Roost It, on 03 Jun 2015 - 12:31 PM, said:

You could be right Roost, so I've taken another look . .

I decided to reframe this whole incident by using a more factual caption and see where that might lead.

My choice: "Indigenous tribal elder humiliates 13 yo white girl"! is factual enough (if a bit confronting).

Then I went to the academic literature to learn up on how women in general were treated in primitive

Australian societies and specifically young women and their treatment by tribal elders.

Lots of peer reviewed literature out there, I could post a selection here if you wish but to read it

could be detrimental to your innocence!

My next step was to ask "does a tribal elder in 21st century Australia hold the same attitudes toward

women, do they sanction those same behaviors?" Adam needs to step up and answer that one for me!

My take 'Roost it' is: if you want to set yourself up as a leader of your people then you better take ownership

of the good and the bad. . the romantic and the barbaric, better be aware of the dark symbolism you portray

and don't ever play the guilt game with modern multicultural Australians, you will be found out!

Adam has been "found out" and is being treated accordingly!

Chrs

Stuie, what is it about you and the facts?

"Indigenous tribal elder . . humiliates 13 yo . . white girl"!

1. Adam describes himself as "A very proud Indigenous man from Adnyamathanha tribe" and sees football as " an opportunity to show that passion, and that pride about being

a warrior and representing my people and where I come from".

Tick fact 1. Adam is Adnyamathanha tribal elder! Uses football "to show pride about being a warrior!"

2. A 13-year-old girl was ejected from the MCG. MCG security told her family to remain seated as they ejected the girl - and police detained her for what she said was two

hours. The teenager was initially questioned by police without an adult present. When police found out she was only 13, they went and got her grandmother.

Her mother said she believed her daughter was "very scared" when she was taken away by security.

Tick fact 2. Reasonably assume she felt humiliated. Her age was stated as 13 years old!

3. Going by vision of the incident seems beyond question she was of European heritage ie "white".

Tick fact 3. White 13 year old girl!

"Indigenous tribal elder . . humiliates 13 yo . . white girl" Tick! Tick! Tick!

So Stuie, facts still remain facts even if they are a bit confronting and presented in a manner not to your liking!

Context is the great sticking point for racists sometimes isn't it?

hard to see, roostit, how your irrelevant and extraneous characterisations added any validity to your argument

if you are trying to convince or educate someone to change their position it seems a pretty unproductive way to go about it

I've no interest in trying to reeducate the uneducated swill. I just like exposing him and his peers for what they are. That is all

maybe just a futile effort to try and stick to the facts........

I don't believe adam goodes is an initiated tribal elder. Believe his mother may be an elder

I also don't believe adam is a warrior. He is a footballer

happy to be corrected

I like that Eddie has been officially labelled as a boofhead...

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/nsw-parliament-officially-labels-eddie-mcguire-a-boofhead-over-adam-goodes-remarks-20150603-ghfnal.html

My thoughts on this whole trivial BS issue.

The whole booing scenario from last week, imo let the fans boo. Goodes should have risen above and not said anything. Do what you do, and do it ON THE FIELD.

I hated hearing the media saying it was, "against the spirit of the game". These people aren't invested in the sport and teams like fans are. It [censored] me off. I'll boo Goodes if I want.

That said, it's fair game. The dance, it was a, "STUFF YOU!" and I loved it.

THAT'S the spirit of the game. This is a competition. It's survival of the fittest. Power to him.

It doesn't help that he's a hypocrite, that he points out elements of racism and argues that he doesn't deserve the treatment only to then taunt fans with a cultural dance.

But irrespective of that, booing and taunting are fair game.

The fans will boo. The players will respond. Irrespective of how it's done, the dance was just his way of fighting back. It kind of devalues his moral highground, and he should have just done that and nothing else.

Would this be an issue had he stayed silent all week and then did the dance? Probably, but not as much of an issue. It would have just been him making a stand for himself.

I don't think he has grounds to complain about booing anymore. The fans threw a spear, and he threw one back. You can't winge about it anymore. And to be honest, I think that's better for the game. Stand up for yourself. Don't cry about it.

I just find it all so trivial that a mad who is so vocal about the "white man", the oppression his people are under, has managed to rise above and make it in a "white man's world", where he takes advantage of capitalism, earns very good coin, and has the platform to spread his opinions.

Michael Long is a far better ambassador and spokesperson for Indigenous people. I feel that Goodes has a massive chip on his shoulder, and he's far more divisive than anything, especially when he says one thing and does another.

The platform is there for young Indigenous people to make a stand and make something of themselves. He is living proof of that. He should be doing everything in his power to form reconciliation, rather than coming out and attacking the very world that has given him the platform in the first place.

I reckon booing is the refuge of the illiterate

Unable to string a coherent argument or even word they pronounce a monosyllabic utterance to express something.

