One Win!!! Does not a Winter warmer.

We've got a long way to go to get this club into Real finals shape. The list still has a lot of work needed.

Thinking we've made it after beating GWS on a bad day is nothing.

Where exactly did I say we've "made it"?!

Merely pointing out the over the top negativity towards certain players on this site.

Jamar was hardly rubbish but I raised my eyebrows at the extension.

Hope he and Brent can get back to the clearance duo they once were.

Current form....

Would you have said Scully was worth $6 million on form when he was signed by GWS......

Think it's pretty naive and downright silly to suggest contracts are based on "current form".

Would you have said Scully was worth $6 million on form when he was signed by GWS......

Think it's pretty naive and downright silly to suggest contracts are based on "current form".

My initial comment was that if the status quo has not changed by seasons end.

I'll stick by that.

Cheers.

My initial comment was that if the status quo has not changed by seasons end.

I'll stick by that.

Cheers.

Fair enough, I understand where you're coming from then, but I would be saving that until next year if possible, just think he has a lot of upside for where we're at if he can turn it around, and given what we're going through with game plan and structural changes we should afford him a bit more time given his performance history.

We would need to delist more than probably 7-8 players before not at least offering Beamer a contract becomes sensible. We desperately need players of his age and experience. It's unlikely that a Couch or even a Viney will come in and be consistently better than Beamer straight away (Couch probably never, he is a good honest C grader like Magner). There should be plenty ahead of him in the queue for the scrap heap.

I think he might walk. I don't think we'll delist him, but the new contract offer will be 'significantly lower' than what he'd be asking for I hope.

Let's look at it.

- We need - need - to shed 5 players. AFL minimum is three delistings and thus players picked in the 1st, 2nd and 3rd rounds. But with the two compos, that means five. Now try and bloody name the five.

- We also have blokes standing up. Lynden Dunn is going to get another crack, as is Rivers. Jamar already has his deal. Jones will deservedly be getting a payrise.

- Moloney, on the other hand, hasn't performed since the first half of 2011. Yes, he dominated. But as soon as he was worked out he was anonymous.

There's no value in us delisting him, so we'll offer him perhaps a 2-year deal, but not on first-class mid pay at all - perhaps even low B-grader. Moloney's manager will try and play us, and hopefully based on form we'll hold firm and he'll get a better offer elsewhere and proceed to walk. We'll also get another draft pick out of it.

If Brent Moloney ever visited this board and saw the way he was spoken about, for a bloke who has given a lot to this club both on and off the field, I wouldn't blame him if he walked.

If anyone seriously believes he wouldn't be offered a contract at all for next season, they are dreaming. To me, Moloney is exactly the sort of big body we can't afford to lose right now, despite not having a great start to the season.

If anyone seriously believes he wouldn't be offered a contract at all for next season, they are dreaming. To me, Moloney is exactly the sort of big body we can't afford to lose right now, despite not having a great start to the season.

I'll challenge you on that.

Who has had the better season out of Moloney and Magner? I'd say Magner.

For me, this goes to prove that there is plenty of able bodied mids floating around in the VFL busting their gut to have a go at AFL senior footy.

Brent's big body and output right at the moment is VFL level.

I would not offer him a contract, watch him walk and be happy with whatever we got in return, even if it's o ly an extra roster spot for a draftee.

Grimes bleeds red & blue, Jones bleeds red & blue, jack Viney will bleed red & blue, Mitch Clark just about bleeds red & blue already.

The "bleeds red & blue" moniker is pretty much an extrapolation of "I've pinned my hopes on this guy for too long and I'm too emotionally invested to accept that he is not up to it and should be moved on."

If Brent Moloney ever visited this board and saw the way he was spoken about, for a bloke who has given a lot to this club both on and off the field, I wouldn't blame him if he walked.

If anyone seriously believes he wouldn't be offered a contract at all for next season, they are dreaming. To me, Moloney is exactly the sort of big body we can't afford to lose right now, despite not having a great start to the season.

If he knew which posters to ignore I think he would be fine with the criticism - I am sure he has some of the same opinions on his game.

