I posted my thoughts in the 'On the Couch' Thread but thought maybe this topic needs a separate thread.

I must have say I have absolutely no idea what the issue the players have with the Admin is but maybe someone from Demonland with connections may.

I would love to know! This is very intriguing.

The players have a list of grievances that are so serious they were mentally spent after airing them to Stynes and McLardy last week and this may be the reason they were so comprehensively shat on by Geelong. I'm sorry but what the hell are the players doing getting involved in Club Politics, I thought they got handsomely rewarded for playing football even if some of it this year and the last couple is barely above VFL level.

For a group of guys that think so highly of the coach they sure as hell didn't play like it they played like a bunch of spoilt children who couldn't get their way; if anyone is to blame for Bailey's departure it's them and them alone. I've thought for years that we've got the softest group of players in the comp and they have just proven it beyond any doubt.

HOW THE DEMONS KILLED COACH THEY LOVED BUT SAVED CEO

The overwhelming majority of players and coaches reportedly favoured Bailey as senior coach. By the time they met Stynes last week, several players had reached boiling point. By Friday, when the team travelled with the coaching staff to Geelong, the coaches and the senior players believed that Schwab was about to be sacked.

By Saturday, mentally shattered from the week's off-field distractions, the senior players barely fired a shot. Green had one touch in the first half.

You know what angers me? If you're writing an academic article, a business report, etc, you cite and reference any quotes or figures you make to give your piece credibility. However, if you're in the media, you can just write any crap you like and people will think it's true and that the journo is just "protecting their sources".

Wilson could've made up 90% of the [censored] she wrote in that article.

This. Excepting half a dozen.

  On 01/08/2011 at 15:42, rhaz said:

You know what angers me? If you're writing an academic article, a business report, etc, you cite and reference any quotes or figures you make to give your piece credibility. However, if you're in the media, you can just write any crap you like and people will think it's true and that the journo is just "protecting their sources".

Wilson could've made up 90% of the [censored] she wrote in that article.

I don't doubt that at all, but from the past few days i would imagine that there is a bit of substance to it. The lack of effort on Saturday was disgraceful and some of the players owe Jordie, Jack and Jack an apology. Plus the members who help pay their inflated salaries each week, if they don't like the club or the conditions then they should just [censored] off.

This year has soured my attitude to a number of our players and the quicker they are weeded out the better; let's hope Viney doesn't stand any nonsense from the bunch of prima donnas.

Saturday's game may be a turning point for this Club. We will see whether the players were motivated by their love of the Club or have sheer mercenary reasons for bringing us to this point in our history. They have to stand up now and take responsibility for a lot of this mess and the only way they can do it is doing something on Saturday.

The thing that stood out for me the most, and it's not news-breaking stuff I'm about to say, but the effort of our kids compared to the senior core. Our kids - which include the obvious Jordie Mac, Wattsy, JT, Chip as well as Nicholson and Strauss, they put it. For the latter 2, yeah sure, they got smashed by their opponent, but if you have a good look at the replay it's because they were running around trying to chase 2 or 3 blokes at a time.

It's probably an appropriate thread to bring it up on here, but I'm on the Twitter-ban campaign again! Last night I heard them say on "On The Couch" that the players had met with Club officals twice in the week leading up to the Geelong game, and that mentally, they were stuffed going in to the game. Well, if anyone here can do me a favour and post the photo that Cale Morton put on his Twitter account from the Friday night - the one where he took it upon himself to trash Jack Watts' bed, by turning it upside down, and putting anything that wasn't tied down on it (which included an ironing board). Am I the only supporter that thinks that leading in to a game, any game, especially on the back on your teammates complaining about off-field things within the Club, that this behaviour is totally unacceptable? Were the meetings with HQ that draining that your mental state was in total dissaray?

Hey certain players - You think the Admin aren't professional, well, take a look at your teammates.

If you are a player at an AFL club what grievances could you have with the CEO or Admin Group? I'm trying to get my head around what they are allegedly so uptight about.

What would your best guess be? Does anybody know any of the players personally to find out?

Is it:

Payments

The Scully Affair

The treatment of senior(older) players

Revolt against the Game Plan

Who the hell would know?

