What I'm saying is, and I'll make it as simple as possible: from Luke Ball's perspective (that's Luke Ball's perspective, not the Melbourne Football Club's), Melbourne are a club whose midfield is in it's formative stages. They have four promising midfielders coming in next year, who may not play the same role as Luke Ball but they do play the same position, i.e., the midfield, where there are only so many spots available hence the amount of gametime they get will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Likewise, as you said, Melbourne will need to see if players like Sylvia, Grimes, Aussie and Maric are any good in the midfield. They will do this, believe it or not, by giving them stints in the midfield. This will also impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. If some of these players succeed in the midfield, they will be given a more permanent role there, which will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Somewhere like Collingwood, with a more settled midfield structure and without four or five promising new midfielders coming in, Ball's long-term place in the side is more secure and he can be given a solid answer as to how much gametime he can expect in the short-term, at Melbourne it's a bit more hazy. I want him, but for this reason and others I'll understand if he doesn't want to come, and I won't put it down to the football department being a bunch of wankers. I hope that's cleared it up.

Yeh, good luck TSJ, I tried the same line of reasoning a couple of pages ago & got pretty much the same response.

It bothers me too that Ball himself is looking at clubs whose "window" is already open, rather than clubs whose "window" is a few years off. To me, that says something about Ball's own expectations about his physical fitness - he himself doesn't seem to be confident about his playing future past the next 2-3 years IMO.

We weren't ever going to be a major "trader" this year - we're a "drafter". Trade week is more for clubs nearer the top hoping to pick up someone for the next 2-3 years. We did very well getting pick 11 and holding onto Miller & Jamar for just one year. We will do far better than anyone else in the draft, while all the major "traders" will have only bit-parts in the draft.

What I'm saying is, and I'll make it as simple as possible: from Luke Ball's perspective (that's Luke Ball's perspective, not the Melbourne Football Club's), Melbourne are a club whose midfield is in it's formative stages. They have four promising midfielders coming in next year, who may not play the same role as Luke Ball but they do play the same position, i.e., the midfield, where there are only so many spots available hence the amount of gametime they get will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Likewise, as you said, Melbourne will need to see if players like Sylvia, Grimes, Aussie and Maric are any good in the midfield. They will do this, believe it or not, by giving them stints in the midfield. This will also impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. If some of these players succeed in the midfield, they will be given a more permanent role there, which will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Somewhere like Collingwood, with a more settled midfield structure and without four or five promising new midfielders coming in, Ball's long-term place in the side is more secure and he can be given a solid answer as to how much gametime he can expect in the short-term, at Melbourne it's a bit more hazy. I want him, but for this reason and others I'll understand if he doesn't want to come, and I won't put it down to the football department being a bunch of wankers. I hope that's cleared it up.

There's usually a certain hierarchy at most clubs and the pecking order in the midfield is no exception. I would see Ball coming in as a senior player next year and given additional time due to this seniority; with Junior set to play a more defensive role in the backline he would in fact be the uncrowned king of the middle.

He has played second fiddle to Lenny and Rob Harvey for years now and if he came to Melbourne I would think that the recruits are the ones who would have to share time and Ball would be given the lions share.

It's not Ball's fault that, as the whole industry knows, Collingwood are almost impossible to deal with.

Am I the only one who is over this "industry" speak? We are talking about a sport, not an industrial union meeting. We got our man Jolly & still have our young list intact.

They have reported that Connors has put a $800 K bounty on Ball's contract. Thank god we didn't get him.

You've either totally misunderstood, or deliberately misrepresented, what I said. I'm not saying "let's not get him because we already have enough promising midfielders", in fact, I said we should get him if we can.

