Let's not jump the gun. I'm not sure why after a big loss this week people are angry and posting in haste on this board. What did people expect! We were playing a top 4-5 side at Melbourne's kiss of death stadium. Do people just forget about our recent smashings and think 'oh today is a new day, I think the dee's will somehow play elite football'?

Why people are pointing out players and asking for their heads is beyond me. Our whole team is a joke at the moment.

Morton and Bate will go but people have been complaining about them for many seasons even when we were playing some decent footy so that's fair. But Colin Sylvia? He is in a little bit of a form slump but is widely regarded as our most dangerous player. You don't just go trading these blokes around. It's not the players, its the game plan!

Bartram missed some pathetic shots but at least he got the footy in his hands. Dunn is inconsistent but he at least gets angry and every team has got to have a ryan crowley type. He has also kicked some great long goals from outside 50m this year. He will definitely stay.

Jones has been fantastic and his disposals are actually pretty good.

It's not the players, we need structural change. And that is something a new coach should instil. We also need to develop a defensive mindset. Make these guys play basketball for a bit and play man-to-man defence. on a footy field you can get away with not marking your man that closely. In basketball, you will be made to look silly. Hawthorn have got some of their players playing basketball and i have been asking this for years.

You call our players down-hill skiers but look at our supporters. We turn on our players when the team is playing terribly but when we do win the odd game, all is forgotten and forgiven for that 1 week

Dunn is inconsistent but he at least gets angry and every team has got to have a ryan crowley type. He has also kicked some great long goals from outside 50m this year. He will definitely stay.

I'm for Dunn and for keeping him but his tough act is fooling nobody. Especially with that rubbish on his top lip. Here's to a coach who will tell players not to go around looking like [censored].

Really good post.

Really good post.

Agree

You forget there is more to Sylvia's "form slump" than few poor games. He is a "showboat" player on too many occasions. Today's example of trying to do something, even Franklin would find difficult, with that (missed) goal, when Dunny was standing on his own in the goal square, says it all. Brain snap ? Maybe. A player with his experience should know better. Therefore, if he wants to go after the big money, let him.

Same with Scully. But, I feel sorry for him. He's a kid. The pressure around him,makes it very difficult for him, and the club. Whose fault is it ? Does it matter ?

But as for the "nearly" players, we have the nucleus of a great team, who need better support players than we have at present.

The biggest problem we have, is with the "experienced" guys.

Most of them have shown to be carryig so much bad baggage, that they are not helping the young guys.

But, thankfully we are slowly unearthing a future leadership group. Trouble is, they are nearly all still around 20-22 years old and need to focus on become complete footballers first.

I guess it's time to jump the gun...

Bartram missed some pathetic shots but at least he got the footy in his hands. Dunn is inconsistent but he at least gets angry and every team has got to have a ryan crowley type. He has also kicked some great long goals from outside 50m this year. He will definitely stay.

Jones has been fantastic and his disposals are actually pretty good.

Agree with your overall sentiment but strongly disagree with your evaluation of these three. I dont understand this perception that Dunn is angry for mine he is one of the softest players on our list. Had multiple chances to put his body on the line in marking contests but instead chose to play for frees. We saw how tough he was when he barbed Chapman only to panic when Chapman gave him some in return. Will stay but should be nothing more than a back up at Casey.

Jones disposal is fine when he keeps it simple but it is the 20% of time he thinks he is better than he is and tries to do too much or take the option that is beyond his skill set. If he could remove this from his game he would be a valuable contributor in the mould of Sewell at Hawthorn.

And Bartram...the less said the better.

Agree with your overall sentiment but strongly disagree with your evaluation of these three. I dont understand this perception that Dunn is angry for mine he is one of the softest players on our list. Had multiple chances to put his body on the line in marking contests but instead chose to play for frees. We saw how tough he was when he barbed Chapman only to panic when Chapman gave him some in return. Will stay but should be nothing more than a back up at Casey.

Jones disposal is fine when he keeps it simple but it is the 20% of time he thinks he is better than he is and tries to do too much or take the option that is beyond his skill set. If he could remove this from his game he would be a valuable contributor in the mould of Sewell at Hawthorn.

And Bartram...the less said the better.

+1

I'm for Dunn and for keeping him but his tough act is fooling nobody. Especially with that rubbish on his top lip. Here's to a coach who will tell players not to go around looking like [censored].

That is the best post I have read on this site.

I'm for Dunn and for keeping him but his tough act is fooling nobody. Especially with that rubbish on his top lip. Here's to a coach who will tell players not to go around looking like [censored].

Totally agree but imagine what would happen at collywobbles if they got a coach like that!

