1 minute ago, PaulRB said:

Personal responsibility doesn’t mean you don’t make mistakes or have flaws, it means you take responsibilty for learning from your mistakes and working on your flaws. 

So Watt's improvement (until injured) wasn't his responsibility?

23 minutes ago, sue said:

That relies on a reading of what is meant by "Jack's doing" .  Is it referring to his 'choice' or the fact that he is in this position?   The original post on this didn't mention the word 'next' which you have interpolated to imply that all Jones was saying it's Watt's choice as to what happens next (to which I'd have no objection).  But I haven't heard the interview. 

I would guess both.

Just now, Redleg said:

I would guess both.

Then I give him a pass on one and a kick in the bum on the other.  It really would be nice to know exactly what he said before I damn Jones forever.

5 minutes ago, Dr.D said:

sorry i need to call this out.

goodwin doesnt owe anything to watts. if anything watts should be apologising to goodwin, neeld, bailey, roos and all of the assistants for wasting their resources and not putting his head over the footy.

 

You have to be kidding me?

Coaches comment - Mark Neeld was probably the worst coach in the history of the MFC. Look at his record, probably set us back 5 years. Roos is on record as saying trading Watts is a mistake and got the best footy out of Jack. and Goodwin has thrown his hands up in the air and admitted he cant coach him.

Head over the footy comment - not everybody is hardwired to do that. We need a mix of highly skilled and tuff inside players. There is not much point in extracting the ball in "the furnace" and then kicking or handballing directly to the opposition - did you see much of that last season ??

 

7 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

I think Jonesy should be working on his on field leadership rather than worrying and commenting/bagging Watts. 

Mate you need to let it go.

Jones has every right to comment on players... He's the captain, he's meant to set standards and enforce them.

 

2 minutes ago, sue said:

So Watt's improvement (until injured) wasn't his responsibility?

Of course it was. 

I feel with Jack, it is him getting the final 20% of improvement that he’s struggled to commit to or take responsibility for. 

11 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

Mate you need to let it go.

Jones has every right to comment on players... He's the captain, he's meant to set standards and enforce them.

 

But imo unleash he does need to work on his on field leadership. 

Yeah well in another development Apparently Jessie Hogan is very [censored] of with the Jack Watts situation and has had some conversations with Nat Fyffe and other Freo people. Make of that what you will ! 

I can't for the life of me understand why Jones, Goodwin and Mahoney would make negative comments about Watts if they intend to get rid of him.

It's a bit like putting an ad in the paper if you're selling your car. 'Clutch slipping, engine running on 3 cylinders, brakes dodgy.'

My view is the MFC would prefer Jack pull his finger out, and stay. But after years of encouraging him to do so are frustrated, and if he wont (pull said finger out), we'd be better off without him.

There's actually a fair bit of tough love and care in giving a player like Jack such a public correction. I've no doubt if Jack thrives elsewhere (or at the MFC) it will be due in no small part to the harsh reality check he's currently receiving.

 

 

Edited October 8, 20178 yr by PaulRB

2 hours ago, Crystal Dees said:

I'll wait for the movie  ?

Who will play Watts? 

Poor form by Goodwin and Mahoney considering the wasted years of non development by MFC of draft picks and younger players.

11 minutes ago, PaulRB said:

My view is the MFC would prefer Jack pull his finger out, and stay. But after years of encouraging him to do so are frustrated, and if he wont (pull said finger out), we'd be better off without him.

Theres actually a fair bit of tough love in giving a player like Jack such a public correction. I've no doubt if Jack thrives elsewhere it will be due in no small part to the harsh reality check he's currently receiving.

Well that is a good way to march up the ladder - not.  Perhaps it would have  been wiser to get rid of him quietly to minimise the kick up the bum he gets.  Just being traded might not have been a big enough kick to make him perform. The public humilation might just be the extra kick he needs.   Brilliant.

But hey, we need to speak the truth at all times.... can't dodge questions becasue we are honourable men.    

Edited October 8, 20178 yr by sue

This is Mark neeld moment here Watts gets pushed out his mate Hogan requests a trade back home . 

1 hour ago, Mazer Rackham said:

Well ..... alright .........

 

 

Kate Winslet would want to jump off the boat before it hit the bloody iceberg had that casting decision been made.

32 minutes ago, DemonOX said:

But imo unleash he does need to work on his on field leadership. 

You might be right, I was just replying to your comment about Jones not being allowed to comment on Watts.

I agree all this probably shouldn't be made public, but he was asked a direct question and mugs like me who have no idea what's happening inside the MFC appreciate the honesty.

TBH I'm not going to comment on Jones's leadership as I really have no idea

Just now, Unleash Hell said:

 

I agree all this probably shouldn't be made public, but he was asked a direct question and mugs like me who have no idea what's happening inside the MFC appreciate the honesty.

Mugs like you and me need to remove the ants from our pants.  If it is the best interests of the Club to not tell the public about what's happening in the Club, then I can live without knowing.  Hang the honesty.

29 minutes ago, picket fence said:

Yeah well in another development Apparently Jessie Hogan is very [censored] of with the Jack Watts situation and has had some conversations with Nat Fyffe and other Freo people. Make of that what you will ! 

Apparently if your aunty has balls she's your uncle.

