"Two years ago the clubs tried to get the boys off alcohol and they all turned to the drugs..."

I'm sorry, but what the Hell does he think alcohol is? I'm all for freedom to choose what you put into your body, but don't delude yourself about the nature of your vices.

Trouble is the focus on skin folds and body fat composition has pushed players away from alcohol and to recreational (not a great word I know) drugs in a time when this is becoming an acceptable part of youth culture.

Personally I think the issue is that the AFL doesn't want there to be a third strike so they'll do anything to keep the problem hidden from publicity. The result is that the party attitude of the players goes on unchecked.

The AFL didn't have to get involved in the first place and now they've made a rod for their own back. They really should have gone with the WADA code and be done with it.

IMO I think this is incredibly selfish of the Herald Sun to make an article like this. I know they're all about selling papers and I'm sure if I was a journalist I'd do it too, but for me it's just so unnecessary.

Let's be honest the article isn't adding anything we don't already know.. Yes AFL clubs will drop you like a hot potato if you're no good, and yes Buddy Franklin (sadly) will get favourable treatment. All this has done is open a can of worms for this poor ex-player who will know be hounded down from ex-teammates, questioning his motives.

The more I delve into the article, every single quote is given by 'Micks' father and it leads me to question whether he would have even known his Dad was talking about this. In the world of Twitter and social media, all anonymous sources always get found out and I now know who the player is in question. If I've been told I'm sure a lot in the industry would have. I can understand the drugs and depression are the buzz words around the AFL in the off-season and I could be overreacting but I see it as a huge lapse in judgement by this player's father and Mark Robinson has taken full advantage of this bloke's idiocy.

Personally I think the issue is that the AFL doesn't want there to be a third strike so they'll do anything to keep the problem hidden from publicity. The result is that the party attitude of the players goes on unchecked.

It is certainly the policy that seems to be doing the most damage. It looks to me that the AFL is so worried that a star will be caught and bring shame on the game that they have made it all but impossible for said stars to get caught - until the drug problem gets too big to hide and then they are thrown under the bus.

I blame this strange, undeclared war on the NRL that causes AFL HQ to ignore or deny everything that might cause a PR hit no matter how much damage it does behind the scenes.

It is certainly the policy that seems to be doing the most damage. It looks to me that the AFL is so worried that a star will be caught and bring shame on the game that they have made it all but impossible for said stars to get caught - until the drug problem gets too big to hide and then they are thrown under the bus.

I blame this strange, undeclared war on the NRL that causes AFL HQ to ignore or deny everything that might cause a PR hit no matter how much damage it does behind the scenes.

I predict that Dustin Martin or Dane Swan will spiral out of control and turn into Benny Cousins the 2nd, while the best drug policy in the cosmos continues to do a great job!

Man do I feel for this kid, playing at an AFL club and partying every weekend, I can see why he was so depressed. I bet he was scoring heaps of chicks too, the poor bastard.

Man do I feel for this kid, playing at an AFL club and partying every weekend, I can see why he was so depressed. I bet he was scoring heaps of chicks too, the poor bastard.

Well that's a pretty narrow-minded and pissweak attempt to understand the topic...

Man do I feel for this kid, playing at an AFL club and partying every weekend, I can see why he was so depressed. I bet he was scoring heaps of chicks too, the poor bastard.

You are obviously completely oblivious to the cause & effects of depression in young people.

It is this type of attitude that makes people hide their depression from other people.

The fear of people reacting as you have here.

If you can't add anything worthwhile to this discussion you should F$%%$$ k off

I predict that Dustin Martin or Dane Swan will spiral out of control and turn into Benny Cousins the 2nd, while the best drug policy in the cosmos continues to do a great job!

I doubt you need a crystal ball for that one mate

You are obviously completely oblivious to the cause & effects of depression in young people.

It is this type of attitude that makes people hide their depression from other people.

The fear of people reacting as you have here.

If you can't add anything worthwhile to this discussion you should F$%%$$ k off

So you are not happy Mgdee?

So you are not happy Mgdee?

Correct

Correct

Take a deep breath mate

Remember it is only a discussion forum.

I doubt anything said here will change the world.

Some things you cannot change

Take a deep breath mate

Remember it is only a discussion forum.

I doubt anything said here will change the world.

Some things you cannot change

If you can change the bigotted (uninformed) opinion of one person it is one less to have to endure in the future.

