And of course it gave us the situation of Richmond being the only club ever to make the finals and lose to 9th.

That alone makes it all worthwhile.

Silver lining.

^^^^* I think you are right hird keeps trying to bring up that they were tipped off by AD like its the major issue rather the them injecting PEDs

The issue is the briefing AD received was from the ACC was confidential and he signed a consent that if he relieved the details he was in breach of the law ( don't know the actual offence but it has to powers the ACC has ). I have no doubt he told Evans but if that is proven he would be charged by the ACC and that's what hird wants to demonstrate because he is [censored] off with AD and wants him to go down for something

Add to that the bummers believe they were 'coerced' into self-reporting and that is what has got them into this mess. They are delusional.

The ACC had nothing and the bummers think they haven't taken anything illegal.

They are holding on to the fact ASADA gave them an a'all-clear' for AOD9604

Hence they are angry at Vlad for 'forcing' them to fess up.

No , No

There was no precedent for a joint investigation. it was folly ( proven ) and thwart with danger from the get go. It had to be by its very nature conflicted. You cant have total transparency if the investigated is a co -investigator . The AFL's involvement wasnt at all necessary in order for WADA/SADA to carry out its job.

Its about a 99% certainty Vlad opened his mouth ( deliberately or otherwise..i'm picking the former ) when he ought not have. His agenda is not that of WADA"s therein lies the conflict and its undoing ( AFL's ).

Yes, Yes

I think 'old dee's' point was if Hird and his FD didn't pursue the quick fix supplements approach in the first place then there would be nothing to investigate, no investigation, no co-investigation etc.

…as for the AFL getting involved with ASADA in an investigation, I wouldn't call it corrupt but I think they were trying to influence the outcome and ASADA should never have agreed. What was in it for them?

if Essendon are as guilty as some suspect, if they have indeed not only misrepresented the facts to those in their care, but opened a can of worms regarding any health problems yet to surface, then I expect the FULL weight of the LAW to fall on them, not some half twisted self serving imposter of such as enacted by the league.

The AFL has seemingly conspired to create an outcome of its own suiting. A pox on them

If that occured and they went down th gurgler which is a possible outcome where do you think that would leave the media rights and the sposoship of the comp. Vunerable clubs like Melbourne. there would be millions of dollars that would disappear and the comp would shrink. The AFL is acting to preserve the comp and while I agree that those responsible should pay the price the AFL's role is to minimise the fall out to the rest of the comp.

You are much better influencing from the inside and that was the basis of the AFL's approach.

The point is what would you expct the AFL to do, stand back and just let it unfold and have not influence over it? There is a big diffenerence in the way the same facts are interpreted, analysed and disseminated and influencing that does not nessecarily involve corruption. Lawyers do it ever day

LOL - we are not arguing whether lawyers are corrupt. That is a given

The AFL have not been corrupt in this matter. You could argue they made an error in electing to do a joint investigation and clearly they had the self imposed time limit of not wanting the es to play finals. But corrupt? Silly talk straight out of the Hird spin factory

that's right...to hell with peoples health...all hail the dollar !! f-t !!

Essendon have no right to get away with anything simply by calling upon the notion that if they go down others suffer. Thats extortion by any other name.

If Windy Hill was to have to stand out or fold then its up to the league to make good its dealings not pander to transgressors.

Lets get the horse before the cart here.

If Bombers crashed its not the end of the competition , let alone the footy world.

There is a thing called natural justice. Despite the stupidity and naievity of the players they are entitled to better than given. Those who seek to rise above such laws and decencies ought to be brought back to earth with a thud....make it so

Yes, Yes

I think 'old dee's' point was if Hird and his FD didn't pursue the quick fix supplements approach in the first place then there would be nothing to investigate, no investigation, no co-investigation etc.

…as for the AFL getting involved with ASADA in an investigation, I wouldn't call it corrupt but I think they were trying to influence the outcome and ASADA should never have agreed. What was in it for them?

i think the answer is in nsw

there, asada didn't get co-operation and it really bogged down their investigation and consequently essendon (et al) too

still, co-operation doesn't have to involve joint investigations

i think the answer is in nsw

there, asada didn't get co-operation and it really bogged down their investigation and consequently essendon (et al) too

still, co-operation doesn't have to involve joint investigations

No it doesnt DC...they get "co-operation" all over the world. Its not always an easy road or quick one but they aren't compromised in the course of their execution.

WADA/ASADA have really been 'helped" by joining forces with local codes They can't wait to do this again....oh thats right they won't !!

No it doesnt DC...they get "co-operation" all over the world. Its not always an easy road or quick one but they aren't compromised in the course of their execution.

WADA/ASADA have really been 'helped" by joining forces with local codes They can't wait to do this again....oh thats right they won't !!

i'm not supporting joint investigations bb

afl/asada really compromised themselves by this little arrangement

maybe they thought they could "control"the afl by letting them pizz inside the tent - i dunno

Little is a bully and he thought that he would stroll in and ride roughshod over the AFL and anyone else; it didn't take him long to realise that it doesn't work that way in sporting competitions. Hird thought he would just go along for the ride and that he would be safe behind Little and I reckon he's [censored] off that it didn't work that way.

