Rioli has an AMAZING bag of tricks, but so do plenty of other indigenous players.

Rioli will only be an elite player if he can sustain his fitness to become a ball winning midfielder, which I think he will.

However at the moment everyone is in awe of his tricks and his great goals, but that's polish on top of what is a very good team around him. In a crap team, Rioli would struggle to make the same impact.

Morton is dominating in a terrible team, which is a credit to him.

Both will be brilliant, but Morton's size and versatility will make him a winner in the long term (hopefully)

well if they rated grimes as the 4th best player then our recruiting staff have some issues. His kicking action is flawed, not majorly..but its flawed nonetheless

So it Judd's. Says it all.

Cale will be very good. Cyril will be great. Should win a Brownlow. He's one of the most balanced and skilfull players I've seen at such a young age. He's just small. While I think Cale will certainly be tasty, Cryril is DELICIOUS!

Wow. How very Bruce of you.

Every village has one.

Yes, but ours is due to return in the next week or two... freak has a long way to go before he scales the heights of our resident buffoon.

one eyed melbourne supporters are the only ones that think he has an above average kick.

I think you could count on one hand the people on here who claim that. What we think, and this is something you may never be able to grasp, is that having an ok kick, and not an elite kick, doesn't preclude you from stardom. West, Harvey, Judd etc etc these are greats of the game, and they all had kicking actions that have drawn criticism.

Your disagreement here is rarely about how well a player can kick, but how much impact that kick has on their quality as a player, or effectiveness on the ground. I happen to agree that yes, MAYBE kicking is the most important aspect of footballers, generally speaking. But I don't think it's the ONLY important aspect, the way you do.

I also reckon that watching a player kick is one of the only times we, as supporters, get to "read" how good a player is. You can compare kicking far easier than, say, how good they are at the physical stuff, how they lead, How their football brains work... We get VERY up in arms (well, you do anyway) when it comes to kicking, because at least there we can see results, or a lack of results. With many other aspects, we are at best, just guessing.

Personally, I think if guys like Grimes, Morton and Jones kicked as well as you ask of them Freak, then we'd have the reincarnation of Voss, Hird and Buckley running around for us. Had they been that good, they wouldn't have dropped to 14, 13 and 4 in their drafts. You're placing unreasonable expectaions on them.

Keep it simple I reckon. If they're effective, they play. If not, they get worked on. If they don't improve, it's the door. As it stands all are improving. Perhaps not Jones quite as much, but I think you'll see push come to shove soon with him.

QUOTE (youami @ May 22 2009, 07:47 PM)

I have it on very good authority that the dees were going to take Grimes at pick 4 if Morton was not available. So you d expect even if Rioli was available at pick 14, dees would still have picked Grimes. Let s just hope Grimes' body holds up. Looks an outstanding prospect, very cool player in the Brett Lovett mould.

oh geez, u really are 10 years old. I can't believe you fell for the 'oh we rated our recruit so much higher than what we got him at. What a bargain' trick. Every recruiter says that.

Grimes looks great, apart from his kicking action. similar to cheney if you ask me.

Hey Freak, have you got any comments regarding this article?

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/afl...3-19742,00.html

Hey Freak, have you got any comments regarding this article?

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/sport/afl...3-19742,00.html

"In the lead-up to the 2007 draft, there was much debate about taking Cale Morton or Jack with the No. 4 pick," Connolly said.

"We really did consider taking Jack at No. 4. When he slipped through to No. 14, we were over the moon."

Lovely work. Now who's got no idea?

Are we picking on Freak?!

Good, hey Freak, I think you have a fundamental flaw in your posting...

Where is he? Been missing since Grimes' Day Out.

Because I reckon we may well win more than 4 and Richmond are a great chance for the spoon.

Imo, Scully will definately go no. 1

Could still happen almost 3 months on...

Lovely work. Now who's got no idea?

Ha.

Happens everytime.

Vespresmi (or however you spell it) would be playing but he's injured.