Until Jesse request a trade, what your saying is stupid. I find the whole commentary stupid and not very well thought out.

If Hogan is upset with the club trading Watts has he made his feelings known to the club? How is Hogan moving to WA bringing Watts closer to him? Watts isn't exactly dead, it's not like they can't speak to each other ever again if Watts does leave.

And let's assume your correct (I'm not saying there is no truth to what you're saying, but until we get an official request from Hogan it is pure speculation). Right now Hogan is at his highest value to us, so we would be very well compensated. 

I don't care if Watts or Hogan leave - I only care about the 22 who run out in rd 1 2018

2 minutes ago, sue said:

Mugs like you and me need to remove the ants from our pants.  If it is the best interests of the Club to not tell the public about what's happening in the Club, then I can live without knowing.  Hang the honesty.

I hear what you're saying Sue, but unless you know the facts there is no point any of us commenting. For all we know Jones could have told Goody he wanted Watts moved on because he wouldn't adhere to the leadership group.... (I've made that up, but just pointing out we don't know the facts).

The problem here is there are 2 sides. One strongly believes in protecting Watts the other wants what is best for the club. There is no right or wrong, the club isn't going to die, it's a tough decision and personally I've backed in the people in the know to make the correct decisions.

The little bits of honesty we get in the media from the players I really enjoy

The flow in effect poses a potential risk, if indeed hogan and watts did leave we suddenly look a bit less of an option for tmac, petracca and co who are out of contract next year and will no doubt draw attention 

1 minute ago, Unleash Hell said:

I hear what you're saying Sue, but unless you know the facts there is no point any of us commenting. For all we know Jones could have told Goody he wanted Watts moved on because he wouldn't adhere to the leadership group.... (I've made that up, but just pointing out we don't know the facts).

The problem here is there are 2 sides. One strongly believes in protecting Watts the other wants what is best for the club. There is no right or wrong, the club isn't going to die, it's a tough decision and personally I've backed in the people in the know to make the correct decisions.

The little bits of honesty we get in the media from the players I really enjoy

We seem to enjoy commenting in the complete absence of any facts anyway.  But entertaining us is just a tad less important than building a top team. Just a tad.

Your characterization of the 2 sides is wrong, accidentally I presume.  While there may be a few (or 0) who want to protect Watts at any cost,  most  pro-Wattsers just disagree with the Watts-removers as to what is best for the club.

1 minute ago, Abe said:

The flow in effect poses a potential risk, if indeed hogan and watts did leave we suddenly look a bit less of an option for tmac, petracca and co who are out of contract next year and will no doubt draw attention 

100% agree, but again it depends on the reasons and results.

Take dusty as a perfect example.

If Hogan and Watts leave and then we make finals, what you've said is pointless. But if we fall on our a$$ then you a probably 100% correct. 

It's a huge risk no doubt, but IMO we have to back the people in charge to make the right decisions and do the best with what they have at their disposal.

Since Mahoney, Viney, Taylor and co have been appointed to the club it has been all positive, so I am backing them in.

Just now, sue said:

We seem to enjoy commenting in the complete absence of any facts anyway.  But entertaining us is just a tad less important than building a top team. Just a tad.

Your characterization of the 2 sides is wrong, accidentally I presume.  While there may be a few (or 0) who want to protect Watts at any cost,  most  pro-Wattsers just disagree with the Watts-removers as to what is best for the club.

True - we'd be pretty bored if we had to just comment on facts.

My whole point has been, I am backing the decision makers who know the internal workings. I agree we can speculate on decisions, but the FD have been pretty spot on with moves for the past 3 years. I am backing them.

 

Something has happened behind the scenes and it is now getting ugly. While I am not against trading Jack,  I have to say that the club are handling this terribly. It does remind me of the Shane Woewodin trade where we went out and started advertising his salary. Lots of bad blood and not good for team harmony.

Jack has been fighting this in the media as well. Don't tell me that a camera crew just happened to bump into him at Adelaide Airport. That had been leaked and it wasn't in Melbourne's best interests for that to be in the public arena.

His 'press conference' at the TAB event was completely unnecessary. He was there in a completely different capacity and would have well have been in his rights to tell journos to nick off. 

I think the club would be better off just to turn the other cheek. Instead they have gone the way of the 2012 Labor party in now trying to nuke Jack's credibility into oblivion (almost like what the pro Gillard forces did to KRudd when he challenged for the leadership the first time). 

For those outside the leadership group, it's a horrible look. Some may be sympathetic to Nate's frustration with Jack but they would be wondering if they might be publicly humiliated should their performance not be deemed up to scratch.

I should reiterate, I have no issue with Jack leaving. He has had 9 years and as @Sir Why You Little said, we still talk about him like he is a first to second year player. That right there should show why this is even a discussion.

However, this is sloppy as hell and all the MFC should be disappointed with how this has played out.

8 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

I hear what you're saying Sue, but unless .........

The problem here is there are 2 sides. One strongly believes in protecting Watts the other wants what is best for the club. There is no right or wrong, the club isn't going to die, it's a tough decision and personally I've backed in the people in the know to make the correct decisions.

Any chance those who would like Watts to stay also want what’s best for the Club? Or is that just the domain of the anti-Wattsers?

Edited October 8, 20178 yr by fndee