  On 01/08/2011 at 23:04, billy2803 said:

It's probably an appropriate thread to bring it up on here, but I'm on the Twitter-ban campaign again! Last night I heard them say on "On The Couch" that the players had met with Club officals twice in the week leading up to the Geelong game, and that mentally, they were stuffed going in to the game. Well, if anyone here can do me a favour and post the photo that Cale Morton put on his Twitter account from the Friday night - the one where he took it upon himself to trash Jack Watts' bed, by turning it upside down, and putting anything that wasn't tied down on it (which included an ironing board). Am I the only supporter that thinks that leading in to a game, any game, especially on the back on your teammates complaining about off-field things within the Club, that this behaviour is totally unacceptable? Were the meetings with HQ that draining that your mental state was in total dissaray?

I very much doubt Cale had any idea about the senior players - apparently Green, Rivers, and Jones - going to see McLardy.

There is plenty to be critical of about our player group, but posters here are living with the fairies.

First thing to remembers is that they are almost all kids. Spend some time with them - you will see that most footballers are upstanding people, but not exactly worldly. (Obviously a generalisation)

Firstly, Cale Morton taking a photo of a pre-game prank is totally unacceptable? Get a life!

Secondly, senior players airing grievances is not necessarily senior players meddling in politics. It might be senior players having serious concerns and misgivings from their perspective (and it's only one perspective, but an important one!), and feeling obliged and passionate enough about the club that they feel they ought to air their grievances to nip them in the bud. I will put a slab on that being the motive - not to get X sacked or Y re-deployed.

When Junior went to the Board and gave a blunt assessment of problems in the FD, that was leadership. When other players do it, they get criticised for being soft.

If I were on the Board, and my senior leaders held honest beliefs about the club and its direction, I would rather be told. It doesn't mean I will agree or do what they want, but it does mean future decisions made would be better informed.

  On 01/08/2011 at 16:18, RobbieF said:

I don't doubt that at all, but from the past few days i would imagine that there is a bit of substance to it. The lack of effort on Saturday was disgraceful and some of the players owe Jordie, Jack and Jack an apology. Plus the members who help pay their inflated salaries each week, if they don't like the club or the conditions then they should just [censored] off.

This year has soured my attitude to a number of our players and the quicker they are weeded out the better; let's hope Viney doesn't stand any nonsense from the bunch of prima donnas.

I'm exhausted about their behaviour aswell.

This can be the thread we have a look at the grievances - keeping in mind they might be inferred BS by Caro.

Over the past year those grievances have included:

■The manner in which several senior players, notably former captain James McDonald, were unloaded last season.

■Ongoing uncertainty among the senior line-up that they too will fall victim to the Schwab-Connolly ''premiership model'' of list management.

■The long and expensive post-season trip to China during which Tom Scully chose to return home early.

■Schwab's inconsistent comments regarding Scully, most recently that the Demons could match the annual $1 million Greater Western Sydney terms.

■Delays in the re-signing of talented young players.

■The lack of consistent structure in the football department and lack of clarity over development resources, headed up earlier this year by Viney.

Several players and coaches and other staff have become increasingly disenchanted after being interviewed by consultant Ray Andrews, whom the Demons' board paid $80,000 to review the club's entire operation. Having opened up, most believed their constructive criticism had been ignored. Further, they felt the report had been buried for political expediency

Discuss.

  On 01/08/2011 at 23:32, rpfc said:

I'm exhausted about their behaviour aswell.

This can be the thread we have a look at the grievances - keeping in mind they might be inferred BS by Caro.

Over the past year those grievances have included:

■The manner in which several senior players, notably former captain James McDonald, were unloaded last season.

■Ongoing uncertainty among the senior line-up that they too will fall victim to the Schwab-Connolly ''premiership model'' of list management.

I'll do a no-no and reply to myself...

These two we have discussed in the past - and I can see them as issues for senior players.

This is why we should have grown a pair and moved past our current 25+ players and given the reigns to the younger talent.

You cannot expect the senior group to pull in the same direction if they don't see themselves in that direction.

That being said - it is pretty weak for a player to be [censored] off at the club talking about how they will win a flag...