Gerard Whately on Offsiders suggested that those with other reasons for disliking Goodes shut up and allow the racists to identify themselves by their booing, perhaps not a bad idea, but what about the spirit of the game

ball for those holding or releasing seems to be adequate

what about ducker for those who duck their heads to solicit free kicks.

A simple word could be established for each sin and the racists would be left to identify themselves.

Haven't heard jesus, allah or buddha being mentioned yet dc

"Love thy neighbor" Jesus.

"Power consists not in being able to strike another,but in being able to control oneself when anger arises" Muhammad.

"Hatred is never appeased by hatred,it is appeased by loving kindness" Buddha.

If we listen to these three guys there would be no racists,no anti racists and this thread would be a lot nicer.

I like that Eddie has been officially labelled as a boofhead...

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/nsw-parliament-officially-labels-eddie-mcguire-a-boofhead-over-adam-goodes-remarks-20150603-ghfnal.html

It didn't need a vote in parliament to establish that....

"Love thy neighbor" Jesus.

"Power consists not in being able to strike another,but in being able to control oneself when anger arises" Muhammad.

"Hatred is never appeased by hatred,it is appeased by loving kindness" Buddha.

If we listen to these three guys there would be no racists,no anti racists and this thread would be a lot nicer.

Probably would not exist

I like that Eddie has been officially labelled as a boofhead...

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/nsw-parliament-officially-labels-eddie-mcguire-a-boofhead-over-adam-goodes-remarks-20150603-ghfnal.html

priceless

first blatters, then eddie mcchins........................lookout hirdy, gillom, ioc, un

"Love thy neighbor" Jesus.

You should have quoted in full " love thy neighbor, but give him a sly elbow in the ribs as long as the umpire isn't watching" - he was a nuggety back pocket for the Jerusalem 2nd 18 - they were a pretty good team until the then ruling body allowed the expansion team "Roman Power" into the league. I think the Jerusalem 2nd 18 first coined the phrase " umpires..come on ..we are being crucified"..

( I think I need a bex and a good lie down)

Facts and logic ? That's a laugh.

Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children are NOT the only children removed from dangerous situations.

Right now there are less Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children in OOHC than non-Aboriginal. Although their percentage is greatly higher.

This link may be of interest to you. Thank me later.

https://aifs.gov.au/cfca/publications/child-abuse-and-neglect-statistics

Your inability to comprehend is staggering.

The post of mine you quote refers to children being removed en masse. The document your provide has no current examples of children being removed from danger en masse. So it is as irrelevant as much of the rest of your diatribe.

For the record - physical, emotional and sexual abuse occur at higher rates in non indigenous communities.

https://aifs.gov.au/cfca/publications/child-protection-and-aboriginal-and-torres-strait-islander-c

Edit: Thanks

Edited June 3, 201510 yr by ManDee

I like that Eddie has been officially labelled as a boofhead...

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/nsw-parliament-officially-labels-eddie-mcguire-a-boofhead-over-adam-goodes-remarks-20150603-ghfnal.html

"With all due respect Eddie, you are officially a boofhead"

"Love thy neighbor" Jesus.

"Power consists not in being able to strike another,but in being able to control oneself when anger arises" Muhammad.

"Hatred is never appeased by hatred,it is appeased by loving kindness" Buddha.

If we listen to these three guys there would be no racists,no anti racists and this thread would be a lot nicer.i hope you are not serious emerald

i hope you are just joshing me, emerald

you don't really want me to start cherry picking quotes of muhammad, do you?

"Love thy neighbor" Jesus.

"Power consists not in being able to strike another,but in being able to control oneself when anger arises" Muhammad.

"Hatred is never appeased by hatred,it is appeased by loving kindness" Buddha.

If we listen to these three guys there would be no racists,no anti racists and this thread would be a lot nicer.

How could such a great boxer say that I wonder?

Context is the great sticking point for racists sometimes isn't it?

Also for the apologist or so it seems!

Anyhow Stuie, As his biggest fan you would think Adam would list your name as exempt when he rants on. Sadly he doesn't! Guess in his eyes you are just the same as me!

Personally I find that quite offensive!!

Chrs

"Over 225 years, the Europeans, and now the governments that run our country, have raped, killed and stolen from my people for their own benefit. The total injustices that have been played out since colonisation are absolutely shameful, and I now find it hard to say I am proud to be Australian."

The truth. Pure and simple.

Australian of the Year

Champion Sydney footballer

I am an urban Aboriginal man; I wasn't brought up into my culture, I don't have my language, nor my kinship system to live by. My mum was part of the stolen generations and, because of this, my mum and her three boys never learnt what it meant to be Aboriginal.

