rjay

I suspect he will surprise a few... Calsher Dear went pick 56 in 2023 draft, another athletic bean pole, probably not expected to do much for a few years if at all. ...but in 2024 he became a key member in the forward half and carried it on this season. White will surprise, he has the athleticism to make rapid improvement.

Is he? I'm being serious here and hope that JT and co can judge this. Given it's supposed to be an average draft at best then he hasn't been displaying those attributes against better competition. I'm not trying to be difficult, just saying that because he's the best small forward from this crop doesn't necessarily translate to being a gun small forward at AFL level. In the 2020 draft Will Phillips was seen as the best pure mid and selected at pick 3 and now delisted. Statistics and highlights won't tell the story. Good recruiting people on the ground will. If we pick him then I hope he is all we want and more. Whoever we take, I hope we pick the eye teeth out of the draft. There will be good talent and maybe he is one. Cheers.

We could certainly do with another top notch small forward...so maybe that's exactly what we need. ...but is it him? does he fill this role or is he being mentioned only because he plays this role? I guess time will tell.

I don't see it with 'Dovaston'... ...but having said that, I'm not a good judge just looking at 5mins of highlights.

In a shallow draft I think it's more important than ever to pick best available. The idea of picking on needs is fraught. The phantom draft gurus can go for needs or what they perceive as needs, we need to take best available. We can't get too cute.

I like the look of him but the Heeney comparison is a bit off the mark...

We probably have wires crossed here...I didn't shift the goal posts. ...but your statement above didn't ring true with me. The downfall of the club to me is on the board and admin. As for the culture of the club, it's a whole club thing from the top down. It's not just on Max...or just on the board but they do lead the way.

The board provide the environment that the team works within. They hire the CEO, The Coach, provide the club facilities, make sure that the bills are paid ...among other things. Adam puts it better than me...

I'm not talking about social habits...at all. I'm talking about on ground performance and we're the club who were siting on top of the AFL world in 2021 have slid down to basically a rebuild with nothing more to show for it. That is on the board. All clubs have the same social habits, if you think they don't you're dreaming and if you think Max could stop it or any captain for that matter you're also dreaming. Spot on...

I'm not questioning his insight... ...but to say the board and administration aren't ultimately responsible for problems at the club is wrong. The buck stops with them, not Max. Of course they don't get down in the trenches.. If there are issues then they have the ultimate responsibility to see that they (the issues) are fixed. The board are responsible for putting in senior management to control the day to day running of the club. If those people are not doing there jobs then they get moved on, like in any organisation. Change has now happened but maybe some of these things should have been addressed earlier. Yes, but ultimately its the boards responsibility.

Sorry, but that is rubbish. The buck stops with the board. That's what they are there for, to oversee the operations of the whole club and given its main business is football that's where they needed to pay most attention. If Max was a problem or not doing his job as skipper it was up to the board to put it right.

I understand your point but we don't know that Max refused, or wanted to ruck purely on his terms. My thoughts on this are that Max has never been able to play as a forward, he just can't do it. As you well know (as a forward yourself) it's not that easy. We had tried it before when the wisdom of the FD of the time tried to make Max a forward and Spencer the number one ruck (at Casey). It didn't work there and was never going to work at AFL level. So we tried again, and it again failed. No surprises there. Maybe rather than Max refusing or wanting to play only on his terms which is an interesting narrative, the FD realised we were better as a team with Max in the ruck and that Grundy was not a forward. It could really be a simple as this.

It sure was a bewildering decision 'Macca', you would have to hope their was some solid reasoning behind it...

I think I said similar on the Guerra thread. Clearing some cap space is surely to lock in the likes of Langford and Lindsay going forward.

That's a whole different story 'Macca'...and we don't know what was going on behind the scenes there. My point was Grundy was a bad list call and that's not on Max.

Grundy was a bad list call. That's not on Max.

I thought they were the same band...

You mightn't be against it but no club in North's position is trading out their 2026 first rounder.

I think that's a definite...

It's very possible 'Adam'...our position is not as important as seeing a positive direction. 2026 is going to be a fascinating year for us.

Just a quick look at a couple of average/poor draft years, first round picks... 2016 - 1 was McGrath - average player, 2 was Taranto, 3 McLuggage and 19 English. To me McLuggage is the pick of that lot... 2020 - 1 JUH a write off to date, 2 Thilthorpe, 20 Holmes, 21 Bowey Holmes probably the pick but the other 2 are good. There were of course some other serviceable players in both drafts but if you look at EFC's 3 first rounders in 2020 then it was an average draft. Add that to McGrath in 2016 and no wonder they have struggled. The point is...I hope we can find something in this draft (over to you JT) and hold both our picks for 2026 where we're more likely to land an A grader. Unlikely to replace Trac and Oliver from this years crop but development to Langford, Lindsay, Windsor and co plus a refreshed club is where we could make gains.

With Goldy out she would be an ideal in...

Good hands in close...

As I said...

Lets wait and see... I hope he is good but I have reservations. After all the talk from last preseason I would rather us be a little (lot) more low key. Yes, we have had a big trade period and some things needed to be addressed & spoken about. My personal opinion is that we are overplaying it. ...talk is cheap.