If Schwab was a 'negative issue' and the players thought he was going to be sacked, I can't for the life of me see how that's a reason to play so badly. I'd have thought the opposite.

In fact I can't see how the CEO's performance at any football club is worthy of player's on-field behaviour and concern.

On the other hand, do the players have to accept any rubbish that is served up to them on the basis that they are 'privileged' and 'well paid'?

Where to start...

How can such a positive vibrant club, with the excitement of good young players coming into the club, on the back of a clear direction and blueprint with which to work at, having wiped all our debt off thanks to generous members and supporters of the club, come to this !

• Individual egos
  
• Poor leadership
  
• Mis-management
  

FMD...all these areas need to be thrown up, sifted, addressed. To be blunt, and I'll say it again, the sooner our young leaders fill the the LG and a new young captain is appointed the better for the club.

  Quote

It's probably an appropriate thread to bring it up on here, but I'm on the Twitter-ban campaign again! Last night I heard them say on "On The Couch" that the players had met with Club officals twice in the week leading up to the Geelong game, and that mentally, they were stuffed going in to the game. Well, if anyone here can do me a favour and post the photo that Cale Morton put on his Twitter account from the Friday night - the one where he took it upon himself to trash Jack Watts' bed, by turning it upside down, and putting anything that wasn't tied down on it (which included an ironing board). Am I the only supporter that thinks that leading in to a game, any game, especially on the back on your teammates complaining about off-field things within the Club, that this behaviour is totally unacceptable? Were the meetings with HQ that draining that your mental state was in total dissaray?

Hey certain players - You think the Admin aren't professional, well, take a look at your teammates.

I think you will be one of only a few. If you have issues with this then you will mortified by the amount of pranks in a footy club.It was a joke relax and also Cale was the best player for Casey.

  On 01/08/2011 at 23:30, Choko said:

There is plenty to be critical of about our player group, but posters here are living with the fairies.

First thing to remembers is that they are almost all kids. Spend some time with them - you will see that most footballers are upstanding people, but not exactly worldly. (Obviously a generalisation)

Firstly, Cale Morton taking a photo of a pre-game prank is totally unacceptable? Get a life!

Secondly, senior players airing grievances is not necessarily senior players meddling in politics. It might be senior players having serious concerns and misgivings from their perspective (and it's only one perspective, but an important one!), and feeling obliged and passionate enough about the club that they feel they ought to air their grievances to nip them in the bud. I will put a slab on that being the motive - not to get X sacked or Y re-deployed.

When Junior went to the Board and gave a blunt assessment of problems in the FD, that was leadership. When other players do it, they get criticised for being soft.

If I were on the Board, and my senior leaders held honest beliefs about the club and its direction, I would rather be told. It doesn't mean I will agree or do what they want, but it does mean future decisions made would be better informed.

  On 01/08/2011 at 23:30, Choko said:

There is plenty to be critical of about our player group, but posters here are living with the fairies.

First thing to remembers is that they are almost all kids. Spend some time with them - you will see that most footballers are upstanding people, but not exactly worldly. (Obviously a generalisation)

Firstly, Cale Morton taking a photo of a pre-game prank is totally unacceptable? Get a life!

Secondly, senior players airing grievances is not necessarily senior players meddling in politics. It might be senior players having serious concerns and misgivings from their perspective (and it's only one perspective, but an important one!), and feeling obliged and passionate enough about the club that they feel they ought to air their grievances to nip them in the bud. I will put a slab on that being the motive - not to get X sacked or Y re-deployed.

When Junior went to the Board and gave a blunt assessment of problems in the FD, that was leadership. When other players do it, they get criticised for being soft.

If I were on the Board, and my senior leaders held honest beliefs about the club and its direction, I would rather be told. It doesn't mean I will agree or do what they want, but it does mean future decisions made would be better informed.

Couldn't agree more. Far too much jumping at shadows going on.

All year i have been wanting us to wash our hands with Dean Bailey even though i very much like him as a person. I was alarmed by the lack of structures, flexibility, gameplans, ability to get the players up for games etc etc etc.

Dean is now gone as we know but unfortunately i fear that our biggest problem could well be the mentality of the 40 odd guys on our list.

