Tom Scully

[Friday 71]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/118456/default.aspx

[rpfc 28,052]

No one player is bigger than the club.

I'm over all this crap about will he wont he go.

Tom has been off the field hopeless to this club, after day 1 being presented the great Ron Barassi's 31 to today watching as his team-mates Trengove Sylvia etc go in to fight his battles in the media, I find it appalling what he has done to the great MFC. I understand more than anyone, the figure being presented to nothing more than a baby teenager and how tempting it may be- that is fine but the way he has acted has shown nothing but disdain to the club that gave him his big break.

It is not an issue as to whether he is a liar or not, politicians and journalists do it every day; that isn't my issue- however he sat down in that media conference and said to everyone that offers were not being considered till the end of the year. Two days ago, everything changed and he disrespected Jim, Dean, his teammates and us as the supporters.

I love Tom Scully as a footballer but give me my two draft picks and let's get two young footballers who want to play for MFC. Kruezer, Murphy even bloody Gary f***ing Rohan can sign for their crap clubs and our boy can't commit to Australia's best team.

JV > TS

Poor Tom. I hope this isn't a popular reaction.

And when he stood up in his press conference he said he hasn't had contact - his reps have now - and that he won't consider offers untill the end of the year - he evidently won't.

And don't forget that we gave his reps our offer and that is what mitigated the situation with Blucher gettin GWS to formalise their offer the way we have.

We are in a fight to keep a player - we are we so weary of a fight?

Did we not think after we got all this talent that they wouldn't be targetted?

Let's put on our big boy pants and keep the kid.

[H_T 3,032]

I think it can be done if there is no direct link between the payments and the club. ie not sancitoned by the MFC or as a result of his employment with MFC, if you know what i mean. Judd's "employment" with Visy for example technically has nothing to do with the Blues.

I love that stranga. "Technically".

Apparently the late Dick Pratt, former Carlton president and former CEO Mr.VISY himself, had nothing to do with each other.

[Guest Rojik of the Arctic]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/118456/default.aspx

"The rules have been tightened up since then so any arrangement entered into with the purpose of keeping someone at a club or getting them to move a club would go into the salary cap," he said.

Anderson said the Demons would be well compensated if Scully left to join the Giants after his first two years in the AFL.

As if it wasn't already apparent the AFL HQ boys are just about packing his bags for him.

[censored] that crew [censored] me to tears.

[Guest Artie Bucco]

No, Rpfc' is the hero. I'm the villain. Get it right.

I'm in turn reminded of Tony Montana.

"You need people like me so you can point your fu!%!king fingers and say ... 'that's the bad guy'!"

Is it wrong that this post reminded me of... Michael Bolton?

[Dee Fan 3,247]

I don't think it will/can happen as I think Adrian Anderson said today that any third party arrangement will need to be included as part of the salary cap.

I'm not sure they can control that; I run my own company and if I said to Tom Scully's management that I would like to hire him at say $50k per year to do promotional work for my company then it's got nothing to do with the AFL, or the MFC for that matter (provided it didn't interfere with his football duties).

[Hiram Cowfreak 76]

We had Cam Bruce on similar from 08-10.

Sadly at this point in development, Cam Bruce was a better kick than Scully is!

If you can get $600 large for that what would you get if you could kick both feet and take a grab?

[Arrow 1,257]

Poor Tom. I hope this isn't a popular reaction.

And when he stood up in his press conference he said he hasn't had contact - his reps have now - and that he won't consider offers untill the end of the year - he evidently won't.

And don't forget that we gave his reps our offer and that is what mitigated the situation with Blucher gettin GWS to formalise their offer the way we have.

We are in a fight to keep a player - we are we so weary of a fight?

Did we not think after we got all this talent that they wouldn't be targetted?

Let's put on our big boy pants and keep the kid.

You don't think the club is fighting for the kid rpfc?

It's not like they're sitting waiting for him to walk out the door.

By your theory we put all our eggs in one basket and spend all our cap to keep this one guy when next year their window is still open and they take Trengove or Sylvia or Gysberts because we can't keep them. At some point you have to consider that losing him isn't the worst result. Of the previous big name moves Judd & Ablett, all 4 teams involved would consider that they won in hindsight; WC in particular when no-one saw it happening.

I'd prefer to keep him too but there are bigger concerns than just the 31.

[H_T 3,032]

No one player is bigger than the club.

I'm over all this crap about will he wont he go.

