7 minutes ago, binman said:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/melbourne-s-conspiracy-movement-is-traumatised-incoherent-and-potentially-dangerous-20211117-p599qk.html

Thanks for including that link. And for the record I am not Elise Thomas although obviously we share similar opinions.

Edited November 17, 20213 yr by La Dee-vina Comedia
typo

16 hours ago, daisycutter said:

neither should the actions of extremist minorities detract from the majority of lawful and peaceful demonstrators whether you agree or disagree with their protest. they should be kept separate.

I agree with this daisy and i 100% support the right to protest. 

Opposing the pandemic bill, or even the process by which it has been developed and communicated (which is an issue i have with it) is absolutely appropriate.

But i would suggest, the issue that the lawful and peaceful demonstrators need to consider is whether by attending a protest with  extremist minorities they are in effect being coopted by those extremists. 

Because that is exactly the strategy of the extremists - create a false sense of support for their extreme views.

It is worth noting in this context who actually organized the current protests. It would appear the organizers are disparate extreme groups communicating via encrypted messaging services, as was the case with construction worker 'protests' ('wear hi vis') 

Perhaps the lawful and peaceful demonstrators opposing the pandemic bill could organise their own protest at a completely different site (eg the Exhibition Building - where in 1901 the first Federal Parliament was opened, and continued to sit until Canberra became the capital) so it is clear they do not support the views and actions of the extremist minorities.

 

22 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

Thanks for including that link. And for the record I am not Elise Thomas although obviously we share similar opinions.

Have you ever been in the same room as Elise?

29 minutes ago, binman said:

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/melbourne-s-conspiracy-movement-is-traumatised-incoherent-and-potentially-dangerous-20211117-p599qk.html

I think she dismisses a bit too easily the way the far-right uses these events for their purposes:

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/far-right-protester-charged-by-counter-terror-police-amid-talk-of-killing-daniel-andrews-20211117-p599qx.html

"... the far right in Australia had long hoped for an event that would provide a series of hard knocks to the community and foster mass public frustration with governments.

“COVID has delivered exactly what they have wanted. It has delivered it to them on a silver platter ... Freedoms and liberties have been temporarily rolled back and it’s been a time of extraordinary difficulty for Australians – and with a lot of real trauma.”

However, it was crucial not to conflate hardcore, far-right “white supremacists who have an agenda, with these broader public movements and mass protests”.

Demonising all people at these protests as being part of the far right “just makes people feel like they’re not heard and could even push them to those fringes where the actual far right lurks”.

9 minutes ago, binman said:

But i would suggest, the issue that the lawful and peaceful demonstrators need to consider is whether by attending a protest with  extremist minorities they are in effect being coopted by those extremists. 

Because that is exactly the strategy of the extremists - create a false sense of support for their extreme views.

 

This unfortunately is the case with all protests/movements including this one, BLM, climate change etc.

There is always someone with an agenda. The 'Columbo' technique is usually at work, "just one more thing"...there's always something else lurking beneath the shadows.

It's why I never join...I have my opinions and don't like having them distorted.

Protesters are pretty much always being manipulated.

1 minute ago, rjay said:

This unfortunately is the case with all protests/movements including this one, BLM, climate change etc.

 

Yes, you are right.

But in the normal run of things most protests have not been infiltrated, or even organized, by so many people with very extreme views and support for the use of violence.  

Just now, binman said:

Yes, you are right.

But in the normal run of things most protests have not been infiltrated, or even organized, by so many people with very extreme views and support for the use of violence.  

I think they do get infiltrated by extreme views and violence is often lurking.

We've seen it in recent times with BLM and Climate Change.

Sorry, I don't mean to water down what I agree is now a very serious situation.

...but I think, and I hate this labelling, but left and right often fail to see the extremist behaviour within their own ranks.

 

 

The only protests I've ever been to were the Vietnam war demonstrations in 1970-71. They were truly representative of wide public opinion.

Not like that rabble on the steps of Parliament House, which is about as unrepresentative as they come.

1 hour ago, binman said:

This is what scares me, and to paraphrase Shane Crawford, this is what I was talking about -

Far-right protester charged by counter-terror police amid talk of killing Premier

Counter-terrorism officials have charged a Victorian man who encouraged anti-lockdown protesters to take firearms to State Parliament and execute Premier Daniel Andrews.

And so they bloody well should have.

19 minutes ago, mauriesy said:

The only protests I've ever been to were the Vietnam war demonstrations in 1970-71. They were truly representative of wide public opinion.

Not like that rabble on the steps of Parliament House, which is about as unrepresentative as they come.

Then you were protesting against me being there.

26 minutes ago, rjay said:

I think they do get infiltrated by extreme views and violence is often lurking.

We've seen it in recent times with BLM and Climate Change.

 

Sure.

But whilst all protests might get infiltrated by extreme views, this current scenario feels different. Less infiltrated, more hijacked.  

1 hour ago, binman said:

Sure.

But whilst all protests might get infiltrated by extreme views, this current scenario feels different. Less infiltrated, more hijacked.  

I don't think this one has been hijacked, I think more orchestrated.

Just now, rjay said:

I don't think this one has been hijacked, I think more orchestrated.

Yes, a good distinction. Agree. 

 

8 minutes ago, Demonland said:

 

Sorry Andy, i have to protest - no footy in this thread.

Wait a minute......

34 minutes ago, binman said:

Sorry Andy, i have to protest - no footy in this thread.

Wait a minute......

Is cricket allowed?

19 minutes ago, Demonland said:

Is cricket allowed?

No.

please, ffs, this thread is about covid and the afl

it's not about extremist groups, violent protesters, politics or posters grandstanding

back to covid as it relates to the afl

All I want to know is, in this new day and age, will I still be able to drink alcohol in my seat in the MCC. 

And back to the real purpose of this thread. As of tomorrow, no caps on any venues, so we should have a bumper crowd for our first home game.

9 minutes ago, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

And back to the real purpose of this thread. As of tomorrow, no caps on any venues, so we should have a bumper crowd for our first home game.

Where we will unfurl our flag!

 

 

 

On 11/18/2021 at 8:42 PM, La Dee-vina Comedia said:

And back to the real purpose of this thread. As of tomorrow, no caps on any venues, so we should have a bumper crowd for our first home game.

Um, don't take anything for granted. Most of the optimistic annunciations have come from Politicians and in Europe those same Politicians are talking about renewed pre-Christmas lockdowns. I ain't Cassandra, by the way, I'm reporting what is. 

The real problem the world faces is that Pandemics are not about THE ECONOMY.