With that said - I am much happier of late with Moloney; he isn't getting the ball in space much at all but I think he may be playing a particular role as an 'offensive minder' and sacrificing his own game. Much the same way that Magner plays since the early rounds. They are also helpful at locking the ball in at stoppages in our half.

I don't know what his future role will be because the future of our midfield is will be based around Grimes, Jones, Trengove, Viney, McKenzie, and Howe.

But you need a number of players to run through there and if Neeld can help Moloney develop a peripheral role that allows him to be apart of the support group then that is going to give him another contract at this club.

It's counterintuitive - but the longer Moloney stays out of the guts this year, the better for his future.

Its a pragmatic choice,unlike passionate opinions on boards like this and Ology.......... There are a number of delistings and retirements waiting to happen, which means Beamer ( bleeds red and blue) will stay unless there is a trade option in play....maybe one of those weird 3 way deals that gets a gun to some club and fullfils some second tier needs at 2 other clubs

there was one passage on Sunday that for mine summed up the predicament and epitomised where Beamer is currently. Honestly cant remember whether 2nd or wth (but heading to punt rd) . Ball is kicked from half bac ( roughly ) in play and bally heads towards space on outer side of square. . Too far for Beamer initially. Not far enough for another Demon.. and theres a Giant (sts) in theway..Now theGiant rushes at the ball..and Baeamer seems to...but just DOESNT have the leg speed sohe seems towant to wait and bundle the giant. Now th eBeamer of old would have just charged full pelt at the ball and if possible taken out the giant. He didnt..he seems to hesitate , just for an instant, but that was enough to make anything he did hard(er ) work.n

Now I knw it was just one passage of play... but its that image of Beamer I took from the game.

He really has to make up his mind

I would not offer him a contract, watch him walk and be happy with whatever we got in return, even if it's o ly an extra roster spot for a draftee.

Grimes bleeds red & blue, Jones bleeds red & blue, jack Viney will bleed red & blue, Mitch Clark just about bleeds red & blue already.

The "bleeds red & blue" moniker is pretty much an extrapolation of "I've pinned my hopes on this guy for too long and I'm too emotionally invested to accept that he is not up to it and should be moved on."

I can tell you love Brent!!!

Moloney isnt even in the top 20 for clearances this year which is a good indication he is well down, hes 27th for those who want to know, this is the area he used to excell at. You could say hes playing a different role but hes meant to be our no.1 mid and should be hell bent on getting his hands on the footy. I found this very interesting considering that Jamar is leading the league in hit outs by nearly 50. They are usually a great combination.

I think Brent has improved slightly of late but still not anywhere near the standard we know and expect from him. He will get overtaken by the game itself soon, plus our players and draft picks, I have been a huge fan over the years but I think he has other clubs on his mind.

Would you have said Scully was worth $6 million on form when he was signed by GWS......

Think it's pretty naive and downright silly to suggest contracts are based on "current form".

You had me till you raised this argument. Scully is OVERPAID. He is not worth Gary Ablett or Travis Cloak type money now, nor likely to be worth it in the future...

Moloney needs to lift his performances. Hopefully he will.

I can tell you love Brent!!!

Moloney isnt even in the top 20 for clearances this year which is a good indication he is well down, hes 27th for those who want to know, this is the area he used to excell at. You could say hes playing a different role but hes meant to be our no.1 mid and should be hell bent on getting his hands on the footy. I found this very interesting considering that Jamar is leading the league in hit outs by nearly 50. They are usually a great combination.

I think Brent has improved slightly of late but still not anywhere near the standard we know and expect from him. He will get overtaken by the game itself soon, plus our players and draft picks, I have been a huge fan over the years but I think he has other clubs on his mind.

He doesn't play in the midfield as much of late so this is unfair. So Jamar's 'dominance' isn't being exploited by Jones, Trengove, and Grimes, not just Moloney.

He doesn't play in the midfield as much of late so this is unfair. So Jamar's 'dominance' isn't being exploited by Jones, Trengove, and Grimes, not just Moloney.

Still plays predominantly in the midfield though, numbers well down all year, even in games he has played as a mid all game. But I get what your saying.