I heard on 3AW's rumour file this morning that they are expecting notices to be issued before Australia day and that wouldn't surprise me; Jobe Watson is being more realistic than anyone else at Essendon, he thinks he might be in strife.

i'm not supporting joint investigations bb

afl/asada really compromised themselves by this little arrangement

maybe they thought they could "control"the afl by letting them pizz inside the tent - i dunno

DC I reckon its the other way round. The AFL might have been hoping to have one hand on the tiller !!...and all the whiles signalling to 'other' ships

DC I reckon its the other way round. The AFL might have been hoping to have one hand on the tiller !!...and all the whiles signalling to 'other' ships

haha, probably both ways

asada thought that would ensure co-operation plus they could keep them close

afl thought they could use it to "control" the damage as is their mo

bad choice for both

Yep...strange bedfellows. ..and it's the morning after !! Lol

Yep...strange bedfellows. ..and it's the morning after !! Lol

bit like bbo and stuie

that was always going to end in grief

Although it will never be proven unless Shane carter is in massive poo somehow and needs to give information but I would be quite confident that hird used in his playing days. what exactly who knows but you don't change your thinking to PEDs and if he is happy to be injected for a tan, I have no doubt he would of taken something that was note edge...makes me wonder about wooey as well

Do others think hird may have tested the boundaries in his playing career?

If so he would have been one of many. This is one of those truths that dares not speak it's name at all clubs.

I would add. One of my former employees is married to an undercover police detective. She told me many years ago that Hird's house had been raided by the police in possible connection to PED's. Funny enough reports of the same story popped up in the media when the issue blew up this year.

Edited December 19, 201311 yr by america de cali

Interesting that the interim head of Cycling Australia has come out and said the they will support the maximum sanction if Michael Rodgers if found guilty of doping. Rodgers has been suspended after his A sample tested positive for the same thing Alberto Contador was suspended for and stripped of his Tour de France win.

I have no idea how to link articles now.. but it is an Age article from today.

Edited December 19, 201311 yr by Cards13

Interesting that the interim head of Cycling Australia has come out and said the they will support the maximum sanction if Michael Rodgers if found guilty of doping. Rodgers has been suspended after his A sample tested positive for the same thing Alberto Contador was suspended for and stripped of his Tour de France win.

I'd just be careful on this one. Two riders (Rogers and Breyne) tested positive for Clenbuterol after racing in China for something that's a known problem in beef there, so much so that WADA have a warning out on it: http://www.wada-ama.org/en/media-center/archives/articles/athletes-must-show-caution-due-to-contaminated-meat/

Taking a weight-loss drug at the tail-end of the season for a no-name race - and by riders who have ongoing contracts? Doesn't quite add up.

As Robbie McEwen tweeted "one thing for sure - not many riders will put their hand up to race there in '14"

Edited December 19, 201311 yr by bing181

Although it will never be proven unless Shane carter is in massive poo somehow and needs to give information but I would be quite confident that hird used in his playing days. what exactly who knows but you don't change your thinking to PEDs and if he is happy to be injected for a tan, I have no doubt he would of taken something that was note edge...makes me wonder about wooey as well

Do others think hird may have tested the boundaries in his playing career?

with benefit of hindsight ..its not far fetched at all. He had his share of knocks. Commendable to come back, but how was he aided and what did he possibly get a taste for and a skewed appreciation of ?

I'd just be careful on this one. Two riders (Rogers and Breyne) tested positive for Clenbuterol after racing in China for something that's a known problem in beef there, so much so that WADA have a warning out on it: http://www.wada-ama.org/en/media-center/archives/articles/athletes-must-show-caution-due-to-contaminated-meat/

Taking a weight-loss drug at the tail-end of the season for a no-name race - and by riders who have ongoing contracts? Doesn't quite add up.

As Robbie McEwen tweeted "one thing for sure - not many riders will put their hand up to race there in '14"

Binga I was more highlighting the interim CEO and his loud comments. He being Adrian Anderson... Blowing this trumpet at the AFL.

Binga I was more highlighting the interim CEO and his loud comments. He being Adrian Anderson... Blowing this trumpet at the AFL.

Yes, understood, was just commenting on the Rogers' situation rather than the AFL/ASADA situation.

AA didn't even need to say anything, as it's nothing to do with Cycling Australia, but you're right, makes an "interesting" parallel with how the AFL view things. Though not for much longer one imagines.

I'd just be careful on this one. Two riders (Rogers and Breyne) tested positive for Clenbuterol after racing in China for something that's a known problem in beef there, so much so that WADA have a warning out on it: http://www.wada-ama.org/en/media-center/archives/articles/athletes-must-show-caution-due-to-contaminated-meat/

Taking a weight-loss drug at the tail-end of the season for a no-name race - and by riders who have ongoing contracts? Doesn't quite add up.

As Robbie McEwen tweeted "one thing for sure - not many riders will put their hand up to race there in '14"

Everyone comes out with an excuse! Didn't condor use the same excuse when he tested positive in the Tour de France???

I'd just be careful on this one. Two riders (Rogers and Breyne) tested positive for Clenbuterol after racing in China for something that's a known problem in beef there, so much so that WADA have a warning out on it: http://www.wada-ama.org/en/media-center/archives/articles/athletes-must-show-caution-due-to-contaminated-meat/

Taking a weight-loss drug at the tail-end of the season for a no-name race - and by riders who have ongoing contracts? Doesn't quite add up.

As Robbie McEwen tweeted "one thing for sure - not many riders will put their hand up to race there in '14"

No mate, if i could tell you stories I know of nationally cycling heroes. I wouldn't trust any of them and I'm happy that we as a club are (hopefully) no longer involved with anyone from the cycling fraternity.

I'd just be careful on this one. Two riders (Rogers and Breyne) tested positive for Clenbuterol after racing in China for something that's a known problem in beef there, so much so that WADA have a warning out on it: http://www.wada-ama.org/en/media-center/archives/articles/athletes-must-show-caution-due-to-contaminated-meat/

Good luck with that argument. It's unlikely to wash - you need to eat about a dozen cows in a day to register a minimal trace.