If you can change the bigotted (uninformed) opinion of one person it is one less to have to endure in the future.

This could go on all night Mgdee

But my experience is it very difficult to change a " bigoted ( uniformed ) opinion"

Good luck with the project.

Enjoy the rest of the evening.

This could go on all night Mgdee

But my experience is it very difficult to change a " bigoted ( uniformed ) opinion"

Good luck with the project.

Enjoy the rest of the evening.

Thanks old dee

No harm in trying I suppose.

Goodnight to you

You are obviously completely oblivious to the cause & effects of depression in young people.

It is this type of attitude that makes people hide their depression from other people.

The fear of people reacting as you have here.

If you can't add anything worthwhile to this discussion you should F$%%$$ k off

is this about drug use or depression, because they are not the same thing. This kid's Dad is surely right about drug use being rife in the comp and in young society in general, but just because that has resulted in depression in his kid doesn't mean it has had that effect on anyone else. The bloke would probably be depressed anyway, for a whole bunch of other reasons like so many non-drug-using people. I'm just saying that making a direct connection between drug use and depression is idiotic and the opinion of people that have never been near a drug in their lives yet act as an authority. Drug use does not equate necessarily to being homeless turning tricks on the street. Have you ever thought that perhaps people with a predisposition to depression tend to seek out drug use, and not the other way around? Don't tell me I don't know what I'm talking about because I can guarantee you I do.

Man do I feel for this kid, playing at an AFL club and partying every weekend, I can see why he was so depressed. I bet he was scoring heaps of chicks too, the poor bastard.

If depression were just a function of how crappy a person's life was, then you'd expect the suicide rates of 3rd world countries to by sky high. Not so.

If depression were just a function of how crappy a person's life was, then you'd expect the suicide rates of 3rd world countries to by sky high. Not so.

not necessarily disagreeing with you chook but crappiness is relative to one's environment and expectations

If depression were just a function of how crappy a person's life was, then you'd expect the suicide rates of 3rd world countries to by sky high. Not so.

Quite right, and funnily enough it's quite the opposite. Third world countries have very low rates of both depression and suicide. When you've got to fight just to survive, there's no time to think of anything else. The more affluent you are, the more likely you are to get depressed.

With regards to a link between drugs and depression, I have some anecdotal evidence to present (and yes, I too am a statistics nerd so please don't lecture me about statistically significant sample sizes people!). I am an occasional recreational drug user (alcohol and weed roughly fortnightly, mushrooms, LSD and ecstasy much less often, but not never). I speak from the position of someone who has tried (but for the most part, not abused) drugs, and who has mingled with many people who have tried (and abused, in some cases) nearly everything. Note that I'm a fully employed "white collar" professional in my mid thirties. You'll see me in a tie in the city. I don't live under a bridge.

My experience of basically all drugs (alcohol included) is that they amplify whatever mental state a person is in. A happy, chilled out person becomes a bit more happy, and a bit more chilled, on drugs. A thug with violent tendencies on drugs becomes the guy you read about in the news after an incident in King St. Someone who is a bit depressed, like my friend who killed himself recently, spirals into deeper and deeper depression with the assistance of drugs. Is there a link between drugs and depression? I'm not sure, and correlation isn't causation, but anecdotally it seems to me that drugs exacerbate depression. Drugs become the easiest way for a person to make a temporary escape from how they feel, while paradoxically making them feel that depression even more acutely. It becomes a vicious cycle.

Depression on the whole is vastly misunderstood. You don't blame a person who suffers kidney failure...It's a symptom of a malfunctioning organ in their body. For the same reason, you should not blame them for suffering from depression... they too have a malfunctioning organ, it just happens to be the brain.

In any event, Curry & Beer, I too felt like you about "perfect people" with "perfect lives" suffering from depression... something I had no experience with and no tendency towards myself. Suffice it to say, finding out your outwardly healthy friend has hung himself after a brief but intense addiction to meth is an experience that can alter your worldview pretty significantly. It's a complex situation with no simple answers, but compassion trumps cynicism as a starting point.

Agree autocol. Have had very similar experiences.

not necessarily disagreeing with you chook but crappiness is relative to one's environment and expectations

If thats the case I'm ringing the Demons shop.

A red and blue noose could really boost our finances if we have a rough start to the year.

Makes me wonder how we have any supporters left .

Oh well-at least our expectations are fairly low.