What I'm saying is, and I'll make it as simple as possible: from Luke Ball's perspective (that's Luke Ball's perspective, not the Melbourne Football Club's), Melbourne are a club whose midfield is in it's formative stages. They have four promising midfielders coming in next year, who may not play the same role as Luke Ball but they do play the same position, i.e., the midfield, where there are only so many spots available hence the amount of gametime they get will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Likewise, as you said, Melbourne will need to see if players like Sylvia, Grimes, Aussie and Maric are any good in the midfield. They will do this, believe it or not, by giving them stints in the midfield. This will also impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. If some of these players succeed in the midfield, they will be given a more permanent role there, which will impact on the amount of gametime given to Luke Ball. Somewhere like Collingwood, with a more settled midfield structure and without four or five promising new midfielders coming in, Ball's long-term place in the side is more secure and he can be given a solid answer as to how much gametime he can expect in the short-term, at Melbourne it's a bit more hazy. I want him, but for this reason and others I'll understand if he doesn't want to come, and I won't put it down to the football department being a bunch of wankers. I hope that's cleared it up.

I disagree,next year we'll have 8 rotating mids and blokes like Scully and Trengove starting wing and half back as well as having a run through the middle,there'll be plenty of room for Ball in the Midfield and he'll be the one on the bottom of the pack feeding it out to our runners.We need his toughness and leadership in the middle and all our young mids will grow their own game exponentially.

Ball wants to play for a team in contention now and knows we are 4-5 years away,which by that stage he'll be 30,that may keep him at the Saints but he'll be on less money but he'll have a chance to win a flag in the next 3 years.Andrew Lovett with his pace and run and carry might reduce Ball's gametime even further.

He can't get to the Pies now and won't risk ending up anywhere in the ND,if it was 12 months down the track GC17 would pick him up in a heartbeat as they struggle to land a big fish.

It's Saints or us and with his relationship with Ross Lyon strained and the way he fits into their structure,we're odds on.

Whats the chance Luke Ball decides to sign a 1 year deal with the Saints ...

Advantages to Ball ie 1/ 100% chance to play finals football 2/ Gives him a chance to get to Collingwood next year.

Saints agree because the alternative is to lose him for nothing.

this post is spot on.... he will be back at the saints next season, playing for very little (salary wise) and then will try and get to the pies again this time next year

Whats the chance Luke Ball decides to sign a 1 year deal with the Saints ...

Advantages to Ball ie 1/ 100% chance to play finals football 2/ Gives him a chance to get to Collingwood next year.

Saints agree because the alternative is to lose him for nothing.

this post is spot on.... he will be back at the saints next season, playing for very little (salary wise) and then will try and get to the pies again this time next year

fair point...but next year he could want to go anywhere...would be funny if he wanted to come to melbourne next year!

At my behest, I believe the Dees with offer Ball 3 years on decent money, front loaded.

Saints will offer 1 year on minimal $$$. That will potentially allow him to look for a move to Collingwood next year but playing 8 games in the VFL and minimal time on ground in the AFL will do nothing to lift his value in the market.

He would be mad not to accept an offer with the Dees.

The 3 years, while one too many IMO, will be offered to counter the carrot of maybe reaching his preferred destination in 12 months. I am certain DB and the footy department see his value as a leader and mentor to a young midfield group and that will be clear in their pitch.

Analyse the situation and the answer becomes pretty clear. Options:

1. Re-sign with St.Kilda and stay on reduced money for a Coach who won't play you.

2. Enter the national draft and risk being taken by an interstate side like Port Power or Freo Dockers etc.

3. Retire.

4. Agree to join Dees through the PSD on a healthy agreed salary, begin training with new team mates on an exciting list and play for a club that wants you.

Its a difficult decision.

Analyse the situation and the answer becomes pretty clear. Options:

1. Re-sign with St.Kilda and stay on reduced money for a Coach who won't play you.

2. Enter the national draft and risk being taken by an interstate side like Port Power or Freo Dockers etc.

3. Retire.

4. Agree to join Dees through the PSD on a healthy agreed salary, begin training with new team mates on an exciting list and play for a club that wants you.

Its a difficult decision.

Technically four options, but in reality only two.

That 1 game he played made a massive difference to us in '98. We should of have won the premiership that year not saying we will do that but I think we should improve a fair bit maybe even sneak into the finals especially if we can get a quality player like Ball.

