Jaded No More

Another 530 joined up yesterday, which is apparently a club record, plus we beat Collingwood (which is always a handy bonus :D) We're now sitting on 27,128. Not long to go now! http://www.melbournefc.com.au/news/newsart...05/default.aspx Also it was great to see players getting involved. Both Belly and Blease (who was busy sending a text ) were standing at the scarf table when we went up to collect our scarves, which I thought was a nice touch.

Indeed. And when those two forwards happen to be Bate and Miller (or worse, PJ), you're always going to struggle, as neither are good enough to be the main attraction. In the short term, Robbo will help this a fair bit, in the long term, it's Watts and Jurrah hopefully.

We've still got it High Tower, my comment was clearly intended as a joke, although it shocks me that people thought Frawley wasn't good. That they want him dropped is even more astonishing. But as you said, we're all entitled to our opinion.

Do you understand though, that this tactic is only effective when you are winning the ball cleanly and moving it through the centre quickly? If the ball has come out of our forward line, moved back up the ground and is now coming back, you are not going to have 6 forwards standing around looking pretty while all that is going on. No team plays with 6 or even 5 permanent forwards anymore. Everyone has to push up the ground to provide support or alternative to block their man from winning the ball. I don't remember who, but one of Carlton's defenders (Waite?) kicked 2 or 3 goals on Thursday night. If ANY of our forwards ever allowed their man to kick even one goal, they should be dragged and banished. The trick is to know when to get back into your forward spot once you win possession (and we're talking winning possession in general play, not out of the centre). Obviously, our forwards haven't really worked that out yet, and moreover, some of them (especially Bate), are just not quick enough to suit this style IMO.

At least we're hitting our OWN targets this year! I'm a cup one-quarter full type of girl :D

Seriously, Frawley is not going to get dropped and anyone who suggests otherwise should ease up on the drugs. If neither Maric nor Aussie are fit (I also heard on radio that Aussie should be right to go this week), the team should stay the same. There is a lot to be said for consistency in a team's make-up. Too many changes, too early on, especially when our performance was not completely horrible, might do more harm than good, especially when you're not going to vastly improve the team by making those changes. The only players who are currently not in the team, who deserve to push out players who are currently in the team, are Maric, Aussie, Robbo, Grimes and Whelan. When those 5 are fit, the selection becomes more about match-ups and balance, as opposed to "oh my god Sylvia will rescue our forward line, bring him in". P.S.- Newton will be as useful to our already incompetent forward line as he would be to the NASA team.

A lot of the rotations which happened yesterday through the midfield and forwardline, were instigated by the players. I sit right near the bench and saw a number of times players put their hand up and request to come off. Not sure if it's a fitness issue or a management issue. You don't adapt your game plan to suit crap players who can't hit a target. You find players who can hit a target!

Old, Ordinary, The reincarnation of Christ himself

Two words: JACK WATTS

That's because our forwards don't run back to position quick enough once we win the contest. Every single time the Roos kicked out, their defenders were nicely spread out and kept pushing up the ground as they cleared the 50m arc. Our forwards ran with them, as they should. When a turnover did occur, and we won possession, our forwards were trying to call for the ball 70m from goal instead of running back into the forward 50 and letting the midfielders do the linking. This means that either our forwards aren't fit enough or fast enough to get back into position (hello Aaron Davey back into the damn forward line!), or they are just really dumb. Perhaps it is a combination of both. Bailey does not tell his players to stay away from the forward line. However if you understood the idea of zones and fast possession-oriented football, you would realise that in order to execute this, you need to have players who are fast, smart and can read the play. Or alternatively a forward who is so good, that you can leave him one on one and trust that he'll kick goals for you (i.e.- Fev, Buddy, Brown, Pavlich). Bailey can only work with what he has, which at the moment is not much. On the odd chance that we did win a clean clearance and got the ball into our forwards quickly, there were often enough of them in there to compete (we were winning the clearances up to half time, which is why we remained competitive*). That they are all fairly average and struggle to win a contest is another matter all together. I think at half time the Roos had 8 contested marks and we had 1. That is not a structural problem, it's a crapness problem. *Note also that a classy midfield which gets first use of the ball is always going to make your forwards look better. We do not have a classy midfield, which in my opinion is a much bigger issue than our current forward line. Edit: I also wanted to add that, when you have ordinary forwards who can't take contested marks (and funny that someone just started a thread to tell us that we took just 1 contested mark today), the best way to combat this is to have your forwards move up with the game, and then be clever enough to push back when we win possession. This is meant to create a situation where they end up free in the forward line, or alternatively lose their direct opponent and end up in a one-on-one contest with a mismatched defender, where they have a better chance of taking the mark. Of course this plan fails when our forwards are too unfit/slow/dumb to push back hard enough to create this situation.

