Eh, not for me.

I'd prefer the Palace rather than Big Day Out.

Bob's Country Bunker

Bob's Country Bunker

I believe they do both kinds.

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2014-06-07/pedersens-stunning-turnaround

I think it does show that certain people react to certain methods.

I remember early in 2012, both Colin Sylvia (who I don't think anyone could have gotten through to) and Jack Watts were called into the coach's office and given a spray before he had coached a senior game. Watts emerged every now and then and got some cheap kicks on the back line but his development was not where it should have been. Col was Col so I don't think Neeld could have done much there. However, I am not sure the blast on Watts had the effect it should have.

I am not sure who gave Pedo the spray mentioned in the AFL article but it clearly has worked. The words used were pretty biting but the end result has been worth it.
I think also the fact that the payout Pedo was given was only given air time after the event actually happened helped.

I think it does show that certain people react to certain methods.

I remember early in 2012, both Colin Sylvia (who I don't think anyone could have gotten through to) and Jack Watts were called into the coach's office and given a spray before he had coached a senior game. Watts emerged every now and then and got some cheap kicks on the back line but his development was not where it should have been. Col was Col so I don't think Neeld could have done much there. However, I am not sure the blast on Watts had the effect it should have.

I am not sure who gave Pedo the spray mentioned in the AFL article but it clearly has worked. The words used were pretty biting but the end result has been worth it.

I think also the fact that the payout Pedo was given was only given air time after the event actually happened helped.

Completely agree.

The home truths really hit Pedo, and i commend him for digging deeper.

Whereas Watts needs encouragement, not a huge spray

I'm wondering who was the one who said all this 'you won't be here after next year' stuff to him.

I get it's done good things for him, and motivated him but surely that's not the right way to go about it. I'd be absolutely shocked if that was Paul Roos' approach to the situation! Roosy seems far more of a 'break your game into little areas and work on these ones, but these ones are okay so get the bad ones right and you can have a good 2014'.

If in fact that was Neil Craig and the old footy department, it doesn't surprise me how out of touch they were.

It would be hard to roll into pre-season if the coach had that attitude about you.

I am not sure who gave Pedo the spray

I read nothing in the article to suggest it was a "spray". It seems to me that it was just an honest appraisal of what the FD thought of Pedo. It was a horoscope moment for sure, it was frank, honest and direct. It left Pedo in no doubt where he sat. I doubt there was any ranting and raving, shouting or anger. Just "this is what we think".

It was nothing more or less than would have been given to every player at seasons end.

There is a great scene in Moneyball where Billy Beane is talking to Peter Brand and asks him to role play the dismissal of a player. Brand starts a long winded explanation to the imaginary player and Beane cuts in and says "Peter, they are professional sportmen. They just want to know where they stand".

It's what Pedo got.

CAM PEDERSEN was told at the end of last season his career was all but over, with Melbourne far from happy with what he had produced in his first year.

Called in for his end-of-year review with coaches and members of the recruiting team, Pedersen was told how disappointed the club had been with his output.

The tall utility played just 10 games in his first season, after being traded from North Melbourne for Jordan Gysberts and pick No. 61 (Taylor Hine) in the 2012 trade period.

"They said if I didn't pick up my game this year, even though I had a three-year deal, I wouldn't be here [in 2015]," Pedersen told AFL.com.au.

"They felt they'd been dudded.

"They told me they weren't fussed if I was here or not and said my destiny was in my own hands."

Id call that a spray. But credit to Pedo. He could have not taken it on board and it could have wrecked his confidence more but he took the words and as people said last week he is a different player and unrecognisable. He now realises his 3 year deal isnt a safety net. Credit to him and lets hope he keeps his form up.

Its a shame that some other players didn't take some other advice on board.

I reckon Todd was one that maybe said something. He is head of recruiting and wouldnt mince words.

I read nothing in the article to suggest it was a "spray". It seems to me that it was just an honest appraisal of what the FD thought of Pedo. It was a horoscope moment for sure, it was frank, honest and direct. It left Pedo in no doubt where he sat. I doubt there was any ranting and raving, shouting or anger. Just "this is what we think".

I guess spray is a fairly loaded term. We all associate it with maniacal coaches screaming with paint peeling intensity. I do think however the language used in the feedback regarding Peders' 2013 season (I can't call him Pedo anymore, it's just wrong) was pretty strong and not your normal kind of debriefing. I believe the words 'we were dudded' and 'it doesn't fuss us if you are here or not in 2015' convey quite a hostile tone. It's not just 'Your 2013 isn't what we expected and we are unsure if you will be here for 2015'.

I am guessing Craigy was the one who passed that on. Whatever or whoever it was, it worked and shows that people management means keeping an open mind about things. Some blokes react to shock and awe, others need a cuddle.

