On The Couch - 13 May

[thaipantsman 180]

Mate, the man, woman, beast or whatever the heck he is posts gifs (which i must admit i shamefully enjoy) and stirs the pot on Demonland for a living, which many people stupidly get sucked into, and retort back. (Which i also must admit i do find kinda funny).

He knows as much as us, which is sweet effffffff alllllllllll, so don't over think it.

I KNOW .....only taking the P with Stuie.

[Norm Smith's Curse 2,602]

Gameplans in footy are quite amusing sometimes. Clarko's Cluster,The press and now the Geelong Highway is the in thing. All other teams follow the leader then draft the players for a required gameplan and then prepare for that gameplan. Then teams figure out a way to outplay the old premiership gameplan. Bailey wanted a run and gun style of play through the guts of the ground. The press came in and blew away this plan. Now with some tinkering teams are shying away from the boundary plan of Malthouse and our Neeld and are looking through the corridor once again. It seems part of Bailey's plan is back and trending well. I'm not trying to pot Neeld and pump up Bailey I just laugh at the merry go round of trending gameplans.

very astute observation. Its utterly ridiculous to come in to a young side and try to get them to adopt the latest game plan of one of the good sides at the time because you don't have the cattle but also because game plans adapt and are beaten . You are better off making your own to suit the circumstances.

remember that under daniher the arrival if a young and super quick Aaron Davey basically invented forward pressure and daniher came up with some other ideas like the mid huddle then spread during kick outs, etc.

a good coach doesn't copy they create and adapt.

[rjay 25,161]

very astute observation. Its utterly ridiculous to come in to a young side and try to get them to adopt the latest game plan of one of the good sides at the time because you don't have the cattle but also because game plans adapt and are beaten . You are better off making your own to suit the circumstances.

remember that under daniher the arrival if a young and super quick Aaron Davey basically invented forward pressure and daniher came up with some other ideas like the mid huddle then spread during kick outs, etc.

a good coach doesn't copy they create and adapt.

No, Walls came up with the huddle in the early 80's when coaching Fitzroy.

...and on the game plan thing, there is much more to it than the name game...Clarko's cluster etc..as Chris Scott will say their game plan will change a number of times throughout a season. There is no game plan of one of the good sides and the good sides younger players are expected to cope with numerous changes throughout the season or they don't play.

You're right that a good coach does create and adapt. It's a pity Lyon didn't understand this when he wrote off a whole bunch of coaches because they were from Geelong or were Rocket Eade.

[Bonkers 994]

very astute observation. Its utterly ridiculous to come in to a young side and try to get them to adopt the latest game plan of one of the good sides at the time because you don't have the cattle but also because game plans adapt and are beaten . You are better off making your own to suit the circumstances.

remember that under daniher the arrival if a young and super quick Aaron Davey basically invented forward pressure and daniher came up with some other ideas like the mid huddle then spread during kick outs, etc.

a good coach doesn't copy they create and adapt.

The reason Geelong can create new styles of play along with the Hawks is because they draft players who have the skills to play any style. They are above all things good footballers, have great skills, hands, football IQ & are competitors. The teams that don't have these types of players all over the ground adopt defensive game styles. Sydney, St.kilda & briefly Freo have all adopted this approach under Roos & Lyon. It's the reason why Colingwood is now being found out because they are trying to play an expansive game without the ability to execute it. Malthouse understood his teams limitations where as Buckley doesn't.

[cowboy_from_hell 2,390]

very astute observation. Its utterly ridiculous to come in to a young side and try to get them to adopt the latest game plan of one of the good sides at the time because you don't have the cattle but also because game plans adapt and are beaten . You are better off making your own to suit the circumstances.

remember that under daniher the arrival if a young and super quick Aaron Davey basically invented forward pressure and daniher came up with some other ideas like the mid huddle then spread during kick outs, etc.

a good coach doesn't copy they create and adapt.

Yeah I agree. Don't follow the leader be the leader. Geelong could of packed it all in after losing finals games a couple of years ago and followed the pies gameplan but they stuck to their guns and it is paying off. We drafted runners under Bailey and once contested footy became king blokes like Bennell,Maric and Morton to name a few had no chance. It is one of a billion reasons why we are one step closer to hell. Now we have a gameplan that relies on contested footy center clearances and contested marks. It's a shame Neeld can't see that we are god awful in clearances and we can't use the boundary because we can't kick. We can run and carry the ball through the middle we have seen that before Neeld came to to us.

[dee-luded 2,959]

i am well aware of what RDB and Slug did.

But i also give credit to Swooper. He kept that group up for 5 years.

Remember those 2 brutal wins against Hawthorn in 90?

Twice in 7 days.

your well aware, I don't think you are aware, of all the work they did do... & the players characters they developed. and the influence these core players had on the resurgence...