Couldn't address the return of the Ox Lyon and Tingay,'

We were no where near the flag that year.

We are still two years off from seriously challenging for the finals.

We should seriously chase Ball but we are no certainties to get him.

I agree with Redleg and Hannibal's assessments.

The only outcome where Ball has any real control over his future is with MFC or he retires. I dont think its the latter.

PSD is on the 15th Dec this year...that's a long time to wait!

We got our man Jolly & still have our young list intact.

They have reported that Connors has put a $800 K bounty on Ball's contract. Thank god we didn't get him.

The Filth's Young List still intact..After the Prelim Final i am not sure that's a Good Idea!!

I do Hope Neon & Clokey are still there-Such Talent in September cpnditions.

Luke Ball might have asked for $800K from the Filth but i doubt his price would be half that if he nominated for the PSD

Yes Thank God the Filth Didn't Get Him...Well said Old Xav well said

PSD is on the 15th Dec this year...that's a long time to wait!

Yes but I'm sure we can ask the AFL for permission for him to train with us, just like Carlton did with Chris Johnson last year.

The whole situation firstly depends on how badly he has fallen out with Ross Lyon and the rest of the saints. I'm sure we will get a Ball weighing up options article in one of the papers soon which will give us more of a clue on what his plans are.

Couldn't address the return of the Ox Lyon and Tingay,'

We were no where near the flag that year.

We beat the premiers by 10 goals. Played 1 of our worst games in the Prelim and lost by 4 or 5 goals. If Daniher didn't put McDonald on Allison and put Kowal on him instead we would have been a big chance. If we were no where near a flag then the Premiers were no where near a flag.

We beat the premiers by 10 goals. Played 1 of our worst games in the Prelim and lost by 4 or 5 goals. If Daniher didn't put McDonald on Allison and put Kowal on him instead we would have been a big chance. If we were no where near a flag then the Premiers were no where near a flag.

Biggest Problem with that 98 Prelim was that G Lyon's back was totally stuffed, he could hardly move, let alone take a grab by the 2nd Half & Jimma was not that mobile. We were one game short with that era. Sad as it was, But yes Adelaide were so very lucky & i Hated that 98 G.F

North or Adelaide...What choices!!

i'd be happy to pay ball good money but he needs to declare if he's interested in playing with melbourne sooner rather than later.

sydney got mumford wit $$$ melbourne has to do the same...

a link for people ...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melb...f-1225785172592

Biggest Problem with that 98 Prelim was that G Lyon's back was totally stuffed, he could hardly move, let alone take a grab by the 2nd Half & Jimma was not that mobile. We were one game short with that era. Sad as it was, But yes Adelaide were so very lucky & i Hated that 98 G.F

North or Adelaide...What choices!!

The way I saw it is that Lyon and Neitz were always going to have problems with Archer and Martyn. Schwarz had to step up and smash McCartney but he didn't and he was a very poor big game player Ox, add the crazy decision to play McDonald on Allison who booted 2 quick goals when goals were hard to get and that is what cost us the game. If we played Adelaide we would have beaten them by 10 goals again they had no one to play on our tall forwards.

a link for people ...

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melb...f-1225785172592

Bastards stole my Bradbury reference! :angry:

The way I saw it is that Lyon and Neitz were always going to have problems with Archer and Martyn. Schwarz had to step up and smash McCartney but he didn't and he was a very poor big game player Ox, add the crazy decision to play McDonald on Allison who booted 2 quick goals when goals were hard to get and that is what cost us the game. If we played Adelaide we would have beaten them by 10 goals again they had no one to play on our tall forwards.

Sure But Garry couldn't move- remember that padding he was wearing. Martyn just kept moving. We were down a man all match.

I cried when the ox did the knee in summer '95. That's what cost us really.

I think Ball wants a premiership, and the only realistic way he'll get one is if he stays at St. Kilda.