Definitely in the Swannies best side imo

Don't disagree with that, but Rioli was still available at their pick.

Rioli's taken the football world by storm and is unquestionably better at the moment. He may or may not be able to make the transition into the midfield, or may continue to be a HFF that flashes brilliantly into the play a few times a game.

Cale has unquestionably much more upside to come. Could be anything in future.

So for another 2 or 3 years it's a meaningless question.

By the way I don't think Cale needs any more games in defence at this stage in his career, he looks to have lost confidence and a lot of his run over the past few games since QB. Needs to be played as an offensive player till the end of the year, that's why he was recruited. If DB thinks his defensive skills need more work, that may need to be held over until next preseason or season proper. IMO it's doing him more harm than good ATM.

By the way I don't think Cale needs any more games in defence at this stage in his career, he looks to have lost confidence and a lot of his run over the past few games since QB. Needs to be played as an offensive player till the end of the year, that's why he was recruited. If DB thinks his defensive skills need more work, that may need to be held over until next preseason or season proper. IMO it's doing him more harm than good ATM.

Agree with this. He's struggling atm, and is playing against his natural game which is to run and run and run and rack up lots of touches. I think his future is as an attacking wingman. He'd be very hard to match up on, and can chime in with a few goals a match too from there as we've seen already.

As for the Morton vs Rioli debate, Rioli is better at the moment. His two faults at time of drafting were his attitude/work ethic, and his tank. He was so uninterested during draft camp that he actually fell asleep in an interview with one of the clubs! It seems Hawthorn have been able to whip him into shape though. THe question is whether he will be able to build up his tank enough to make the transition to midfield, or whether he will always be confined to a HFF.

Morton has more upside IMO. He could become insanely damaging as an attacking wingman/midfielder. I'm thinking Cam Bruce before he got his shoulder crunched and declined in form and skills. 30 touches, 3-4 goals a game damaging. He could be that player, and be hard to match up on due to his height and aerobic capacity. It's too early to tell who will be better now anyway. Let's discuss it in 4-5 years time

Cyril has had far more impact but he has slotted into a premier team - question could be asked, would Morton have fitted into that team??

I guess the question should be asked after they have both had 3 years in the competition.

Rioli's taken the football world by storm and is unquestionably better at the moment. He may or may not be able to make the transition into the midfield, or may continue to be a HFF that flashes brilliantly into the play a few times a game.

Cale has unquestionably much more upside to come. Could be anything in future.

So for another 2 or 3 years it's a meaningless question.

By the way I don't think Cale needs any more games in defence at this stage in his career, he looks to have lost confidence and a lot of his run over the past few games since QB. Needs to be played as an offensive player till the end of the year, that's why he was recruited. If DB thinks his defensive skills need more work, that may need to be held over until next preseason or season proper. IMO it's doing him more harm than good ATM.

I have to disgaree with this post. Cale has some deficiencies in his game which are potentially terminal. Now I know that he has only played thirty something games but should he get to 80 games and he hasn't resolved them it will severely limit his value to the team.

He must not be allowed to play his cheap possession game at this stage of his career. It will do far more harm than good, both for his devlopment and the team's psyche. Cale Morton must not get an easy ride.

Rioli's taken the football world by storm and is unquestionably better at the moment. He may or may not be able to make the transition into the midfield, or may continue to be a HFF that flashes brilliantly into the play a few times a game.

Cale has unquestionably much more upside to come. Could be anything in future.

So for another 2 or 3 years it's a meaningless question.

By the way I don't think Cale needs any more games in defence at this stage in his career, he looks to have lost confidence and a lot of his run over the past few games since QB. Needs to be played as an offensive player till the end of the year, that's why he was recruited. If DB thinks his defensive skills need more work, that may need to be held over until next preseason or season proper. IMO it's doing him more harm than good ATM.

I have to disgaree with this post. Cale has some deficiencies in his game which are potentially terminal. Now I know that he has only played thirty something games but should he get to 80 games and he hasn't resolved them it will severely limit his value to the team.

