Jack Watts

[Felix 92]

Jack Watts, lets face it with the mixed messages, we can not honestly know what is happening with the young man, we can merely speculate.

All we can say is that he is stuck playing VFL football for Casey and not performing to everyones 'standards'.

The issue I have is the mixed messages we are receiving from the MFC about the boy, DB on 'footy classifieds' said that JW will play 4-5 'good' games (i forget the number) for Casey before getting a call up for the seniors, this was close tho the start of the season, and by this comment I would say JW has played at least two decent games for Casey, and should be in the side by round 12-14 dependent on VFL form. And then we hear from CC that Watts is still being developed as he is still gaining height & weight and MFC are taking a cautious approach in his development due to 'soft bones' and 'development', yet JW has played for Casey which is still tough football that is populated by some hard nuts out to impress their selectors for a spot on their 22.

And on top of all this there are the rumors surrounding JW on this forum and out and about chatting to 'football people' that JW has a 'bad attitude', JW wanting to be traded, being signed with Gold Coast, still not over his bad back, etc etc etc. At this moment it has all slipped my mind.

At the end of the day he will play for the MFC, and we (including myself) must be patient on when he will play. I like most other supporters desperately want him out on the MCG be it playing at CHF or rotating off the bench, we are salivating to see him out there. But at the end of the day we will not see young JW play until mid to late this season.

PS - Everyone need to stop comparing JW to other draftees. Especially comparing JW to NicNat & N.Riewoldt, they are different players in different circumstances.

[dee-luded 2,959]

Soft bones ? Aargh. Why did I click on this thread ?

What Are Growth Plate Injuries?

Fast Facts: An Easy-to-Read Series of Publications for the Public

Growth plates are located on the long bones of children and young people. These plates are areas of growing tissue near the end of the bones.

Each long bone has at least two growth plates-one at each end. This is where the long bones grow. When young people finish growing, the growth plates close and are replaced by solid bone.

Growth plate injuries occur mainly at the wrist, bones of the legs, or in the ankle, foot, or hip bones.

Who Gets Growth Plate Injuries?

Growth plate injuries happen to children and young people. The growth plate is the weakest part of the growing skeleton. Injuries to the plates are called fractures.

Growth plate fractures happen twice as often in boys as in girls.

What Causes Growth Plate Injuries?

Growth plate injuries happen for many reasons. Most occur after a sudden accident, such as falling or being hit hard on the leg. People who sometimes get injuries from overuse include:

• Gymnasts who practices for hours on the uneven bars
• Long-distance runners
• Baseball pitchers perfecting their curve balls.

The top reasons for growth plate injuries are:

• Falling down
• Competitive sports (like football)
• Recreational activities.

http://www.niams.nih...injuries_ff.asp

Edited May 3, 2010 by dee-luded

[Axis of Bob 11,844]

At the risk of comparing Jack to another draftee, I thought that it was very interesting to look at Jarrad Grant playing for the Bulldogs on Friday night. Grant is similar in style to Watts with his good speed and slight build as a key forward, but obviously not as skilled.

Grant was drafted the pick after Cale Morton, but has played about half a dozen games compared with Morton's 40 games. People are assuming he was a bust, but he looked really good on Friday.

Watts should be better than that, but it's interesting that he's taken a bit of extra time to start looking good while the midfielder with great endurance (Morton) has looked the goods from day 1.

That may not make any difference to the thread, but it's interesting to note.

[Tricky 341]

OK - that's 8 pages, well done all. I vote for a new thread: "Soft Bones" - anyone with me??

[Ron Burgundy 8,584]

I think Gumbleton will be an absolute gun - but he's been in the system for about 4 years and is only just starting to come on. Had a lot of injuries though.

And for those saying of you saying this is the 50,000 Jack Watts thread etc, a big part of this site involves a Demons chat-room - and, in this regard, pick one in 2008 was a pretty important pick for this club.

A lot of people are genuinely interested in seeing how this particular pick is developing/progressing.