Tom has been off the field hopeless to this club, after day 1 being presented the great Ron Barassi's 31 to today watching as his team-mates Trengove Sylvia etc go in to fight his battles in the media, I find it appalling what he has done to the great MFC. I understand more than anyone, the figure being presented to nothing more than a baby teenager and how tempting it may be- that is fine but the way he has acted has shown nothing but disdain to the club that gave him his big break.

It is not an issue as to whether he is a liar or not, politicians and journalists do it every day; that isn't my issue- however he sat down in that media conference and said to everyone that offers were not being considered till the end of the year. Two days ago, everything changed and he disrespected Jim, Dean, his teammates and us as the supporters.

I love Tom Scully as a footballer but give me my two draft picks and let's get two young footballers who want to play for MFC. Kruezer, Murphy even bloody Gary f***ing Rohan can sign for their crap clubs and our boy can't commit to Australia's best team.

JV > TS

I believe he has left all discussion between club and his manager and as stated when he "stood" (not sit) in front of a media scrum and said he would leave discussions involving him until season's end.

This is the only time I've seen him "act" and "present well" to the media throng (other than a Robbo interview earlier in the year), and he couldn't have been more impressive. Far from "hopeless" as you describe it. But each to their own.

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Apparently the late Dick Pratt, former Carlton president and former CEO Mr.VISY himself, had nothing to do with each other.

Or any of the women either person was seeing while alive.

[P-man 13,366]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/208/newsid/118456/default.aspx

Have there been any reprimands against Carlton if third party deals are suddenly frowned upon?

Make no mistake, they'll do everything they can to ensure he goes to GWS, especially now that it would appear the star player options are becoming fewer and fewer. Why else would GWS be offering this disgusting amount of coin?

Edited July 13, 2011 by High Tower
Deleted foul language

[drdrake 3,124]

Just want to note on compensation - for first-round picks, the pick is immediately after the pick the club gets at that point in the draft.

Now, all over The Age today is the suggestion that Melbourne would get the Ablett level - two first-round picks. We're looking at the 2011 draft as basically a spud mob - but the 2012 draft looks to be one of the best in a long, long time.

Load up. Three first-round selections. One will go on JV (understandably) but we will get two others on top of this. Load up in that 2012 draft as the final echelon and push from 2015.

Agree, but I have posted before a better plan of attack if it works. If Tom goes, we get a mid first round pick and an end first round pick, these are like priority picks. We Know that Viney will cost us our first round pick, if this is can happy the MFC can win from losing Scully, we offer our first pick in 2012 and maybe a player to GWS for one of the 17yo picks, we pick up what we consider a top 5 pick of the 2012 draft for this deal. We then will only lose our second round pick for Viney, who form all accounts would be a top 10 pick, we then still have our mid first round pick and end first round pick to use. Which means from 2012 crop of players we will be able to add 4 first round picks.

[Striker475 696]

Wrong. Third-party deals cannot be included to some extent.

For example. Player signs a media deal with a club. Is that included as a part of salary cap? No. Why would it be? It's an agreement purely between player and media company - the club has nothing to do with it.

Any third-party arrangement specifically arranged by the club is of course included under the salary cap, but any third-party deal with no club input - from another company with no ties between the adminstration of the company and the club - surely cannot be counted towards the salary cap. If it is, that's a gross violation of the rules by the AFL - and possibly (lawyer types help me here) something that could be used in court?

[Bonkers 988]

I'm not sure they can control that; I run my own company and if I said to Tom Scully's management that I would like to hire him at say $50k per year to do promotional work for my company then it's got nothing to do with the AFL, or the MFC for that matter (provided it didn't interfere with his football duties).

Exactly, the AFL has no control over what contracts Tom signs with organizations outside of football. Pretty obvious where the AFL want Tom to be playing in 2012. The AFL really is a dictatorship.

[loges 6,767]

Wrong. Third-party deals cannot be included to some extent.

For example. Player signs a media deal with a club. Is that included as a part of salary cap? No. Why would it be? It's an agreement purely between player and media company - the club has nothing to do with it.

Any third-party arrangement specifically arranged by the club is of course included under the salary cap, but any third-party deal with no club input - from another company with no ties between the adminstration of the company and the club - surely cannot be counted towards the salary cap. If it is, that's a gross violation of the rules by the AFL - and possibly (lawyer types help me here) something that could be used in court?