If depression were just a function of how crappy a person's life was, then you'd expect the suicide rates of 3rd world countries to by sky high. Not so.

I highly recommend a trip to S/E Asia for anyone struggling from middle class anxiety.

You can buy a big warm cup of STFU and appreciate life for nothing just by looking at how they bust their arses to live.

I still agree with Curry and Beer on this point to some extent.

Are you an AFL player suffering from an overly kissed arse? If so , that is your choice and your problems are not worth my consideration.

Got no money for a Doctor , and no health system? That is a problem.

there are recovery drugs that the players aren't allow to use, that would enable them to recover much quicker...... If the players were able to recover quicker, than there would be more time to practice skills and game plans.... Which would make them better at their sport.....

There are also drugs that help with awareness and would enable players to concentrate for longer periods of games....

Some Drugs ruin lives.... some drugs save lives....

How do we regulate gambling? Is it possible for gangsters to place bets? How do you stop gangsters manipulating matches? Are players, umpires and match officials safe on match days?

I would assume that drugs which are banned, even what you have called "recovery drugs" must have been banned for a reason.

It's impossible to ban sports betting, so having a properly regulated sports betting industry attempts to cover off all the issues you have raised. Victoria has very progressive legislation in this regard (which would be enhanced by legislation to make cheating at sport for the purpose of financial gain a criminal offence). The best example I can think of of gangsters manipulating matches is Arnold Rotstein and the Chicago White Sox nearly 100 years ago in the days when sports betting was illegal...yet it still happened. We're much better off with a regulated system.

I highly recommend a trip to S/E Asia for anyone struggling from middle class anxiety.

You can buy a big warm cup of STFU and appreciate life for nothing just by looking at how they bust their arses to live.

I still agree with Curry and Beer on this point to some extent.

Are you an AFL player suffering from an overly kissed arse? If so , that is your choice and your problems are not worth my consideration.

Got no money for a Doctor , and no health system? That is a problem.

There are all different reasons why people get into drugs, a cashed up bogan who's partying hard with his mates is a completely different scenario to a young girl who ends up becoming a hooker due to reasons that she feels are beyond her control and ends up taking drugs to get her through a shift. Addiction doesn't give a flying [censored] which socioeconomic group you come from.

In my younger days I used to be a bar manager at a well known night club, I've seen a lot of it, both the glamour and...well the other side. I agree with you Biff except I'll just add that there some areas of Melbourne whose residents are in very desperate circumstances.

I highly recommend a trip to S/E Asia for anyone struggling from middle class anxiety.

You can buy a big warm cup of STFU and appreciate life for nothing just by looking at how they bust their arses to live.

I still agree with Curry and Beer on this point to some extent.

Are you an AFL player suffering from an overly kissed arse? If so , that is your choice and your problems are not worth my consideration.

Got no money for a Doctor , and no health system? That is a problem.

I've been to Asia and seen the 'Cold Hard Reality' of drug use in the remote communities. Imagine your Grandma smoking an opium pipe so off her face that she cant stand up or say a word. Very sad indeed considering the grand children get to see the same cold hard reality. In these same communities drug use is more accepted than what the AFL policy dictates

Not sure of your point Biff? Drugs transend boarders, lifestyles and communities.

I've been to Asia and seen the 'Cold Hard Reality' of drug use in the remote communities. Imagine your Grandma smoking an opium pipe so off her face that she cant stand up or say a word. Very sad indeed considering the grand children get to see the same cold hard reality. In these same communities drug use is more accepted than what the AFL policy dictates

Not sure of your point Biff? Drugs transend boarders, lifestyles and communities.

"Grandma in the Cambodian Jungle" on an opium pipe(not xanax)

and 23 year old "Johnny the ex-afl player" who no longer has any structure in life on the E's (not uppers)

are two different beings I agree.

I dont wish to curb the behaviour of either of them.

Live and let live.

"The sad bogan in the shed on 13 cans a night" is doing as much damage in all likelihood.

"The divorcee at the pokies drinking spumante' maybe more.

The AFL is pushing sh!t up a hill with a burnt stick on this one,as they are on the tanking issue.

Unless you are a social worker ,why worry?

Drugs have been around for Millennia .

Let the AFL deal with performance enhancing drugs and the Clubs deal with party drugs and everybody else just do what they do .

Footy players are "NOT" role models.

They are athletes who are gifted with physical skill ,not moral perfection .

Wowserism is alive and well.