I agree. I'm particularly worried about Dunn. He's been one of the worst of a bad lot so far this year. A real worry.

Bell's a fair-to-good player in my eyes, that should rate as a break-even when marking the recruiters.

Fair to good with pick 15??

You're an easy marker Nasher, would you like to do my next PDR?

I agree. I'm particularly worried about Dunn. He's been one of the worst of a bad lot so far this year. A real worry.

He's in footballing purgatory Nasher. One of the best games I saw him play was his first one when he kicked 3 or 4 goals as a leading forward. Not to mention this was where he played at TAC level. His confidence and form are shot because he's constantly played out of position. He's not a defender or a tagger. I had my hopes that he could pull of a midfield role but he lacks the nouse. If anything he is an agile HFF.

Fair to good with pick 15??

Yes. I will definitely settle for fair to good as a pass for pick 15. If you want, later on I'll average up the number of duds taken in the the 10-20 range in the last 10 years and we can look at what the trends are.

Yes. I will definitely settle for fair to good as a pass for pick 15. If you want, later on I'll average up the number of duds taken in the the 10-20 range in the last 10 years and we can look at what the trends are.

Sure, there is definitely a chance we'd pick up a dud with pick 15...

However Bruce is 29 next yr...he has 2 seasons left. plus he isn't even a damaging player anymore. A team looking to bolster their list for a premiership would defininetly be interested....however we are not even looking finals in the next yr or two?

So if we got a player like Bate at pick 15 i'd be stoked. Even a player that turns out solid would be better.

And who knows... we could pick up an absolute gem

Sure, there is definitely a chance we'd pick up a dud with pick 15...

However Bruce is 29 next yr...he has 2 seasons left. plus he isn't even a damaging player anymore. A team looking to bolster their list for a premiership would defininetly be interested....however we are not even looking finals in the next yr or two?

So if we got a player like Bate at pick 15 i'd be stoked. Even a player that turns out solid would be better.

And who knows... we could pick up an absolute gem

No other team in their right mind would pick him let alone give up a draft pick.

Yes. I will definitely settle for fair to good as a pass for pick 15. If you want, later on I'll average up the number of duds taken in the the 10-20 range in the last 10 years and we can look at what the trends are.

Bell is a very limited footballer. Tries hard, but is just not good enough. I'm not sure of his contract situation, but if he was out of contract I'd trade or delist.

With the upcoming draft changes we need to capitalise on this year's talent pool. There may be teams such as Port, St. Kilda, Carlton, North who finish 7-10 but may be looking to 'top up' for another shot at the premiership. The teams who finish in this region will have picks 7-10 in the draft. Maybe a pick from one of them could be lured.

Bell is a very limited footballer. Tries hard, but is just not good enough. I'm not sure of his contract situation, but if he was out of contract I'd trade or delist.

Apparently Adelaide were keen last year and everyone was scared that he'd do a runner back home.

With the upcoming draft changes we need to capitalise on this year's talent pool. There may be teams such as Port, St. Kilda, Carlton, North who finish 7-10 but may be looking to 'top up' for another shot at the premiership. The teams who finish in this region will have picks 7-10 in the draft. Maybe a pick from one of them could be lured.

It is for this very reason that clubs will not give up any picks. Unless its too good, teams will not give up a pick in the top 25 next year.

If you want, later on I'll average up the number of duds taken in the the 10-20 range in the last 10 years and we can look at what the trends are.

Thats a bit juvenile there Nasher.

My point simply is, that Craig Cameron is a failure and a massive part of the reason we find ourselves sitting 16th and coming off a flogging at the hands of a side that is fair at best.

Yze (1)(2)(5)

Bruce and Green trade bait

Thats a bit juvenile there Nasher.

Why is it juvenile? I was offering to provide evidence for my assertion.

My point simply is, that Craig Cameron is a failure and a massive part of the reason we find ourselves sitting 16th and coming off a flogging at the hands of a side that is fair at best.

That may well be the case (and it's an argument that has been done to death on here that I can't be bothered with), but that's got nothing to do with the criteria for pass/fail on one individual pick.

Initally I read title and thought..ok..here we go again. Then read some posts and I cant help but feel that teh more this season persists this actually becomes a harder question. Seemed almost easy at season starts.

Well what do we know.

Part One :

Neita is gone

Clogs will be gone

this we know.

now.. the likely's

If I have to make a call on this I'll do so with reservation:

Robbo. Just cant see him coming back to top form, his current prior to injury was medicre at best. Sorry folks. He's gone for mine.

Wheels ? Frustrating probaly for him as much as us is his form. A possible goner.

I had heard whispers that Jeff was planning on going to. ( put that on hold ) he's 50/50

I would have said Ooze was a cert to go .. he may enjoy a 9th and final life if others cant come up. He does play a tunnelled selfish style..but its consistant!!

Cant see Chopper making the grade.

Russian..hasnt shown enough for me. He goes

these almost choose themselves..

part two will look at the 'balancing act' of retention v trade

I know it is early days but nothing like forward planning.

OUT: White (1),Yze(2),Bruce(3),Jamar(4),Carroll (5).

All for various reasons including 1 Over the hill, 2 Selfish, 3 Brainless, 4 No Guts, 5 Slow, 6 Can't kick,& Can't think and run at the same time. 8, No awareness, 9, Can't handball.