& then add Stretch in 1986,,, & in 1987, Spalding, Viney, Dean, etc.

the work to right the ship, the repair of the culture, the fitness, & the professionalism, let alone the character of the group...

all undertaken by Barassi/Jordan. as well as the foray into Ireland, to return with a group of young men, including Sean Wight & Jimma Stynes.

.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Roos would probably be a good choice for coach if he really wants to do the job, but whoever the new coach is, they must have a healthy respect for the Geelong style of football - it's natural, it's successful, it's being copied in various forms by several clubs and it's attractive to watch - what more could you want!

Go after Bomba Thompson...

but I think Roos is the better culture shifter.

but I like the Cats gamestyle better.

.

[Sir Why You Little 37,195]

your well aware, I don't think you are aware, of all the work they did do... & the players characters they developed. and the influence these core players had on the resurgence...

& then add Stretch in 1986,,, & in 1987, Spalding, Viney, Dean, etc.

the work to right the ship, the repair of the culture, the fitness, & the professionalism, let alone the character of the group...

all undertaken by Barassi/Jordan. as well as the foray into Ireland, to return with a group of young men, including Sean Wight & Jimma Stynes.

.

i am well aware DL of what was there for Swooper.

Swooper did not waste his opportunity.

I don't consider Neeld to be doing the same job as RDB. he certainly won't get 5 years.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Gameplans in footy are quite amusing sometimes. Clarko's Cluster,The press and now the Geelong Highway is the in thing. All other teams follow the leader then draft the players for a required gameplan and then prepare for that gameplan. Then teams figure out a way to outplay the old premiership gameplan. Bailey wanted a run and gun style of play through the guts of the ground. The press came in and blew away this plan. Now with some tinkering teams are shying away from the boundary plan of Malthouse and our Neeld and are looking through the corridor once again. It seems part of Bailey's plan is back and trending well. I'm not trying to pot Neeld and pump up Bailey I just laugh at the merry go round of trending gameplans.

The reduction of the interchange in Bailey's last year, has imo, had a small part in this change, but too me there is still too many players running from one end to the other, jamming up the play..

perhaps a 2 man interchange, with 4 subs would help.

.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Like Dennis Pagan or Terry Wallace? How did they go at their second clubs? Pagan came off a premiership at North, but Carlton bumped along the bottom for years with him at the helm.

I'm with Chris Dawes. There's no magic bullet. We just need good people in the club, doing their jobs properly, no matter where they come from.

when the club has let the culture drag along the ground for years its takes an awful amount of work to fix it, at great expence to the Coach & Board.

the previous boards caused this problem by not understanding it, & its been slipping since the early 90's, but people didn't recognise it. it went off the rails with laziness & poor efforts since 2002ish.

* Chris Dawes is right, there is no Magic Bullet & this is why talented coaches mostly refuse to go to a club which has not cleaned up its culture mess.

We have a man who is putting his baalls on the line to do this job, & I think he's meeting up against resistance from people who don't understand this stuff, & are fighting him.

A coach has to be aloof to do this cleanup job successfully. you Cannot be a happy chappy like Danners was,,,, & yet still do this dirty job. you make enemies getting it done.

... it hurts losing long time mates & some players, & admin even, with reject it out of hand.

... this is what happens when the Culture & the Values & the Professional-isms, & the Fitness, are really let go to the pack, for 10 Yrs...

.

[rjay 25,161]

Go after Bomba Thompson...

but I think Roos is the better culture shifter.

but I like the Cats gamestyle better.

.

He might well be looking for a job soon and looking to resurrect his own image.

[Straight Sets Simon 23,113]

I only saw a few minutes if the show where Roos was saying Goodes still has "muscle memory" from playing soccer, hence the slide tackles. I would love him to coach Melbourne, but he is easily the worst football person when it comes to TV.

[P-man 13,366]

I only saw a few minutes if the show where Roos was saying Goodes still has "muscle memory" from playing soccer, hence the slide tackles. I would love him to coach Melbourne, but he is easily the worst football person when it comes to TV.

Having played alot of soccer myself, the way Goodes slides in with his feet before adjusting makes me think Roos might have a point. From memory he played for a long time at the top junior level before making the switch.

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

I still see far too much attention put on the coach.

Have a look at our list. Do you think lazy ingrained habits will change from Sylvia if Roos is appointed? Do you think Jamar will gain some speed in his legs? Do you think Bail will start hitting targets and no longer tackle opposition players too high?

Maybe Roos is better than Neeld. He has proven himself at a completely different club with completely different ethics and culture.

No coach will quick fix our club. I'm not saying everything Neeld has done for us is the right thing. I do question aspects of the game plan and some recruiting moves.

