I think his time is up, because the top sides these days don't employ traditional taggers.

Even Ling wins a lot of his own ball, while being exceptional defensively

Neeld, having come from Collingwood, will likely have the same attitude.

Neeld's attitude was to put him in the leadership group.

Neeld's attitude was to put him in the leadership group.

That doesn't mean he won't have to earn his games. I expect Bartram to be one of our break-out players this year, but that will rely heavily on his skills having improved.

That doesn't mean he won't have to earn his games. I expect Bartram to be one of our break-out players this year, but that will rely heavily on his skills having improved.

Of course he will have to earn his place, he works hard. But most on here want him to pack the bag. He is better than that.

Remember why the Tin Man and the cowardly Lion went to the Wizard of Oz ?

To ask for the things they lacked .

Clint needs to ask someone to teach him to hit a target.

Then he will be the top tagger in the comp.

Clint is a very good player. Often plays on the best opposition players and beats his opponent every week. Never gives up, and very consistant. Disposal not even close to as bad as as the group think on this site, and will look much better with better players aound him this year.

Great application and a ferocious tackler.

Played 15 games this year and I wonder what the Neeld FD is thinking about when it comes to Batram.

He is finding it difficult to stay within the areas he is good at, when he ran behind Gysberts and demanded the footy earlier this year and proceeded to kick it out on the full is a case in point.

If he stays he has to get a specific role with defined directions - and he is capable of doing that.

This is quite the conundrum. Your example re Gysberts is spot on and there was a game at Etihad last year were twice he ran hard into the forward line to make space and have a shot at goal and sprayed both shots - momentum and team spirit killers. Its almost like he needs to be told not to do the 100% right thing by creating an option that forces him to dispose of the footy over any distance. Or tell him to continue to run and spread but tell the rest of the team to ignore him !

I love the things he does well and in equal measure ugghhh on some of decision and foot skills. There arent may footballers who have whati consider major weaknesses who can play only to their strengths. Sam Mitchell is one - he is excellent by hand and a good kick under 25 metres. Nine times out of ten he will butcher the ball over a longer distance. Watch him closely - he now rarely if ever tries to kick long.

I will repeat a statement I have made a number of times on here: Bartram will play every game this year. Neeld loves him, loves his attack, and his desire to put his body on the line to win the ball. This is evident in his elevation to the leadership group.

If we had guys like Benny and Gys as willing to put their bodies on the line to win the ball as Clint, we would be a lot better off.

I hope he has a ripper year, and shows up the doubters.

My understanding of Neeld's plan (from what I can gather from training, simulated stoppages, and talking to staff) will result in Bartram having a job to do, and his disposal not being under pressure as often, and will likely reduce his possessions, but will result in winning the ball for others to use.

Rioli, Milne, Betts etc will not have an easy year.

Clint is a very good player. Often plays on the best opposition players and beats his opponent every week. Never gives up, and very consistant. Disposal not even close to as bad as as the group think on this site, and will look much better with better players aound him this year.

I think we need to distinguish between poor disposal and momentum killers. Its not just about kicking efficiency - it is about when you turn it over, where you turn it over and under what circumstances Some of Clints disposals have been at the end of good movement to get into reasonable goal kicking position to have him miss an easy shot - again it may have only been limited times during the year but it kills team momentum. Miskicking a pass into a static, overcrowded forward line is different from bursting through the centre with everything opening up in front of you only to kick it to the only opposition player within cooee of your team mates. One is bad disposal - the other is a momentum killer.

My understanding of Neeld's plan (from what I can gather from training, simulated stoppages, and talking to staff) will result in Bartram having a job to do, and his disposal not being under pressure as often, and will likely reduce his possessions, but will result in winning the ball for others to use.

If that works then it will be a big win. I dont think anyone doubts his application, ferocity or courage. Its the end result of his great work that can bring him undone.

Edit - as an aside - Chris Pelchin's blueprint for Hawthorns recruiting was simple - criteria one- anyone recruited had to be a good disposer of the ball by hand and foot. If you didnt get past the first criteria you werent recruited.

Edited February 10, 201213 yr by nutbean

No one can question Bartram's endeavour, application, heart, willingness and toughness. He has these qualities in spades and usually beats his opponent each week. Also, he usually is involved in a few plays that break out of our back line with linking, multiple kicks and handpasses. It is in this setting where his main deficiency is demonstrated - his kicking efficiency.

It is not only about landing it on someone's chest, however he does miss easy targets when running with little or no pressure. For me, in some games, I have put his disposal into the Darren Gaspar or Ben Holland category. I simpy did not want him to get the ball because the team would run forward according to plan and his kicking would not be effective enough for that plan to work.