[Swampfox 190]

It would be fair to say that one of the most posted names on football forums in this country would be that of Jack Watts

Melbourne Supporters have different points of view ranging from let’s be patient to some questioning if Jack Watts was the best choice at selection number 1 to some even being convinced he wasn’t

Of course it doesn’t help that from that draft the only high draft pick that isn’t playing seniors is Jack Watts

Then throw into the mix the opposition supporters who take great delight in creating irrational debate over Watts being a dud or not

Of course Melbourne supporters are not going to take that without some comeback and of course we have more than a fair share of Melbourne supporters who have been brainwashed into believing such propaganda is indeed fact

So let’s look at the facts

Jack Watts rated very high in many of the draft tests and was a clear favorite to be picked at number one and just a few reasons why

Jack Watts won the Larke Medal which is given to the best player in the AFL U18 National Championship competition

This isn’t an automatic given to be the best player known to man but it sure gives recruiters a rule of thumb idea that this guy being touted as a KPP forward has a high percentage chance of being a very good player

A 2.8 second 20 metre sprint was the fastest of any no indigenous player at the camp

At 196 cm that’s really impressive

It was clear watching him play against his peers that Watts was a good pack mark

He also was a really good kick and with above average accuracy kicking for goal

He even proved he can withstand some pressure kicking a goal to win a game after the siren

Add to that he has quick and clean hands even below his knees is obviously developed from his basketball background is a real bonus

in modern day football

He has a good football brain which can been seen watching him play

He has a really good wortk ethic which can also been seen by his second and third efforts during general play

Ok so what does this all mean to an AFL Recruiter

It simply means Watts has the capacity and skills to be very high on the best player list when playing with and against kids of similar age

The difference is that these kids are the best players in the country with some becoming senior players someday

Most commentators agreed that Watts ticked all the boxes which made him a standout just like Bryce Gibbs did when Carlton drafted him

Let’s now see what the fuss is about and more importantly why is there so much forum traffic over this kid Jack Watts

When you play football there is one thing certain of happening

Physical contact

When you are a skinny kid who is gets thrust into the seniors at AFL level you are going to be entering into BRAND NEW PHYSICAL TERRITORY

In Jack Watts’s case such a frail frame is a no win situation in a sink of swim scenario

You don’t take risks with a valuable commodity in business and it’s the same thing with players IMO

I think we played him when we shouldn’t have and the club may have been over the top with all the hype

I have stated once before that Jack Watts reminds me of another skinny kid who had similar attributes when recruited by Richmond in 1966

That player was Royce Hart and at the time was playing state football for Tasmania as a rover

Royce like most other KPP wasn’t actually very tall by today’s standards

Polly Farmer was 6 foot 3 inches with John Nicholls an inch shorter while Carl Diterich was an inch taller than Polly

All 3 played as Ruckman

Hart when recruited by the Tigers was immediately put on a weight and strength building program

Harts first season was played in the thirds (U19, s) with the last few games being promoted to the reserves

Be aware that Richmond was at the dawn of building a powerful football team and had depth by having its reserves team win the 1966 grand final

The significance was that the game was the curtain raiser to the famous 1 point StKilda victory over the Magpies

Hart was outstanding that day and kicked the winning goal to seal the match and what better way to do that than in front of a huge crowd and some Richmond faithful

The start of the 1967 season Hart made his debut and he was ready

Hart was a major influence in the Tigers Flag in the 1967 season

Why would I tell you all this though?

To me the importance of developing the body to play at senior level cannot be underestimated when you consider the way the game was played back then

Kicking to a contest was the norm and Hart had no peer in his ability to take a pack mark even when seemingly not in the contest

The physical punishment the body absorbs in the centre half forward position is going to be extremely high irrespective of the era

Year after year something has got to give and as in Harts case it did

Still able to play the game the body had taken its toll although the talent was still there it was sheer courage that kept him on the field

I would presume the chance of premiership success would have something to do with playing on until you dropped as Richmond were still a contender

Enough of Hart for now

Let’s look at 2 more centre half forwards who were certainly in the class of Hart

Carey and Brereton

Both had great careers playing the hardest possible position on the ground

Both started their careers around the same age as Hart but their was HUGE difference

Carey and Brereton played the game using their already physically advanced bodies to their advantage MUCH earlier than Hart could have

Hart on the other was never one for throwing his weight around as he was more a finesse player rather than imposing himself physically

As they reached their physical peak both Brereton and Carey welcomed the physical style of play and they became superb at it

Watts irrespective on what he does will be the same style as Hart

Nobody can predict with any accuracy how the career of Watts will pan out but there is no doubt in my mind he has the same physical limitations as when Hart started

It is also a fact that Hart, Brereton and Carey played the last few years with injuries that impeded their ability to play at their very best

I saw the 3 of them and they were all champions

It is interesting to note that all 3 started just as their teams became powerful and began winning premierships

Is that an omen with Watts?