I would love to see him in the red and blue. He would probably shine alot more in our team, and that may appeal to him. He would get good money at the dees too. Tough decision for him. You can't get so close to a premiership and then start all over again. At the same time you don't wanna move your whole life to another state. From memory he's at Monash Uni in melb too. If his OP is a serious problem he'd be thinking about life after footy. although you can't write someone off with OP, ie Chris Judd

Analyse the situation and the answer becomes pretty clear. Options:

1. Re-sign with St.Kilda and stay on reduced money for a Coach who won't play you.

2. Enter the national draft and risk being taken by an interstate side like Port Power or Freo Dockers etc.

3. Retire.

4. Agree to join Dees through the PSD on a healthy agreed salary, begin training with new team mates on an exciting list and play for a club that wants you.

Its a difficult decision.

As someone very close to the Ball family (& another Old Xav), there seems to be a lot of unfounded gossip as to Luke's intentions. His request to join Collingwood was done with the aim of getting more playing game time and achieving a premiership. Knowing Luke (& Matt) personally, he's an intensely proud person and has often recently mentioned that he felt that his development was being hindered by his role and his value at St Kilda. It's of no surprise to me, knowing how competitive his entire family is at sport that Luke sought to leave St Kilda and wished to go to another premiership contender.

The suggestion that Paul Connors has put a price on Luke's head (as mentioned of $800k) is absolute rubbish. The simple facts are that he was offered a 3 yr deal mid year on close to 1/2 his previous salary of just under $600K at St Kilda and delayed accepting it until after the finals to focus on playing.

Strangely enough his manager's another Old Xav. I'd expect Luke to be only considering options 2 and 4, where I'd expect him to be offered a 3 yr contract on around $400K yr. For what it's worth, I think this could end up being a bargain if (as I hope we do) MFC pick him up the draft. Knowing how driven and motivated Luke is (not only in a sport sense), I see enormous benefits from drafting him, not simply from adding another talented player who's a proven contested ball winner but his leadership and example as a role model on and off the field in a manner similar to Judd at Carlton.

Edited October 9, 200915 yr by The O

As someone very close to the Ball family (& another Old Xav), there seems to be a lot of unfounded gossip as to Luke's intentions. His request to join Collingwood was done with the aim of getting more playing game time and achieving a premiership. Knowing Luke (& Matt) personally, he's an intensely proud person and has often recently mentioned that he felt that his development was being hindered by his role and his value at St Kilda. It's of no surprise to me, knowing how competitive his entire family is at sport that Luke sought to leave St Kilda and wished to go to another premiership contender.

The suggestion that Paul Connors has put a price on Luke's head (as mentioned of $800k) is absolute rubbish. The simple facts are that he was offered a 3 yr deal mid year on close to 1/2 his previous salary of just under $600K at St Kilda and delayed accepting it until after the finals to focus on playing.

Strangely enough his manager's another Old Xav. I'd expect Luke to be only considering options 2 and 4, where I'd expect him to be offered a 3 yr contract on around $400K yr. For what it's worth, I think this could end up being a bargain if (as I hope we do) MFC pick him up the draft. Knowing how driven and motivated Luke is (not only in a sport sense), I see enormous benefits from drafting him, not simply from adding another talented player who's a proven contested ball winner but his leadership and example as a role model on and off the field in a manner similar to Judd at Carlton.

Hope you are right. A person of luke's stature might be just exactly what the MFC need right now. As a mentor & playmaker on the MCG

It's now getting messy.

http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/rfnews/sa...5019612835.html

It's now getting messy.

http://www.realfooty.com.au/news/rfnews/sa...5019612835.html

Messy for the Saints and the Pies. With all that's been said and written it's hard to fathom he'd stay at the Saints. If he goes into the ND he'd probably be taken as early as perhaps Pick 14 by the Swans, or Pick 20 by Freo or Pick 22/23 by West Coast or Pick 24 by Essendon.... He won't get to the Pies in the ND. If he can't stay where he is and can't get to where he wants to go, he's got to think about an alternative destination. He still has some control over where he goes if he elects us and he could start Preseason training in two weeks time if he commits to the PSD.

I'd use our 18 on him, but would rather get him in the PSD.