Just like last time hey. We have stuffed many a high draft pick already and the players we already have get sacrificed.

If we're looking at it like that though, WYL, pick 3 and 4 are the picks we've struggled most with. It's that tough area of really needing a pick 1 or 2, but just missing out on the superstar. I admit there is a chance we could finish third last and still pick up exactly what we need, but I think it's less likely. I'm not saying we should tank necessarily, I don't think we've got enough players out there to kick a winning score. Even against GC. I could see maybe a Green bobbing up or a Sylvia and Moloney having a blinder, but as a number of posters have already said, it actually does absolutely nothing for us. You don't seriously think if we beat GC tomorrow that we'll gain or maintain any more members as a result of it.

I understand where you're coming from WYL, but the higher the draft pick, the less likely you are to stuff it up.

And we get Viney for pick 23 instead of pick 3.

If we're looking at it like that though, WYL, pick 3 and 4 are the picks we've struggled most with. It's that tough area of really needing a pick 1 or 2, but just missing out on the superstar. I admit there is a chance we could finish third last and still pick up exactly what we need, but I think it's less likely. I'm not saying we should tank necessarily, I don't think we've got enough players out there to kick a winning score. Even against GC. I could see maybe a Green bobbing up or a Sylvia and Moloney having a blinder, but as a number of posters have already said, it actually does absolutely nothing for us. You don't seriously think if we beat GC tomorrow that we'll gain or maintain any more members as a result of it.

I just think the whole fabric of the club is at an all tome low. Wins will help to repair that, however small and irrelevavent they may seem.

The players need some light. Its not all about 2 or 3 in the draft. We have already proved that.

Lets face it. The draft is our Grand Final. I would rather 1st than 3rd. Sponsors, kids supporting us, memberships etc wont make a difference with our current play/state of affairs. At least we can sell a bright future with our current drafts picks/players and the potential for a bright future with this yrs crop.

Either way, one draft can make a huge difference especially when you have 3 first rounders and the possibility of Viney in the 2nd round (if it eventuates)

Also, WYL, everyone knows your stance on this matter. No need to go on about it

So should Melbourne go flat out to win every remaining game or not?

I believe it's more than likely that we've been trying our guts out all year and are just not good enough. The ridiculousness of all of this is that if we do loose, we'll be under suspicious of tanking, but really we're just hopeless.

From 2002-2007, Carlton had a similar streak and were just as suspicious, if not more so, yet they don't come under fire for it. And christ, do I get sick of hearing Carlton supporters call us up for tanking.

A win against GC or GWS does very little for us. A win against the Kangaroos might have meant something. I don't think we should go out to loose - ultimately, we don't need to. We don't have a team that can consistently post over ten goals. Don't win many games like that.

Lets face it. The draft is our Grand Final. I would rather 1st than 3rd. Sponsors, kids supporting us, memberships etc wont make a difference with our current play/state of affairs. At least we can sell a bright future with our current drafts picks/players and the potential for a bright future with this yrs crop.

Either way, one draft can make a huge difference especially when you have 3 first rounders and the possibility of Viney in the 2nd round (if it eventuates)

Also, WYL, everyone knows your stance on this matter. No need to go on about it

We have had a bucketload of high draft picks over the last few years. Where is the "huge difference"?

I believe it's more than likely that we've been trying our guts out all year and are just not good enough. The ridiculousness of all of this is that if we do loose, we'll be under suspicious of tanking, but really we're just hopeless.

From 2002-2007, Carlton had a similar streak and were just as suspicious, if not more so, yet they don't come under fire for it. And christ, do I get sick of hearing Carlton supporters call us up for tanking.

A win against GC or GWS does very little for us. A win against the Kangaroos might have meant something. I don't think we should go out to loose - ultimately, we don't need to. We don't have a team that can consistently post over ten goals. Don't win many games like that.

I can agree with that. We may not win another game this year as we have no goalkickers, but i just can't believe how many people on here are happy to see it happening.

It hurts my guts tbh to see this club so poor.

Jesus Christ.

That's worked wonders for us thus far hasn't it?

I've already addressed this though, PM. We stuffed it up with Scully; in hindsight, but we're now putting a greater focus into our FD and I have enough faith to believe we'll get it right if given 1, 2, 9, 22 or whatever it is. Surely you know that this midfield won't cut it. Those that are saying add Viney, bring Clark back and we'll be fine are kidding themselves.

I'm more worried about our developing of players than our drafting.

Very astute point, 45HG16. It's our inability to develop the likes of Trengove, Scully and arguably even Gysberts that has been our downfall so far.

And we get Viney for pick 23 instead of pick 3.

Exactly.

Jack Viney complicates this issue, just as the priority pick did in 2009.