Who really knows?

The bottom line is that being one of those Melbourne supporters that is of the lets be patient when considering Watts is concerned it sure is a fascinating subject to see it all unfold

I have no doubt Watts will be a good enough player to play many years of senior football

It is how good that all the fuss is about

I have used Hart as an example of a similarity to Watts in a physical sense

If Watts is half as good as Hart we will sure have a good player

With the whole Watts packadge their is nothing stopping him from being better than Hart except Watts himself

He is a Demon and needs our support not our wrath

[Hannabal 4]

So you are agreeing with me

Fair enough. I thought you were coming from a different angle.

I'm actually sick of hearing the name "Jack Watts".

[Jack7 528]

Bailey said on the weekend that Jack will be selected when his VFL form warrants it,nothing to do with his body.The fact is that he has very average form at VFL level and is being well beaten by kids his own age!

I don't want him in the Demons team when his form doesn't warrant him being there (the same goes for every other VFL footballer)and he'd have no influence whatsoever at AFL level the way he's been playing.

His "developing body" is just a smokescreen by connolly to cover his poor form at VFL level,some of you realise this.

If Jack played outstanding football in every VFL game so far this year,would he be playing AFL?

Of course he would.

He won't be playing Key Forward when he comes in,he'll develop into that role in the next few years,he'll be playing on a flank with his "not fully developed body" which means it's form based and he's not ready for AFL.

[Steamin Demon 392]

Fair enough. I thought you were coming from a different angle.

I'm actually sick of hearing the name "Jack Watts".

I only want to see/hear it is in the IN'S for this week !!

[Rocknroll 1,005]

I Never post on these Jack Watts threads.

My opionion is that alot of demons fans are nervous about Jack because they are coping it from their mates, co workers and even the media. My advice to is Suck it up.

The footy trolls have 2 years to give you shite about Watts. Then no one in the footy world will rememeber those games in casey when he was getting his body right, or soft bones, or bad attitude

Hold fast dee fans, there is loads to like about this club and where it is going.

[BennytheJet 15]

Beautifully said!

Please........someone be dumb enough to challenge this.......I need a good laugh!

Hey morons - you can all pontificate as much as you want about watts being skinny, key position etc etc but the very simple fact is if he wanted it bad enough, he'd be playing right now. Gumbleton - was injured. Lynch - try getting a game for st. kilda when your a mid sized forward, Henderson - bradshaw and brown at brissy = not a chance of getting a game (and he ended up playing in the BACKLINE to squeeze him into the side). Mckernon??? What type of example is this?

With his speed and agility, if he really wanted to he'd be in the side one way or another - particularly given our hell bent approach at getting as much games into the kids as possible.

Its not a big deal, but he doesnt deserve a spot at the moment because of his attitude. Accept it, move on, and wait until he does deserve a spot. But dont delude yourselves, the reason he's not playing isnt because of his age, size, position he plays etc

[Tricky 341]

Hey morons - you can all pontificate as much as you want about watts being skinny, key position etc etc but the very simple fact is if he wanted it bad enough, he'd be playing right now. Gumbleton - was injured. Lynch - try getting a game for st. kilda when your a mid sized forward, Henderson - bradshaw and brown at brissy = not a chance of getting a game (and he ended up playing in the BACKLINE to squeeze him into the side). Mckernon??? What type of example is this?

With his speed and agility, if he really wanted to he'd be in the side one way or another - particularly given our hell bent approach at getting as much games into the kids as possible.

Its not a big deal, but he doesnt deserve a spot at the moment because of his attitude. Accept it, move on, and wait until he does deserve a spot. But dont delude yourselves, the reason he's not playing isnt because of his age, size, position he plays etc

OK i'll bite - what are you basing your intimate knowledge of his attitude on out of interest?

[Guest Thomo]

I think he will be ready in time, Rewoldt took time to develop. Having said that, we saw him a fortnight ago for Casey, he moves well has a great turn of speed but not yet having a huge impact. In that game there were others that deserved a spot before Jack

I don't understand how the group think of this website started, but the constant justification of Jack Watts slow development is that Reiwoldt took a long time to develop.