I was very disappointing in the second quarter yesterday, but was impressed with the rest of the game beyond that. We had all the play in the first, but couldn't capitalise. We easily won the third, and with a few results going our way, could have cut the margin to a very achievable target going into the last. Some of our skills were deplorable at times, but most players tried hard all day and it was unfortunately the senior players that once again left it all up to the youth.

rpfc, you have been harping on about our senior players all year, and I fully understand your position now. If we had some good leaders (this is mainly aimed at Green, Davey, Sylvia [when things are tough]), we would be very close to playing finals this year. You can't help but be a little exciting about our future with some of the kids we have, even if this year has dealt out a fair share of disappointments progress wise.

Morton and Bate. Yep, gone. Bate will get another club, no doubt about that.

Dunn and Bartram rarely play a game in which endeavour, skill, decision making and risk are all at AFL stahdard on the same day, and usually it is only one of the four. They are outstanding VFL footballers who cannot thrive at AFL level. Time to go.

Jones. He is essential to our footy. He will always make a bad decision or two in every game, nad every so often will havef s shocker in which he can hardly make a good decision, but he gets it, has attitude, his kicking is generally good and sometimes great, and he is a team footballer with LEADERSHIP ability. If we loose him or delist him it deminstrates narrow mindedness.

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rpfc, you have been harping on about our senior players all year, and I fully understand your position now. If we had some good leaders (this is mainly aimed at Green, Davey, Sylvia [when things are tough]), we would be very close to playing finals this year. You can't help but be a little exciting about our future with some of the kids we have, even if this year has dealt out a fair share of disappointments progress wise.

I think the kids are great.

They need to take over, however.

We talk about being brave and taking initiative (another poster thinks that means we should draft Fevola...i don't think that is the best way)

We should have the Leadership Group made up of the U/24 brigade with every other player on the list told that they may be a part of the future but that the future will be driven by the kids who will now lead them. If they arc up - calm them down. If you can't do that - let them go.

Our 'senior' players have a level of responsibility and influence at the club that the haven't earned and don't deserve.

You won't win games of footy against quality opposition when you have Bartram, McDonald, Garland and Frawley kicking the ball out of defence. Modern football is all about the press, pressure, and turnovers. Those four kill you by foot coming out of the backline.

It's not the players?

Fantasy Land. Population: You.

It's ALL about the players. Their attitude, their skill level, their ability to beat their man.

What good are new structures and game plans if we don't have the skill to execute them? It's all about the basics, we aren't going anywhere until they are ticked off every week. That is the only game plan we can handle.

You forget there is more to Sylvia's "form slump" than few poor games. He is a "showboat" player on too many occasions. Today's example of trying to do something, even Franklin would find difficult, with that (missed) goal, when Dunny was standing on his own in the goal square, says it all. Brain snap ? Maybe. A player with his experience should know better. Therefore, if he wants to go after the big money, let him.

Same with Scully. But, I feel sorry for him. He's a kid. The pressure around him,makes it very difficult for him, and the club. Whose fault is it ? Does it matter ?

But as for the "nearly" players, we have the nucleus of a great team, who need better support players than we have at present.

The biggest problem we have, is with the "experienced" guys.

Most of them have shown to be carryig so much bad baggage, that they are not helping the young guys.

But, thankfully we are slowly unearthing a future leadership group. Trouble is, they are nearly all still around 20-22 years old and need to focus on become complete footballers first.

I don't feel sorry at all for Scully. If he is going, he can put his hand up like Davis and say so, otherwise sign.

He is in control of the situation, so there is no way we should be feeling sorry for him.

It's not all about the players. Look at Joel Selwood. Is he a good kick? No. Selwood would struggle kicking the ball out of our backline if he was playing for us. in fact he would struggle full stop if he was playing for us. But it's not Joel Selwood, its the entire makeup of the team. And handballing ur way from the backline to the forward line is a stupid game plan that was never going to work. And coming into the corridor so early from defence is just too risky. If i was coach, i would use the full width of the ground and not be hell bent on stupid risky kicks just for the sake of it.

Ironically I think Daniher's kicking game style was better than Baileys (Geelong based) handball game style.

You won't win games of footy against quality opposition when you have Bartram, McDonald, Garland and Frawley kicking the ball out of defence. Modern football is all about the press, pressure, and turnovers. Those four kill you by foot coming out of the backline.

Frawley and Jmac can kick.Garland is ok .

None are Floweresque.

Frawley and Jmac can kick.Garland is ok .

None are Floweresque.

As a collective group they're crap and it's costing. Individually they're not a liability.

I hope you get the point. I won't hold my breath.