For mine:

Picks #1, #2, Viney, PSD pick #1, big losing culture > Viney, #4, #23, two meaningless victories, lesser losing culture, PSD #3

so is anyone going to answer for me the picks we get if we do finish last.. i know it is 1 and 2... viney father son in the 20's..... there's 2 others in top 20 yeh?

The difference is a different recruitment dept, and a coaching/development structure designed to bring players on. We also have a fitness guru who can help develop individuals fitness. This is why players like Trengove have struggled this year. With the amount of work being put into past high draft picks and the possibiity of 1,2 11 and Viney I have more faith the club will develop a few stars and some excellent A grade players

The issues of the past with recruitment and development cannot be compared. We are a different club to last year

OK - Option 1 is we win every game for the rest of the year by at least 5 goals despite our injury list, and finish (shock, horror) 14th.

Option 2 is we lose every game for the rest of the year by at least 5 goals, finish last and get picks 1 & 2.

Which of these options gives us more cause to "believe in Neeld"?

I can agree with that. We may not win another game this year as we have no goalkickers, but i just can't believe how many people on here are happy to see it happening.

It hurts my guts tbh to see this club so poor.

I also agree entirely. We have no consistent goalkickers so winning is difficult. However, for me, in anyway accepting defeat is anathema.

I just think the whole fabric of the club is at an all tome low. Wins will help to repair that, however small and irrelevavent they may seem.

I truly believe a victory against weak interstate teams will do nothing for our club fabric. If anything those sorts of wins may actually promote misapprehension of false strength. The Bailey era taught me that. Downhill skiing at its finest. How many times have we seen MFC beat an ordinary interstate side at home?

The players need some light. Its not all about 2 or 3 in the draft. We have already proved that.

I agree.

so is anyone going to answer for me the picks we get if we do finish last.. i know it is 1 and 2... viney father son in the 20's..... there's 2 others in top 20 yeh?

No - one's answered yet.

If we finish last - #1, #2, #3? #12? #23 to use on Viney?

I can agree with that. We may not win another game this year as we have no goalkickers, but i just can't believe how many people on here are happy to see it happening.

It hurts my guts tbh to see this club so poor.

I can understand that too, WYL. But I think for many it has got to the point where the team or current list offers very little solace and thus we look toward the draft for hope.

What about winning, so we don't rip the hearts out of the faithfull and converted who already barrack for this club.

Don't worry about the sponsors,kids future draft picks.

There are so many current supporters just hanging on by a thread and this might be just the the thing that stops them from renewing there membership or going to that extra game.

What ever the outcome of the rest of the year, MFC is looking at a huge hole in membership and sponsorship next year. MFC has been an on an off field rabble this year and an unmitigated disaster. IMO the wooden spoon is neither here nor there. It just further evidence of the basket case that we are.

I would welcome the improved draft pick positions

.I will gladly swap a few polyester jumpers for the opportunity to get better players.

Too hard for some.

There is a very good chance that Gold Coast and GWS won't nominate for Viney.

Even if they do I would be happy to use pick 3.

It's not that its too hard for some. It's just that some people disagree with your opinion.

Yeah but GWS have $cully who's ripping it up with 9 possessions to three quarter time, so if he continues with that form GWS will win easy.

$cully finished with 20 disposals so he must have had some last quarter.

I think it's out of the question that we'll be tanking tomorrow although it won't be an easy game to win come what may. The Suns did beat Richmond a few weeks ago and the Tigers have comfortably beaten us twice this year.

What we need tomorrow is a good start because, as GCS showed against the Tiges and GWS showed against Port Adelaide, you simply can't give away a big start to anyone, not even the new franchise teams.

The difference is a different recruitment dept, and a coaching/development structure designed to bring players on. We also have a fitness guru who can help develop individuals fitness. This is why players like Trengove have struggled this year. With the amount of work being put into past high draft picks and the possibiity of 1,2 11 and Viney I have more faith the club will develop a few stars and some excellent A grade players

The issues of the past with recruitment and development cannot be compared. We are a different club to last year

Another very salient point.

There is a very good chance that Gold Coast and GWS won't nominate for Viney.

Even if they do I would be happy to use pick 3.

It's not that its too hard for some. It's just that some people disagree with your opinion.

They will 100% bid on Viney.

Greene is GWS most dominant player - he isn't fit to tie Vineys bootlace and would've definately told Senile this.

GC need Viney more than anyone, even us!

This thread might be premature but with GWS leading Port by 7 goals, the landscape changes dramatically:

Assuming GWS win, and

GC beat Melbourne

GC beat GWS

GWS beat Melbourne

Then the spoon is ours.

The thought sickens me in the guts

BUT

With picks 1, 2, Viney, another high pick and a star free agent like Cloke- it's last chance saloon for the Dees to turn this thing around.

No excuses. It's tick tock if we lose to Gold Coast.

They will 100% bid on Viney.

You don't know that for sure. So ill keep my opinion. But I respect yours.