Reiwoldt was the best player at St Kilda in his second year at the club. He was 193cm and 81kg when drafted. He did not take a long time to develop, he was a star within 18 months of the draft.

Lance Franklin was 196cm and 87 Kgs when drafted, he received a Brownlow vote in his second game, and was a solid contributor all season, playing 20 games.

Justin Koschitzke was 196cm and 82kg when drafted, and went on to win the rising star in his first year.

Jonathon Brown, 195cm, second year CHF in a Premiership.

Has there been any elite key position players of the last 20 years that could not get a game in the senior side at 19? I don't know, but the constant line about Key position players taking years to develop seems to be a bit of a myth. They will not reach their peak until into their 20's, but from what I can tell most are contributing in the first couple of years.

For posters to be justifying Jacks slow start by using Gumbleton is truly worrying. He is exactly what we don't want. Has been injured for three years, and now making slow progress a third of the way through his career, he has shown nothing at this stage to suggest that we will be anything more than an average player, not in the league that I hope Jack will be.

[stranga 328]

Bailey said on the weekend that Jack will be selected when his VFL form warrants it,nothing to do with his body.The fact is that he has very average form at VFL level and is being well beaten by kids his own age!

I don't want him in the Demons team when his form doesn't warrant him being there (the same goes for every other VFL footballer)and he'd have no influence whatsoever at AFL level the way he's been playing.

His "developing body" is just a smokescreen by connolly to cover his poor form at VFL level,some of you realise this.

If Jack played outstanding football in every VFL game so far this year,would he be playing AFL?

Of course he would.

He won't be playing Key Forward when he comes in,he'll develop into that role in the next few years,he'll be playing on a flank with his "not fully developed body" which means it's form based and he's not ready for AFL.

I tend to agree with all you have said here. Physically ready or not, the fact is his form is bad. If he was dominating at VFL level he would be playing this week dont worry about that.

[45HG 1,559]

You lied to me, Rogue!

[Hannabal 4]

Has there been any elite key position players of the last 20 years that could not get a game in the senior side at 19? I don't know, but the constant line about Key position players taking years to develop seems to be a bit of a myth. They will not reach their peak until into their 20's, but from what I can tell most are contributing in the first couple of years.

I agree with you and have often argued this line, which is why I want to see some tangible steps forward from Watts in his second year as a 19 year old.

History's greatest young key forwards have usually shown really good signs by their second year. Watts may become a good key forward, but he was picked at no.1 to become a 'great'.

Let's hope that in the second half of the year we see some of those signs.

[Demons 32 235]

Casey coach Brad Gotch always reviews the players, and while they are always somewhat positive, this one hardly gives any notion that Watts was as terrible as some who claim to have watched the game are acting.

I don't know about everyone else on here, but I trust the VFL level senior coach over some random people on the internet....

Jack Watts -

Jack did some outstanding things, as we know he can do, and it’s just that repeated effort stuff that we want from him and need to keep working on. He kicked a goal himself and assisted in a few other goals. He moved around, and worked hard up the ground. He uncharacteristically missed a couple of goals in the second quarter, but in the last quarter we needed him to kick one, and he did. He’s got some class, and it was another step in the right direction this week.

[Jaded No More 68,974]

I agree with you and have often argued this line, which is why I want to see some tangible steps forward from Watts in his second year as a 19 year old.

History's greatest young key forwards have usually shown really good signs by their second year. Watts may become a good key forward, but he was picked at no.1 to become a 'great'.

I don't count last year though, because he barely trained and barely played.

So in essence, this is his first season.

If this is still an issue in 2011 then we can start showing signs of concern. But in his first real AFL season he has done enough IMO.

[stranga 328]

Casey coach Brad Gotch always reviews the players, and while they are always somewhat positive, this one hardly gives any notion that Watts was as terrible as some who claim to have watched the game are acting.

I don't know about everyone else on here, but I trust the VFL level senior coach over some random people on the internet....

Jack Watts -

Jack did some outstanding things, as we know he can do, and it’s just that repeated effort stuff that we want from him and need to keep working on. He kicked a goal himself and assisted in a few other goals. He moved around, and worked hard up the ground. He uncharacteristically missed a couple of goals in the second quarter, but in the last quarter we needed him to kick one, and he did. He’s got some class, and it was another step in the right direction this week.