CAM PEDERSEN was told at the end of last season his career was all but over, with Melbourne far from happy with what he had produced in his first year.

Called in for his end-of-year review with coaches and members of the recruiting team, Pedersen was told how disappointed the club had been with his output.

The tall utility played just 10 games in his first season, after being traded from North Melbourne for Jordan Gysberts and pick No. 61 (Taylor Hine) in the 2012 trade period.

"They said if I didn't pick up my game this year, even though I had a three-year deal, I wouldn't be here [in 2015]," Pedersen told AFL.com.au.

"They felt they'd been dudded.

"They told me they weren't fussed if I was here or not and said my destiny was in my own hands."

Id call that a spray. But credit to Pedo. He could have not taken it on board and it could have wrecked his confidence more but he took the words and as people said last week he is a different player and unrecognisable. He now realises his 3 year deal isnt a safety net. Credit to him and lets hope he keeps his form up.

Its a shame that some other players didn't take some other advice on board.

I reckon Todd was one that maybe said something. He is head of recruiting and wouldnt mince words.

I didn't know this. Full credit to Pederson for such a terrific turnaround.

I'm wondering who was the one who said all this 'you won't be here after next year' stuff to him.

I get it's done good things for him, and motivated him but surely that's not the right way to go about it. I'd be absolutely shocked if that was Paul Roos' approach to the situation! Roosy seems far more of a 'break your game into little areas and work on these ones, but these ones are okay so get the bad ones right and you can have a good 2014'.

If in fact that was Neil Craig and the old footy department, it doesn't surprise me how out of touch they were.

It would be hard to roll into pre-season if the coach had that attitude about you.

You do realise Pedeson is an adult and not a child. You're idea sounds like something you may say to a juvenile.

It's simple, honest and more importantly, it worked.

Edited June 7, 201411 yr by Ethan Tremblay

You do realise Pedeson is an adult and not a child. You're idea sounds like something you may say to a juvenile.

It's simple, honest and more importantly, it worked.

Sometimes just because someone is 'of age' doesn't mean they behave like an adult or are as mentally strong as an adult.

Jack, as lovely a bloke as he is, was given a burden he wasn't ready for and his development as a footballer and maybe even as a person was stunted.

Sometimes you have to move away from a principle and deal in realities.

In Peders' case however, a bigger stick could be used and it worked.

Edited June 7, 201411 yr by Colin B. Flaubert

I'm wondering who was the one who said all this 'you won't be here after next year' stuff to him.

I get it's done good things for him, and motivated him but surely that's not the right way to go about it. I'd be absolutely shocked if that was Paul Roos' approach to the situation! Roosy seems far more of a 'break your game into little areas and work on these ones, but these ones are okay so get the bad ones right and you can have a good 2014'.

If in fact that was Neil Craig and the old footy department, it doesn't surprise me how out of touch they were.

It would be hard to roll into pre-season if the coach had that attitude about you.

Neil Craig would not have been there. It sounds a hell of a lot like Todd Viney from what I know of him.

But its all just speculation.

What isn't is the honest truths that were given to Cam that let him know 'where he stood' as BB excellently referenced from Moneyball above.

He has done the hard work and Roos and co. have given him some confidence but there is nothing wrong with some honesty.

I have heard that Roos was very honest up in Sydney. Very honest.

Having played and captained and now coached teams - all blokes want is an honest appraisal and their self belief intact.

It's a balance, and it is a part of what makes some coaches better than others.

I think the appraisal justifies the criticism he received on here; he was not up to scratch last year, we knew it the club knew it, but I guess some posters on here just weren't prepared to accept it.

He's playing good football this year and that's all anyone wanted, he obviously listened to what they said and accepted that to continue he had to change.

Well done, some like Gysbets just weren't prepared to.

Well said robbie. I guess it opens the question up, can trengove, tapscott and blease etc make the same improvements?

Well done to cam, I remember being stoked we landed him originally but I remember the dismay at times last year watching him. Hope he keeps it up and keeps going, essentially the position is now his to lose regardless of fitzy or the like.

That feedback would feel like a slap in the face. It seems to me he had two choices: to work his ring off to improve, or decide footy's not for him and chuck in the towel. Credit to him for taking the harder but more rewarding road.

I didn't realize how tough some rookie listed players have it. I can't believe that in an era where TV rights deals are worth over a billion dollars, some rookie listed players are forced to take on second jobs to support their families. Surely that has to change.

Anyway, full credit to Pedersen. I couldn't stand him last year, but now enjoy watching him clunk awesome marks on a weekly basis.

I guess spray is a fairly loaded term. We all associate it with maniacal coaches screaming with paint peeling intensity. I do think however the language used in the feedback regarding Peders' 2013 season (I can't call him Pedo anymore, it's just wrong) was pretty strong and not your normal kind of debriefing. I believe the words 'we were dudded' and 'it doesn't fuss us if you are here or not in 2015' convey quite a hostile tone. It's not just 'Your 2013 isn't what we expected and we are unsure if you will be here for 2015'.