He doesn't play in the midfield as much of late so this is unfair. So Jamar's 'dominance' isn't being exploited by Jones, Trengove, and Grimes, not just Moloney.

could have sworn i saw some bloke ...looked a hell of lot like Brent playinig in the middle on Sunday.. my bad

I'm probably Moloney's biggest critic on this site. I was "bashing" him when it was uncool, but it would be silly to talk about delisting him now. I am, however, flabbergasted that he hasn't yet been dropped. Green, Davey and Sylvia all have, but Moloney hasn't? It strikes me as very odd.

I may be reading more into this than I should, but perhaps Neeld's continual backing of Beamer is a considered strategy to either a) get him onside, b ) find SOME way for him to figure in our future, c) raise his trade value for next year, or d) create evidence the club can point to in negotiations with Beamer's management in an attempt to justify a vastly smaller contract for next year.

EDIT: Damn smoking demon. I don't use emoticons, so I find it highly annoying when b{bracket} turns into B)

could have sworn i saw some bloke ...looked a hell of lot like Brent playinig in the middle on Sunday.. my bad

I don't know the numbers but with Howe and Grimes getting more time in there of late, Moloney has been on the flank more and more.

Beamer was very poor against a GW$ midfield he should have smashed.

That said. I don't think Neeld would delist him.

If he walks i will get over it. I think we need to find a better player.

Beamer was very poor against a GW$ midfield he should have smashed.

That said. I don't think Neeld would delist him.

If he walks i will get over it. I think we need to find a better player.

im inclined to agree..

A bit of a shame in many ways as Watts showed the benefit of being able to penetrate into the forward arc with well weighted and directed kicks. Now Beamer could also do this ...but perhaps hasnt the naunces of accuracy..

If hes not careful Brent will become a self made dinosaur.

Where exactly did I say we've "made it"?!

Merely pointing out the over the top negativity towards certain players on this site.

IMO beating GWS who were well below they're best footy is good, but not time exclaim a public holiday.

Moloney, I've been one of his staunchest supporters, but i think it may be time Unless he can get his attitude back to where it should be.

I wanted him a skipper ahead of the young guns, but we've since changed Coach & footy dept', with a whole new focus of total youth in the leadership. Late last year & this year has showed me that the Culture was worse than even I thought, & the way Neeld is going is the right way.

If beamer can get his head back on & playing & learning the new ways, then good. If not, >>>>

I think Maloney will get another contract. Mark Neeld rates him highly and considers him one of the best stoppage players in the game. I think he was really disappointed to be dropped from the leadership group and he has been one guy who might have struggled with all the changes being made at the club (just my opinion). Neeld makes the point about players needing to put in off the field as well as on it and I don't think anyone will be keeping their spot on the list if they don't do that. I think that Beamer has turned a corner and the penny has dropped for him. We need to retain him, he's a hard body and an experienced head if nothing else, and we don't have many of those.

there was one passage on Sunday that for mine summed up the predicament and epitomised where Beamer is currently. Honestly cant remember whether 2nd or wth (but heading to punt rd) . Ball is kicked from half bac ( roughly ) in play and bally heads towards space on outer side of square. . Too far for Beamer initially. Not far enough for another Demon.. and theres a Giant (sts) in theway..Now theGiant rushes at the ball..and Baeamer seems to...but just DOESNT have the leg speed sohe seems towant to wait and bundle the giant. Now th eBeamer of old would have just charged full pelt at the ball and if possible taken out the giant. He didnt..he seems to hesitate , just for an instant, but that was enough to make anything he did hard(er ) work.n

Now I knw it was just one passage of play... but its that image of Beamer I took from the game.

He really has to make up his mind

Thought the same thing when I saw it, he really is in 2 minds at the moment.

You had me till you raised this argument. Scully is OVERPAID. He is not worth Gary Ablett or Travis Cloak type money now, nor likely to be worth it in the future...

Moloney needs to lift his performances. Hopefully he will.

That was exactly my point though. Scully is massively overpaid, which is why I'm saying I think it's silly to suggest contracts are based purely on "current form" as some are suggesting.