I did make the trip down the highway on the weekend and i would like to report on some things that i found absolutely alarming at the time before the game had even started.

First of all there was the Tweeting and twittering the day before the game. On friday afternoon a tweet came up on my news feed from Jack Trengove saying something along the lines of "Heading down the highway in Tappys car, pumping out some quality tunes" and Cale Morton reporting on the traffic over the West Gate bridge. Later on i recieved another tweet on my news feed from Cale Morton who had posted pictures of Jack Watts bed where he had made an absolute mess by putting just about everything bar the kitchen sink on it and rearranging certain items around the room in an obvious stupid prank. I honestly cant understand why these childish antics were occuring the night before the game and whether our players thought it was all a big joke?

Then there was the day of the game. I was at skilled stadium getting a coffee when i noticed Wattsy, Trenners, Tappy, Bobby, and big stef arriving at the ground (would have been around 1130ish). They casually spilled out of their cars (like me and my mates do when were getting home from a nightclub) and moped down the street to the gate looking completely asleep and sheepish. They then proceeded to sit and watch the entire Casey game out in the cold and spent more time on their phones and bantering and joking with one another than they did preparing for the game. I can tell you that the Geelong boys would have been in their rooms talking tactics, warming up and preparing themselves for the fight ahead.

I think that this along with many other reasons is why were always slow to start matches and why we tend to look sluggish. As a professional tennis coach i understand the importance of preparation from a mental and physical perspective for a match. If you arent preparing to the best of your ability and doing all the little things right unfortunately you are preparing to fail. And that is exactly what our boys did on Saturday. Unfortunately i think the mentality of our blokes is that of a bunch of mates playing local footy and not that of athletes getting paid handsomely to play AFL. Very very dissapointed.

  On 02/08/2011 at 00:28, PeterJames said:

I think you will be one of only a few. If you have issues with this then you will mortified by the amount of pranks in a footy club.It was a joke relax and also Cale was the best player for Casey.

I knew I would be in the minority (was back when I suggested a Twitter ban, so good to see nothing has changed!).

I have been involved in footy clubs before, so no amount of pranks mortify me (I have seen some pretty ordinary things). But I can't see how f**king around doing crap like that, in a motel room, the night before a match against a top 2 side, to a player who is trying his guts out for the jumper, can be seen as acceptable behaviour. The idea of going to Geelong the night before is to treat it like an interstate game, and start preparing for the game the night before, but to me, acting like this is totally taking the pi$$ out of the situation.

I don't need to get a life as Choko kindly indicated. It's about professionalism which some at the Club ooze, yet so many lack. Cale is one bloke that I would suggest needs to pull his head out of his ass and starting working hard. I'm quite sure that Malthouse wouldn't put up with his inconsistency, especially when he is showing off his maturity for the public to see. But good on Cale, he managed to get in the best (not THE best), playing in the VFL against a team who won by 20 goals. Just what the recruiters had in mind when we picked him up.

This is not jumping at shadows whatsoever.

If the players are putting in 100%, that includes match day, pre-game preparations, and post-game recovery sessions, then they have a leg to stand on when they speak to the President or Vice President. There wouldn't be too many of them that have any right questioning decisions made by administration, especially when they have continually put in poor individual performances.

You want respect? Go out there and earn it.

  On 02/08/2011 at 03:53, billy2803 said:

I knew I would be in the minority (was back when I suggested a Twitter ban, so good to see nothing has changed!).

I have been involved in footy clubs before, so no amount of pranks mortify me (I have seen some pretty ordinary things). But I can't see how f**king around doing crap like that, in a motel room, the night before a match against a top 2 side, to a player who is trying his guts out for the jumper, can be seen as acceptable behaviour. The idea of going to Geelong the night before is to treat it like an interstate game, and start preparing for the game the night before, but to me, acting like this is totally taking the pi$$ out of the situation.

I don't need to get a life as Choko kindly indicated. It's about professionalism which some at the Club ooze, yet so many lack. Cale is one bloke that I would suggest needs to pull his head out of his ass and starting working hard. I'm quite sure that Malthouse wouldn't put up with his inconsistency, especially when he is showing off his maturity for the public to see. But good on Cale, he managed to get in the best (not THE best), playing in the VFL against a team who won by 20 goals. Just what the recruiters had in mind when we picked him up.