Youre right, there was a report over on the Casey board that pretty much said every player had no impact on the game which concerned me, but Gotchs review is more balanced. I think im going to start to wait for Brad Gotchs reviews in the future rather than rely on one line analysis from fans in the outer.

If watts kicked straight he could have had 3 goals.

[Choko 493]

Casey coach Brad Gotch always reviews the players, and while they are always somewhat positive, this one hardly gives any notion that Watts was as terrible as some who claim to have watched the game are acting.

I don't know about everyone else on here, but I trust the VFL level senior coach over some random people on the internet....

Jack Watts -

Jack did some outstanding things, as we know he can do, and it’s just that repeated effort stuff that we want from him and need to keep working on. He kicked a goal himself and assisted in a few other goals. He moved around, and worked hard up the ground. He uncharacteristically missed a couple of goals in the second quarter, but in the last quarter we needed him to kick one, and he did. He’s got some class, and it was another step in the right direction this week.

Well assuming Gotchy knows his stuff, it is indeed a bit concerning that effort is the main thing to keep working on. I never understand a lack of effort. I know every club has some blokes for whom effort is not even a factor (James McDonald, Cam Bruce are great eg.s for us), and every side has blockes who have suspect work ethics. I just don't understand it. If Watts is in the category of those who have suspect work ethic, then it is a concern he was picked up at 1. On the positive side, it is something that can be fixed and there are many examples of it.

[Arthur Dent 2]

Casey coach Brad Gotch always reviews the players, and while they are always somewhat positive, this one hardly gives any notion that Watts was as terrible as some who claim to have watched the game are acting.

I don't know about everyone else on here, but I trust the VFL level senior coach over some random people on the internet....

Jack Watts -

Jack did some outstanding things, as we know he can do, and it’s just that repeated effort stuff that we want from him and need to keep working on. He kicked a goal himself and assisted in a few other goals. He moved around, and worked hard up the ground. He uncharacteristically missed a couple of goals in the second quarter, but in the last quarter we needed him to kick one, and he did. He’s got some class, and it was another step in the right direction this week.

Great call

[BennytheJet 15]

Great call

Great call? That was a terrible call.

Coaches are hardly going to be overly critical of players in a public release - particularly given the amount of attention and hype on watts and other younger players and the need to present a positive outlook to supporters etc. Could you imagine the backlash and media beat up if the review was scathing or negative??? On the contrary, the only fair and honest report we're going to get is from supporters who are at the games and who dont have any other agendas.

You can be sure that what is said externally is in no way indicative or representative of what is said internally.

[Dalrot 85]

Great call? That was a terrible call.

Coaches are hardly going to be overly critical of players in a public release - particularly given the amount of attention and hype on watts and other younger players and the need to present a positive outlook to supporters etc. Could you imagine the backlash and media beat up if the review was scathing or negative??? On the contrary, the only fair and honest report we're going to get is from supporters who are at the games and who dont have any other agendas.

You can be sure that what is said externally is in no way indicative or representative of what is said internally.

I agree.

The VFL player reports have been notoriously sugar coated for years.

[satyricon 267]

I agree.

The VFL player reports have been notoriously sugar coated for years.

They are not sugar coated, you will notice Cheney got off to a slow start again, Gotch mentions it, he is blunt about Juice Newton, adds a bit to Blease, Strauss is heading in the right direction.....constructive is the word, not destructive as some of the player assessments posted on here are........

[Guest Thomo]

Casey coach Brad Gotch always reviews the players, and while they are always somewhat positive, this one hardly gives any notion that Watts was as terrible as some who claim to have watched the game are acting.

I don't know about everyone else on here, but I trust the VFL level senior coach over some random people on the internet....

Jack Watts -

Jack did some outstanding things, as we know he can do, and it’s just that repeated effort stuff that we want from him and need to keep working on. He kicked a goal himself and assisted in a few other goals. He moved around, and worked hard up the ground. He uncharacteristically missed a couple of goals in the second quarter, but in the last quarter we needed him to kick one, and he did. He’s got some class, and it was another step in the right direction this week.

Brad Gotch has not given a Melbourne listed player anything but a glowing report this year. He likes to talk up his players, nothing wrong with the coach doing that in the media, but I don't see him giving honest appraisals of the players. I trust independent reviews, like the one from the Gold Coast that described him as mostly silent.