Yeah, don't tell that to your kids folks

I'm still recovering from that comment. Care to tell us why the hell you think he was WOG? For me it's quite simple, are Maric and Aussie fit? If the answer is yes, I would take out Buckley (go learn to be accountable at Casey!) and probably Jetta (thought Bennell coped with the intensity and pace a lot better than Jetta did, even though he is less physically developed). You could argue that these two boys need to develop a bit more at Casey, or you could argue that they'll never learn at VFL level what is truly required of them, and that AFL game time is the best way to fast track their development (given that we're pretty ordinary anyway, and you may as well develop them now). Would love to bring in Martin as well, but maybe a few weeks learning the game as a forward at Casey will help us more in the long term. Sylvia needs to dominate at VFL level. He does NOT deserve an automatic start.

Miller can contest and bring ball to ground, and take good strong marks. Who else in our forward line can do that right now? Name one player you'd have replacing Miller, before saying "he can go". If he had two other strong forwards around him, he'd be an excellent 3rd tall. He doesn't, but at least I know that he'll make a contest every time, giving the occasional crumber (when they make it back in time ) a chance.

Grazman is right. It doesn't matter where you play these days, accountability is not an option, it's a must Maybe Bailey is trying to instill that accountability into him by playing him in the backline?

Plus what do you expect our forwards to do when their direct opponent is pushing up the ground? They have to make them accountable. So when you don't win enough clear ball at the centre bounce and you don't have a forward who commands enough respect to drag one or two defenders out of the game and into the square, that's what you are left with.

Well that only took one round. A new Demonland record?

Harsh and ridiculous! :angry: Firstly, it is not his job to kick 50m goals, even our so called forwards can't do that. Secondly, he runs ALL DAY long and has not slowed down as the years have gone on. Finally, he is the one player that you know will give you 140% every single time he is out there. He throws himself around the packs, and courage alone will get him picked every single week. Trash talking our captain and it's only Round 1. FFS!

I like that someone else actually rates shut-down defenders enough to give them top votes. Warnock has gone from "who the hell is that" to "how the hell do I get this dude off my arse"!

Given that I'm slightly obsessed with him and his injury-prone body, I watched him closely today. He wasn't brilliant, no, but when you look at the replay (not sure why you would, but if you do :D), you'll see that he did a few things that screamed 'Rivers'. Inspector Gadget arms, suicidal marking and spoiling attempts, getting to the right place at the right time. I just feel so much more confident when he's out there, and I think the other defenders do too. He is basically a freak in the way he reads the play, and I hope like hell that he can keep that body of his going, because I think a few of us have forgotten just how good he really is when he's up and going. Rivers and McLean up and running together makes us 20-30% better.

Davey hasn't used his pace to our advantage in 2 years. Moving him into the midfield was a mistake in my opinion. He was the most damaging small forward going around, and now he can hardly get a touch.

Bartram shut down Harvey pretty effectively, and given that Harvey generally rips us apart, that's a victory in my eyes. Also there was a period of time where Bartram was on the end of 3 terrible kicks that floated over his head or out of bounds. IMO he's far better in that tagging position than Dunn.

When is the last time Davey was really on? He has been really disappointing for a really long time now. Just fails to influence the game, gives away messy free kicks and is shut down too easily. Disappointing. Bate is Bate, horrible below the knees, slow as anything, can't mark one on one. McLean doesn't seem fit, he spent a fair bit of time on the bench and looked stuffed when he came off. Simpson did a good job running him around. Hopefully as his fitness improves so will his output. He's not someone that I worry about because you just know he'll come good, but I do worry that when he's not on we really struggle. PJ was horrendous, and Buckley needs to get the hell out of the backline. There were still plenty of positives though. Petterd was excellent up forward. Love love love him in that position. Bennell's game is underrated. He did some really clever things under pressure and held his own in one-on-one contests. Jetta can win the ball, now he just needs to take a deep breath before dishing it off. The ideas are good, execution not so much. Jones' disposal has improved out of sight. West will be great for his career IMO. Cheney was fantastic, Rivers did some things that only Rivers can do (and didn't die in the process), and Warnock is just so safe.

Jared Rivers... Fully game... No broken bones... Victory! Now we just need to get Brock and Rivers playing well together. Petterd was excellent up forward, and the first gamers really impressed. Is it too early to ask for Watts to get a game? :D

If Martin becomes half as good as Richo, I think we'll all be thrilled!

Good move! If we can develop Martin into a multi-dimensional tall (hopefully we'll have more success than we did with Miller <_< ), it will help us cover a multitude of deficiencies while still ensuring that Martin doesn't miss out on senior game time due to team balance issues. His kicking seems to be the only skill that he lacks as a forward, however goal kicking is probably one of the most fixable qualities in a player. His size, strength and marking ability are natural attributes that will most likely serve him well. Besides, he learnt to be a defender in what, 8 weeks? Give him another 4 and he'll win the Coleman