And surely restraint of trade

[hardtack 10,422]

Tom has been off the field hopeless to this club, after day 1 being presented the great Ron Barassi's 31 to today watching as his team-mates Trengove Sylvia etc go in to fight his battles in the media, I find it appalling what he has done to the great MFC.

he stood up in front of a packed press gallery and stated exactly what his situation was. The fact that the journos saw fit to ask every player what they thought is hardly down to Scully's silence - that is simply a case of journos being journos.

I understand more than anyone, the figure being presented to nothing more than a baby teenager and how tempting it may be- that is fine but the way he has acted has shown nothing but disdain to the club that gave him his big break.

Gave him his big break???? Yes, I'm sure if we hadn't selected him, he would have come out at the end of the draft without a contract - he's lucky we saw his talent while every other team in the comp didn't have a clue..

It is not an issue as to whether he is a liar or not, politicians and journalists do it every day; that isn't my issue- however he sat down in that media conference and said to everyone that offers were not being considered till the end of the year. Two days ago, everything changed and he disrespected Jim, Dean, his teammates and us as the supporters.

There are two offers on the table (one from MFC and one from GWS) and it has been stated in crystal clear terms that he will not be considering them until season's end. How this can be perceived as disrespecting Jimmy, Dean or anyone else is way beyond me. He is being completely honest and transparent in his dealings.

I love Tom Scully as a footballer but give me my two draft picks and let's get two young footballers who want to play for MFC. Kruezer, Murphy even bloody Gary f***ing Rohan can sign for their crap clubs and our boy can't commit to Australia's best team.

He is still under contract and as such is under no obligation to sign up for a new contract yet. He is behaving like a responsible and very intelligent kid.

[deeko 952]

I am quite confident that most players do have income earning job's outside of there AFL commitments. It is impossible for the AFL to include this external income under the salary cap otherwise it would penalise players for external interests.

If someone could employ Tom maybe a couple days a week for a sneaky little $300k - $400k p.a. I would be greatly appreciative!

[hardtack 10,422]

If someone could employ Tom maybe a couple days a week for a sneaky little $300k - $400k p.a. I would be greatly appreciative!

I could employ him to privately coach my kids. I'm located in Sydney's inner west. Oh, hang on...

[GM11 745]

http://www.afl.com.a...56/default.aspx

"There's no doubt it has been tough for the club but it is so important we protect the integrity of the competition and the salary cap and the draft....."

Integrity? Should have done a retrospective on the Ju$$ deal then, because that blew the integrity right out of the water.

[Striker475 696]

And surely restraint of trade

That's what I would think - restrictions on employment, would come under employment law surely.

[loges 6,767]

Its strange, I don't remember these types of comments from the AFL when Geelong were openly running around trying to arrange 3rd party deals to keep Ablett

[Jaded No More 67,768]

I am quite confident that most players do have income earning job's outside of there AFL commitments. It is impossible for the AFL to include this external income under the salary cap otherwise it would penalise players for external interests.

Correct.

If for example our apparel sponsor decided to use Tom in their ad campaigns and catalogues, they would pay him separately just as Puma do with Judd, Buddy and Hodge.

The players come in and have their own relationship with that company, completely separate to the club/AFL.

The same would apply if say Tom was dabbling in property development with a private real estate company.

[jabberwocky 2,301]

"The rules have been tightened up since then so any arrangement entered into with the purpose of keeping someone at a club or getting them to move a club would go into the salary cap"

[nutbean 8,838]

If Tom is waiting on who will be our Coach it is a dangerous path to take. How can we let a second year player have any impact on who will coach us. The Coach will be the best for the Club not best for Tom Scully.

No its not a dangerous path to take. He is not deciding who the coach should be - he may be deciding how it affects him.

As a hypothetical - if he is weighing up the value of the non financials and it is a line ball decision if he wants to leave for the bigger buck or not - do you not think it might add a lot more weight to the decision to stay if he knows that a Malthouse is coming who is a premiership coach - or conversely, he has so much love and respect for Bails that he will leave if he is axed. He may be in love with notion of being coached by Sheeds ( OMG !!!)

It is no secret that Bails is also out of contract and will be reviewed at seasons end - I would suggest that TS would factor it into his decision making.

[loges 6,767]

"The rules have been tightened up since then so any arrangement entered into with the purpose of keeping someone at a club or getting them to move a club would go into the salary cap"

And how is this proven?