 3, 201312 yr by stevethemanjordan

I think players like Clisby and Terlich are proof that we really did have a shocking period of recruiting. That's all it comes down to.

Nicholson and JM would never get games in a decent side as others have pointed out. We need to keep turning the list over.

Who agrees that our draftees of this year, (not including the recycled players) have proven that the recruiting of the past has been shambolic?

I mean it's just incredible. Jones, Terlich, Kent and Clisby have shown more than a handful of shitkickers we still have running around on the park and this is on the back of one limited AFL standard pre-season and which is the same excuses people use to protect the shitkickers we have running around out there under-performing!!!

Amazing.

Whilst I agree our recruiting this year makes the other years look completely shambolic I would be careful not wanting to go off too early about some of this years recruits. The fact that a chubby Dean Kent influences games in the same was as Blease after 4 preseasons (regardless of injury) is a compelling case.

But....Matt Jones can border on as bad as Nicho and McKenzie with the ball at times by foot. He's just got smarter instincts with the ball by hand. Clisby's mistakes go unnoticed because we are happy he is having a go and looks cleanly skilled. But at the same time he is 23 and is meant to be some what ready for AFL and not like an 18 year old.

Maybe comparing Nicholson's first season with that of Nathan Stark might be more on par.

Clisby was also.

All that has proven anyway was our inability to draft over a number of seasons. McKenzie and Nicholson have almost been best 22 for the past few seasons.

That is a major worry.

Have we had drafting problems? Well that explains a fair bit, thanks.