This is not jumping at shadows whatsoever.

You say pranks dont mortify you etc, then why make it into a big deal??

Would you rather have the players strung up and stressed pre game??? Cale is having some fun, Wattsy most likely found it annoying but maybe he has done similar in the past and can appreciate that a mate would go to that much effort lol??? i know some of the most annoying pranks are thebest becasue it requires effort from them and youto fix it etc

All he did was turn some things upside down......send him to jail, the VFL, Sack him,

He is an AFL football player and should be drinking powerade and listening to relaxing music at 7pm in his PJ's in the drak on his own after only eating carbo loaded food and brushing his teath

  On 01/08/2011 at 22:51, longsuffering said:

Saturday's game may be a turning point for this Club. We will see whether the players were motivated by their love of the Club or have sheer mercenary reasons for bringing us to this point in our history. They have to stand up now and take responsibility for a lot of this mess and the only way they can do it is doing something on Saturday.

Agree LS. At some point in the future, it's inevitable that last Saturday will be seen as a major turning point for our club, whether it be for better or worse.

I don't know if anyone here is apart of the cheer-squad, or has access to it, ie. banner making. But i have a few suggestions. Would be great if other's offered some thoughts on what this weeks banner should say. But we must show that we, the supporters are united as one and right behind our great club. We support the Melbourne Football Club.

Here are my suggestions.

37,000 Red & Blue hearts beat true

Come what may, MFC we'll stand by you

We must be brave, we must dream to dare

Through our actions & actions alone

We will show we care

We must be strong, We must make our stand

It's time for this old flag, To again be grand.

If you are a player and you are paying well but you don't get a game because of the youth policy then I can understand that you'd be a bit upset particularly if your match payments depended on it; perhaps this is an area we should address.

Perhaps we should start, from this week on, picking the best team and one with a chance of winning rather than getting games in to kids that don't deserve them. Maybe we have caused a problem by giving kids cheap games at the expense of senior players who have done nothing wrong, it doesn't, I guess, give the kids much incentive if they get a game regardless of how poorly they play. Perhaps Green had a go at Nicholson because he made a mistake that Bartram wouldn't have made and that he was frustrated by the lack of senior players in the team.

I'm just throwing this out there as an issue that the club should address and that we should discuss. Is part of Cale Morton's problem that he was given games too early and he didn't have to fight hard enough to get in to the side therefore becoming lazy? We have seen enough of most of the kids and can see which ones have a future should we now as I said earlier pick the best side from now on and let the younger players earn a spot, I think we should. Part of the problem, it's been suggested, is the winning culture and if we know each week we are going to get beat then we will, if you have no expectation then you get nothing, if you tell the group that you don't expect to play finals then you won't.

Warnock, Bartram and McDonald are 3 players who probably could expect to get a game if their form was good enough, but if Schwab has told the football department not to play them for whatever reason they have every right to be [censored]. If it's to save money then they have even more right, this is, after all, their job.

The performance on the weekend was terrible and the senior players should call a press conference to express their deepest, sincerest apologies to the MFC and its supporters. The MFC should do the right thing by the players and the supporters by picking the best side each week and stop thinking of players as redundant and not in our future premiership plans.

"Warnock, Bartram and McDonald are 3 players who probably could expect to get a game if their form was good enough, but if Schwab has told the football department not to play them for whatever reason they have every right to be [censored]. If it's to save money then they have even more right, this is, after all, their job."

Explosive!

Is this a hypothetical? If not please substantiate.

  On 02/08/2011 at 05:33, RobbieF said:

Warnock, Bartram and McDonald are 3 players who probably could expect to get a game if their form was good enough, but if Schwab has told the football department not to play them for whatever reason they have every right to be [censored]. If it's to save money then they have even more right, this is, after all, their job.

I don't know if it was that explicit, but I can see how a decree similar to that would engender resentment.

But there has to be a balance between playing those players who will be around in the future and making sure you reward good form in the reserves of the older players.