He must not be allowed to play his cheap possession game at this stage of his career. It will do far more harm than good, both for his devlopment and the team's psyche. Cale Morton must not get an easy ride.

I think we'll all reflect very well on this draft. Morton will be a gun, as will Grimes - both of whom the club rated as top ten picks. I think the club was also surprised to pick Maric up at pick 21. I think all three will play very important roles for the MFC in due course.

Not sure why a comparison is warranted so early in their careers

We have Morton and the Hawks have Rioli and thats not changing anytime soon if ever

If the MFC dont lock Morton in the weights room thius summer I will kill somebody down there.

He must put in 5kgs minimum, and improve his strength GREATLY.

It will be his third preseason, so no more excuses.

If the MFC dont lock Morton in the weights room thius summer I will kill somebody down there.

He must put in 5kgs minimum, and improve his strength GREATLY.

It will be his third preseason, so no more excuses.

Your clueless.

No point bulking up at once. It must be a progressive thing and I'm sure the fitness and conditioning staff are handling this.

Your clueless.

No point bulking up at once. It must be a progressive thing and I'm sure the fitness and conditioning staff are handling this.

Your clueless.

I never said to bulk up at once.

Oh and you're clueless.

However, no offence to Cale, but a forward line like

F Wonaeamirri Jurrah Jetta

HF Rioli Watts Davey

Doesn't look bad.

O well

Rioli has an AMAZING bag of tricks, but so do plenty of other indigenous players.

Rioli will only be an elite player if he can sustain his fitness to become a ball winning midfielder, which I think he will.

However at the moment everyone is in awe of his tricks and his great goals, but that's polish on top of what is a very good team around him. In a crap team, Rioli would struggle to make the same impact.

Morton is dominating in a terrible team, which is a credit to him.

Both will be brilliant, but Morton's size and versatility will make him a winner in the long term (hopefully)

Agree with what you say about Rioli becoming an elite midfielder Jaded but I don't think it's just the bag of tricks that makes everyone's mouth water.

He is an amazing all-round player and he would stand out big time if he played for the dee's. Think about his tackle in the grand final last year? He has it all and I honestly mean ALL. I can't think of anything he can't do. Rioli is an absolute gem and my prediction is that he will always be a better/more influential player than Morton. I'm very worried about the amount of hype over Morton's "potential". I guess it's all we have to ease our minds during these rough times. (Dismiss the rhyme).

If the MFC dont lock Morton in the weights room thius summer I will kill somebody down there.

He must put in 5kgs minimum, and improve his strength GREATLY.

It will be his third preseason, so no more excuses.

It does and will take time for Morton to gain strength YM. He will still be skinny/thin-ish throughout his career much like Bruce.

It's not about excuses. It's all about time with Morton.

Edited July 9, 200916 yr by stevethemanjordan

At the moment I would swap Morton for Rioli.

It's no coincedence that since Rioli has been out of the Hawks lineup they've been pumped 3 weeks in a row.

Right now I'd change Rioli for Morton, but not by a huge amount.

I have question marks over Morton's ability to turn a match, and also his courage under duress. When he gets bigger, will that youthful apprehension evaporate? Regardless of whether or not it will, I think we'll be hearing the wankers at Bigfooty using the word "squib" with Morton in a lot of threads.

It's no coincedence that since Rioli has been out of the Hawks lineup they've been pumped 3 weeks in a row.

They were being pumped when he was in.

There are bigger issues at stake with the Hawks.

At the moment I would swap Morton for Rioli.

It's no coincedence that since Rioli has been out of the Hawks lineup they've been pumped 3 weeks in a row.

They were being pumped when he was in.

There are bigger issues at stake with the Hawks.

I tell you how well the Hawks are travelling.

AWFUL.

I keep hearing they are 1 game and % out of the eight. What many fail to realise is they have 6 wins from 14 rounds. 2 of those wins were over Melbourne.

That is how well they are travelling.