Heaps a other reasons you could throw in.

Whether they are gone we'll soon see but I'm sure there will be surprises among the predictables when the big cull comes at the end of the season!!!

So depressed after todays match to put it mildly!!!!!!!!

Bailey and Bell !

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH.

Shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up.

I don't like 'trade bait' talk at the best of times, but half a dozen people have been putting Green's name forward, which just bewilders me.

Brad Green is a mile ahead in our best and fairest, the only player to have put something in every week. He's shown particular courage over the last few weeks backing into packs in defense, pretending he's Jared Rivers.

3rd place for goals, despite playing right around the ground and heavily in defence in the last few games.

1st for inside 50's, and see above.

Equal 2nd disposals. (and among our best efficiency rates as well)

4th for tackles. Brad Green is one of our top tacklers, do you understand this?

He's also going to be eligible for veterans listing from next year (Neitz and Yze are our current veterans, so the spots will open up), this HALVES his salary cap portion.

Talk of trading Green is bizarre, idiotic and offensive.

Craig Cameron = Pathetic

Best thing he has ever done for us is leave.

And as for the pass-fail line for draft picks 10-20.

Two or three each draft are basically fizzers.

Maybe one per draft is truly excellent.

Most are average ok players.

Jones and especially Bate are among the best, possibly are THE best picks from the 10-20 range since 2002.

Smith was our fizzer.

Bell, Dunn and Frawley are our other three, and are pretty much the norm of what to expect from this part of the draft.

Cameron Wood, Nathan Brown (Coll.), Jack Riewolt, Grant Birchall, Danny Meyer and Byron Schammer are examples of the other better performed/more promising selections from this range. And that's drawing on five years, fifty picks all up.

It'd be interesting to rate them in order, but I haven't got that much time.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH.

Shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up.

I don't like 'trade bait' talk at the best of times, but half a dozen people have been putting Green's name forward, which just bewilders me.

Brad Green is a mile ahead in our best and fairest, the only player to have put something in every week. He's shown particular courage over the last few weeks backing into packs in defense, pretending he's Jared Rivers.

3rd place for goals, despite playing right around the ground and heavily in defence in the last few games.

1st for inside 50's, and see above.

Equal 2nd disposals. (and among our best efficiency rates as well)

4th for tackles. Brad Green is one of our top tacklers, do you understand this?

He's also going to be eligible for veterans listing from next year (Neitz and Yze are our current veterans, so the spots will open up), this HALVES his salary cap portion.

Talk of trading Green is bizarre, idiotic and offensive.

Agreed.

I can deal with Bruce talk of trades, but not Green.

Agreed.

I can deal with Bruce talk of trades, but not Green.

I'm with you guys as well......

Green has been, while a little inconsistent, still by far our best this season.

Plus I have long believed he has more up side than Bruce.

I agree with most people on yze, holland, bruce, but think that if we finish bottom should trade number 1 per season pick to any club that wants ben cousins, for a round one pick in the nation draft, thats how we get early draft pick.

I agree with most people on yze, holland, bruce, but think that if we finish bottom should trade number 1 per season pick to any club that wants ben cousins, for a round one pick in the nation draft, thats how we get early draft pick.

You cannot trade a PSD pick.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHH.

Shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up.

I don't like 'trade bait' talk at the best of times, but half a dozen people have been putting Green's name forward, which just bewilders me.

Brad Green is a mile ahead in our best and fairest, the only player to have put something in every week. He's shown particular courage over the last few weeks backing into packs in defense, pretending he's Jared Rivers.

3rd place for goals, despite playing right around the ground and heavily in defence in the last few games.

1st for inside 50's, and see above.

Equal 2nd disposals. (and among our best efficiency rates as well)

4th for tackles. Brad Green is one of our top tacklers, do you understand this?

He's also going to be eligible for veterans listing from next year (Neitz and Yze are our current veterans, so the spots will open up), this HALVES his salary cap portion.

Talk of trading Green is bizarre, idiotic and offensive.

Of all the hand wringing in this thread that is the most offensive and idiotic thing you've read?!

Green will not be around when and if we get to our next premiership window. To me this is an indisputable assertion based on where we are at right now and how far Green has to go.

If he can provide a draft pick toward that end - of a flag - then we trade him. We have been, with the exception of Woewodin, far too protective of careers.

Let's go for a flag, and sacrifices will have to be made.

Green's been great this year, agree completely...

But DD, you DO have to understand that talk of trade has nothing to do with insulting him. If anything it's a compliment.

Going on the old saying that you have to trade something to get something... We DO need lots of draft picks and Green is one of about 3 or 4 players that COULD attract a round 1 pick...

Of course we'd rather keep players, but we need draft picks more than a player in his late twenties who may never play in a flag. I reckon even Brad would be keen to play for someone like Geelong, Hawthorn, the Lions etc etc who are within striing distace of a flag chance...

GONE

Neitz, Yze, C.Johnson, Weetra, Carroll, Bode

TRADE

Green(possibly the only player we can get a decent pick for, won't get anything for Bruce)

Sylvia(has done nothing)

Miller(same as Sylvia)

Bell(disappointing season)

BORDERLINE

Dunn, P.Johnson, Holland(only due to our lack of key forwards, I wouldn't like to rely on Newton, Miller and some raw 18 year olds next year), Moloney

FFS WHITE .