If he gets his kicking game right, he is absolutley in our best 22. If not, he will come in and out of the team according to the opposition on any given day.

.

I hope you are wrong ... because If you are right , we won't be moving far up the ladder

Big statement based on one player, hoopla.

Bartram has kicking limitations. He's a smart player and a good decision maker and if he can chooses targets within his limitations and usually hits them (when he misses it does look extra bad). The big problem is when he's forced to kick to targets outside his comfort zone - it's turnover time and the better drilled opposition try to generate this situation, leave him unmarked to get ball and guard his short space targets.

Clint is a very good player. Often plays on the best opposition players and beats his opponent every week. Never gives up, and very consistant. Disposal not even close to as bad as as the group think on this site, and will look much better with better players aound him this year.

His disposal is awful and he came as close to any player on our list to singlehandedly being responsible for losing a match last year because of it. I mean awful by AFL standards btw. No groupthink exists on that topic. Everyone looks better with "better players around him". He does not beat his opponent every week. Motherhood statements are really quite sweet. So are gumdrops and lollies and everything else in fantasyland.

My prediction is that Bartram's brain and heart will get him in the side and then, when more highly skilled others' grow a set, he'll be phased out. It's a pity, but I think it is inevitable. Funny, because as a tagger he'll be around the footy - if played this way it will have him around the footy more and as a result his disposal will be more of an issue. Now, if the structure of the team limit this liability, good. My bet is that our midfield will still get crucified and Bart's disposal will be exposed.

5 games until his 100th. Always like the kid. His first season he was great in a pretty dire year. Last few games under Viney showed his worth. I hope he has a very good year.

Danihers Love Child and now adopted by Neeld.

He's in the LG now so expect him to play 22 games. (Barring injuries)

So all you "Naysayers" get off his back.

Yes his disposal hasn't been great, but at least he can get the ball.

far better than a player who can hit a target but not get the ball.

Remember why the Tin Man and the cowardly Lion went to the Wizard of Oz ?

To ask for the things they lacked .

Clint needs to ask someone to teach him to hit a target.

Then he will be the top tagger in the comp.

One of the more unique analogies I read. Luckily Clint appears to have plenty of ticker and courage.... On occasions though, he has resembled the Scarecrow.

Nice work Biffen.

Bartram has kicking limitations. He's a smart player and a good decision maker and if he can chooses targets within his limitations and usually hits them (when he misses it does look extra bad). The big problem is when he's forced to kick to targets outside his comfort zone - it's turnover time and the better drilled opposition try to generate this situation, leave him unmarked to get ball and guard his short space targets.

I think Bartram needs to be played mostly in the midfield for this reason. When he plays in the backline he picks the easy target too often and this slows our transition from defence to attack. He should only play back on specific match ups (i.e. Rioli).

Danihers Love Child and now adopted by Neeld.

He's in the LG now so expect him to play 22 games. (Barring injuries)

So all you "Naysayers" get off his back.

Yes his disposal hasn't been great, but at least he can get the ball.

far better than a player who can hit a target but not get the ball.

Hard to do that since you need the ball to hit a target .-One %ers may help him steady ,ie a better team .

I think Bartram needs to be played mostly in the midfield for this reason. When he plays in the backline he picks the easy target too often and this slows our transition from defence to attack. He should only play back on specific match ups (i.e. Rioli).

I agree with that - kicking deficiencies are less destructive in the mid-field than the backline - ironically the further you move up the ground these days kicking becomes less important - it's got to be easier to steer it between two posts 7m apart than hit a team-mate from the same distance with 2 opponents 5 m away from him.

Interesting article about Clint on the MFC website this arv:

http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/7415/newsid/128976/default.aspx

Clint is a very good player. Often plays on the best opposition players and beats his opponent every week. Never gives up, and very consistant. Disposal not even close to as bad as as the group think on this site, and will look much better with better players aound him this year.

Had the most backward kicks of anyone at the club in his 15 games yet still managed only 59.7% efficiency by foot.

As for 'beating his opponent every week'... Brent Harvey, Stephen Milne and David Ellard each kicked 3 goals on him last season.

How do you measure the backward kicks? Got a reliable source?

Was he actually playing on Harvey, Ellard and Milne for the whole game?? Or are you matching off Bartram with small to mid size forwards for the opposition?

How do you measure the backward kicks? Got a reliable source?

Was he actually playing on Harvey, Ellard and Milne for the whole game?? Or are you matching off Bartram with small to mid size forwards for the opposition?

AFL Prospectus 2012.

Clint turns 24 today. Happy birthday little fella

Clint turns 24 today. Happy birthday little fella

Had to look twice at that picture DC!