I am guessing Craigy was the one who passed that on. Whatever or whoever it was, it worked and shows that people management means keeping an open mind about things. Some blokes react to shock and awe, others need a cuddle.

I doubt Cam can remember the exact words used and I'd suspect the words used were more your alternatives. It's counter productive to abuse players at seasons end, if you've got them for 2 more seasons your trying to motive them. And i reckon that all players would have been told exactly where they stood. And Peder's stood in a bad spot!

Full credit that he took it on board and we're lucky he had the talent available to allow him to respond. Those lamenting other players failure to respond assume they all have the required ability.

They don't.

I doubt Cam can remember the exact words used and I'd suspect the words used were more your alternatives. It's counter productive to abuse players at seasons end, if you've got them for 2 more seasons your trying to motive them. And i reckon that all players would have been told exactly where they stood. And Peder's stood in a bad spot!

Full credit that he took it on board and we're lucky he had the talent available to allow him to respond. Those lamenting other players failure to respond assume they all have the required ability.

They don't.

Some do but aren't prepared to put in the necessary work. The name Colin Sylvia comes readily to mind.

Some do but aren't prepared to put in the necessary work. The name Colin Sylvia comes readily to mind.

Or those who didn't want to put in the necessary work for people like Mark Neeld, which to an extent is fair enough. Though I'd have liked more players to replicate Nathan Jones, who clearly had other factors motivating him to continue to work hard.

Not referring to Sylvia as he has always been laconic.

I'm wondering who was the one who said all this 'you won't be here after next year' stuff to him.

I get it's done good things for him, and motivated him but surely that's not the right way to go about it. I'd be absolutely shocked if that was Paul Roos' approach to the situation! Roosy seems far more of a 'break your game into little areas and work on these ones, but these ones are okay so get the bad ones right and you can have a good 2014'.

If in fact that was Neil Craig and the old footy department, it doesn't surprise me how out of touch they were.

It would be hard to roll into pre-season if the coach had that attitude about you.

I think it the approach was fully justified and necessary... it also worked

It's like any other employer giving an employee a performance review.

They were spot on. He, and the majority of the list, weren't good enough.

I doubt Cam can remember the exact words used and I'd suspect the words used were more your alternatives. It's counter productive to abuse players at seasons end, if you've got them for 2 more seasons your trying to motive them. And i reckon that all players would have been told exactly where they stood. And Peder's stood in a bad spot!

Full credit that he took it on board and we're lucky he had the talent available to allow him to respond. Those lamenting other players failure to respond assume they all have the required ability.

They don't.

My question then would be 'Why did Peders describe it in those terms and using those words?'

This is now just becoming a semantic game. My overall point stands. Some players react well to the stick, others to the carrot. Whether you want to call it abuse, a spray or whatever, Cameron was motivated in this case by the stick. Others are motivated by the carrot.

I think the appraisal justifies the criticism he received on here; he was not up to scratch last year, we knew it the club knew it, but I guess some posters on here just weren't prepared to accept it.

He's playing good football this year and that's all anyone wanted, he obviously listened to what they said and accepted that to continue he had to change.

Well done, some like Gysbets just weren't prepared to.

again rewriting the truth.

many wanted him chopped from the club... maybe you were one?

others could see his potential, which would include the club whom recruited him. And the club would also have understood the culture wasn't healthy as well, not helping players entering the place.

Unlike many posters, some of which were even going so far as to say, that culture doesn't even exist. flat earth stuff right there.

him and Jetta would have to be the surprises of the year.

Both could basically have written their career off, but credit to them, they both look good

Or those who didn't want to put in the necessary work for people like Mark Neeld, which to an extent is fair enough. Though I'd have liked more players to replicate Nathan Jones, who clearly had other factors motivating him to continue to work hard.

Not referring to Sylvia as he has always been laconic.

maybe Nathan Jones has developed himself, in-spite of our Club Culture of the past Decade +,,, where others have been followers, & fallen into line with the leaders of the time who carried the mantle of that weak culture.

..... I'd say Nathan hasn't been a Sheep, well at least not a white sheep; Lets say a Black Sheep, Or if you Prefer 'a Black Stallion' ... a bloke prepared to stand with the herd, but not be weakened by its failures.

But prepared to stand alone as a Leader, for what is right, & to not give in to the losses, & feeling 'its all too much', & not worth sacrificing things for, but to keep working hard, to be all he can.

People are speaking of Dunny's improvement, last year, & certainly this Season, & to me the connecting factor in his progress, is his line coach, Jade Rawlings ?

Edited June 8, 201411 yr by dee-luded