Utopia has shown me how, over 225 years, the Europeans, and now the governments that run our country, have raped, killed and stolen from my people for their own benefit. The total injustices that have been played out since colonisation are absolutely shameful, and I now find it hard to say I am proud to be Australian.

Australia has a very black past; Utopia shows real-life stories of what has happened over the past 225 years. I cried like I had lost a family member on three occasions watching this film - a must-see for all Australians.

The truth. Pure and simple.

Now I know who Jack Nicholson had in mind when he uttered those immortal words. They were for you binman!!

Your inability to comprehend is staggering.

The post of mine you quote refers to children being removed en masse. The document your provide has no current examples of children being removed from danger en masse. So it is as irrelevant as much of the rest of your diatribe.

For the record - physical, emotional and sexual abuse occur at higher rates in non indigenous communities.

https://aifs.gov.au/cfca/publications/child-protection-and-aboriginal-and-torres-strait-islander-c

Edit: Thanks

Clearly there hasn't been a government policy to remove white children en masse from their families.

Is that the point you were trying to make ? Talk about stating the bleeding obvious.

Perhaps clumsily, you inferred it was really only Aboriginal children who were ever removed from abusive situations when you said, "Child abuse happens in all communities but historically they have been removed from which families?". I then pointed out this wasn't the case and supplied information that shows 27K non-Aboriginal have presently been placed in OOHC.

Check your unedited post on page 24/576, which is the initial post I was responding to and not your subsequently edited version down the page.

Now I know who Jack Nicholson had in mind when he uttered those immortal words. They were for you binman!!

Deefrag the truth will set you free. First you need to be able to handle it. Can you handle it? You are so angry and hurt. Adam has hurt you with the truth, that much is clear. He scares you doesn't he. Its OK to admit it. Do do and your journey of healing will commence. One day you will thank Adam.

Your inability to comprehend is staggering.

The post of mine you quote refers to children being removed en masse. The document your provide has no current examples of children being removed from danger en masse. So it is as irrelevant as much of the rest of your diatribe.

For the record - physical, emotional and sexual abuse occur at higher rates in non indigenous communities.

https://aifs.gov.au/cfca/publications/child-protection-and-aboriginal-and-torres-strait-islander-c

Edit: Thanks

As for your stats ?

The same report says:

It is estimated that less than 30% of all sexual assaults on children are reported and that the reporting rate is even lower for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children (Stanley et al., 2003). Inquiries into child sexual abuse in Western Australia, New South Wales and the Northern Territory have concluded that the sexual abuse of Indigenous children was common, widespread and grossly under-reported (Aboriginal Child Sexual Assault Taskforce, 2006; Anderson & Wild, 2007; Gordon et al., 2002). Robertson (2000) estimated that up to 88% of all sexual assaults in Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander communities go unreported.

In contrast to the low rates of sexual abuse substantiated by child protection services, police data on reported victims of sexual assault show that Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children are at greater risk than non-Indigenous children of being sexually abused (Steering Committee for the Review of Government Service Provision, 2007).

Health data regarding sexually transmitted infections, which have been associated with child sexual abuse, showed that over twice the number of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander children were diagnosed with an STI compared with non-Indigenous children (Steering Committee for the Review of Government Service Provision, 2007).

Edited June 3, 201510 yr by ProDee

https://www.pedestrian.tv/news/sport/watch-waleed-aly-absolutely-nail-the-adam-goodes-d/5a715856-12c3-471e-90df-44810d585bc8.htm

THIS

Deefrag the truth will set you free. First you need to be able to handle it. Can you handle it? You are so angry and hurt. Adam has hurt you with the truth, that much is clear. He scares you doesn't he. Its OK to admit it. Do do and your journey of healing will commence. One day you will thank Adam.

Are you Mother Teresa? Hate is good! It must be . . it got Adam an AOTY gong!

I luv all indigenous people bar one, whereas Adam hates everyone. He's the one to give your crystals and Hare Hare's to!

Your projections are deceiving you.

Australian of the Year

Champion Sydney footballer

I am an urban Aboriginal man; I wasn't brought up into my culture, I don't have my language, nor my kinship system to live by. My mum was part of the stolen generations and, because of this, my mum and her three boys never learnt what it meant to be Aboriginal.

Utopia has shown me how, over 225 years, the Europeans, and now the governments that run our country, have raped, killed and stolen from my people for their own benefit. The total injustices that have been played out since colonisation are absolutely shameful, and I now find it hard to say I am proud to be Australian.

Australia has a very black past; Utopia shows real-life stories of what has happened over the past 225 years. I cried like I had lost a family member on three occasions watching this film - a must-see for all Australians.

Do you think Utopia is an accurate depiction of what it was like to be Aboriginal ?

Have you read Kieran Finnane's review, among others ?

I'm not sure this movie should be Goodes guiding hand when it comes to history. I'm sure there are more factual documentaries he could have relied upon.