But holy hell out list is an absolute disgrace. Y'all be blind.

Edited May 16, 2013 by stevethemanjordan

[stevethemanjordan 6,952]

Give me Roos and a 75 percent cull of the list and ill take it.

[P-man 13,366]

The list is poor. It is however not THIS poor. There is talent spread throughout, but alot of it is at a critical development stage. Even Jack Viney is not immune to going backwards in this regard, if we don't get the right people in place.

[dee-luded 2,959]

I still see far too much attention put on the coach.

Have a look at our list. Do you think lazy ingrained habits will change from Sylvia if Roos is appointed? Do you think Jamar will gain some speed in his legs? Do you think Bail will start hitting targets and no longer tackle opposition players too high?

Maybe Roos is better than Neeld. He has proven himself at a completely different club with completely different ethics and culture.

No coach will quick fix our club. I'm not saying everything Neeld has done for us is the right thing. I do question aspects of the game plan and some recruiting moves.

But holy hell out list is an absolute disgrace. Y'all be blind.

Neeld Is going about the quick Hard Fix now,,, this is why there is a Perception we've gone backwards,,,, but in reality we have jumped forwards.... it just not showing in ladder terms just Yet.

but this is the most thorough fast & hard culture shift this club has ever had that I can remember. Neeld wasn't given the 5 yrs afforded Ron... Neeld has 3 & its been like pulling teeth to some who loved Rivers & Moloney,,, green etc.

But, This is,,, what we need & must do!

... this Is why we have not developed players over the last 15 - 20 Years, to their optimum... this is why the greens, yze's, bruces, robbo's, whites, only achieved 3rd Gear out of their talents.... & so many others did nothing much at all...

**** If, you really want to get a top shelf 'Name' coach,,, then wait until Neeld had finished the Heavy lifting next year... this year we will improve, from where we are at now, in our general play.. especially after the key players return to the structures.

the wheel is Turning, but most don't understand the concept, or the need, & are simply panicking.

sacking him Now, will turn us into the Richmond side of the late 80's.... & then we Will be losing players... because they will give up,,, & then they will depart us.

.

[Grand New Flag 3,227]

It is beyond me how anyone can defend Mark Neeld.

Defending the indefensible!

[Sir Why You Little 37,195]

Neeld Is going about the quick Hard Fix now,,, this is why there is a Perception we've gone backwards,,,, but in reality we have jumped forwards.... it just not showing in ladder terms just Yet.

but this is the most thorough fast & hard culture shift this club has ever had that I can remember. Neeld wasn't given the 5 yrs afforded Ron... Neeld has 3 & its been like pulling teeth to some who loved Rivers & Moloney,,, green etc.

But, This is,,, what we need & must do!

... this Is why we have not developed players over the last 15 - 20 Years, to their optimum... this is why the greens, yze's, bruces, robbo's, whites, only achieved 3rd Gear out of their talents.... & so many others did nothing much at all...

**** If, you really want to get a top shelf 'Name' coach,,, then wait until Neeld had finished the Heavy lifting next year... this year we will improve, from where we are at now, in our general play.. especially after the key players return to the structures.

the wheel is Turning, but most don't understand the concept, or the need, & are simply panicking.

sacking him Now, will turn us into the Richmond side of the late 80's.... & then we Will be losing players... because they will give up,,, & then they will depart us.

.

DL you cannot be serious in expecting the football public to wait until the END OF NEXT YEAR before doing anything.

There is a Broadcast Deal that the MFC at present are not helping...It has been spoken of at HQ.

We cannot continue to play games that are over 5 minutes into the first Quarter.

Neeld may be heading in the right direction in your eyes.

But his message is not getting through.

Call it an energy blockage.

[dee-luded 2,959]

DL you cannot be serious in expecting the football public to wait until the END OF NEXT YEAR before doing anything.

There is a Broadcast Deal that the MFC at present are not helping...It has been spoken of at HQ.

We cannot continue to play games that are over 5 minutes into the first Quarter.

Neeld may be heading in the right direction in your eyes.

But his message is not getting through.

Call it an energy blockage.

I wrote Next year. I did not write the end of next year.

Its the cleansing that is cleaning out the old, for the New...

& its refreshing the values of hardwork & effort, & focusing on self improvement, as against partying up. just as a starting point. this would be an excellent platform for a Roos or other, to launch their work from.

this is when you go after a Matthews or Roos or Bomba. NOT NOW!...

.

[binman 43,921]

Sorry dee-luded but on this particlar issue i think you may have an apt posting name.

There was a time i would have agreed with you (last season to be precise and perhaps even part of this season). Not any more. Last Sunday sealed it for me.

Neeld has to go. Soon. Bye. Then bye bye

Edited May 16, 2013 by binman