disgraceful trade period

[Guest IKTPQMCR]

This is the ONLY news to come out of trade week... that and the fact that the club DOES respect Green enough to offer him 3 years, and NOT to trade him for something worthless...

But actually Jarka, I'm not sure it's story of the year, our reputation being crappy. In two years time we'll be the flavour of the month (along with GC17) like Hawthorn and Carlton are now. At that time it'll probably be the Roos, or Pies or someone else who'll take their turn at the bottom with a disgraceful reputation, and players will be lining up to play with Watts, Brock et al...

Its just a matter of time, and best of all, it's temporary. For a time there Carlton was the place no-one wanted to be (Thornton anyone?)... Look at them now.

yea well put

[Jarka 767]

This is the ONLY news to come out of trade week... that and the fact that the club DOES respect Green enough to offer him 3 years, and NOT to trade him for something worthless...

But actually Jarka, I'm not sure it's story of the year, our reputation being crappy. In two years time we'll be the flavour of the month (along with GC17) like Hawthorn and Carlton are now. At that time it'll probably be the Roos, or Pies or someone else who'll take their turn at the bottom with a disgraceful reputation, and players will be lining up to play with Watts, Brock et al...

Its just a matter of time, and best of all, it's temporary. For a time there Carlton was the place no-one wanted to be (Thornton anyone?)... Look at them now.

I hope you're right but for every club like Hawthorn there is many clubs who spent years on the bottom and not make the climb to the top of the ladder. St.Kilda, Bulldogs and Fremantle come to mind. (Carlton have yet to prove themselves despite 'farming' draft picks for half a decade)

It's not a free ride.

[Eastie Boyz 0]

And other clubs who don't have to take a complete nosedive before pushing for a premiership eg Sydney and Geelong

[Jaded No More 68,948]

There was nobody up for trade who would have brought us a premiership.

We would have traded Green, but the deal didn't go through because of Hawthorn.

To summarise, trade week is crap, and you don't win a flag in the first week of October.

[45HG 1,539]

Far out, can we bring in a yellow/red card system.

BB, you wanted to trade for over 15 players, most of them hacks, then claim not picking up any hacks was "disgraceful"

Shite, we didn't pick up Rhys Shaw or Anthony Corrie! Or a 23 year old with a knee reconstruction who won't play til 2010, or a ruckman who you've probably never seen play.

[bjgc 0]

disgraceful for the MFC

for a club who sad they are trying to base themselves on hawthorn- picks 1,17,19 and 35 won't do as much as what it could've for the club had we

A) realised brad greens trade value and actually traded him rather than wanting him to sign for 2 years of consistent footy that would achieve no premiership success- an let him go to a club that would have a chance

B ) realised that hawthorn were ruthless in this situation, and we shouldve traded wheatley, cj, jamar, bell- who all attracted interested from more than 1 club respectively.

a poor week from the club

and it obviously means no more delistings

which means robots like bartram and carroll are still on the list

Are you related to Magic in some way?

[Goodvibes 3,596]

disgraceful for the MFC

for a club who sad they are trying to base themselves on hawthorn- picks 1,17,19 and 35 won't do as much as what it could've for the club had we

A) realised brad greens trade value and actually traded him rather than wanting him to sign for 2 years of consistent footy that would achieve no premiership success- an let him go to a club that would have a chance

B ) realised that hawthorn were ruthless in this situation, and we shouldve traded wheatley, cj, jamar, bell- who all attracted interested from more than 1 club respectively.

a poor week from the club

and it obviously means no more delistings

which means robots like bartram and carroll are still on the list

You're behaving like a spoilt kid on Christmas morning who has spent the week dreaming about his spoils and then whinges about his lack of shiny new presents. I love trade week in that the proposed trades challenge us to consider the state of our list and how our list could improve. I hate trade week because people like you think life is like a computer game where you can offer nothing and receive the world in exchange. The reality of course is that every trade week is different. The strength of the potential draftees and the Gold Coast angle certainly impacted on the level of activity over the past 5 days. Our football department undoubtedly tested the water with our fringe players and received very few offers of substance. I'm certain they did what we all did and tried to nut out ways we could improve our list. Warnock and McIntosh were the only names that intersted me of the players that were definitely on the market. One was removed from the market by Wednesday and would have cost and arm and a leg (picks wise) and the other didn't want to come to us and would've had cost an arm and a leg (salary wise). What would you have the club do? The only other players to interest me were Thorp and Dowler because of the O'Keefe/Hawthorn angle. I thought we might have a small chance of playing a role as a third party but unfortunately opposition teams (even Freo these days) seem reluctant to give away much for very little. Again, what would you have the club do? Throw away pick 1 and Jack Watts? Those who seriously think Jamar should have been thrown away for very little must have seen a side of John Meesen that I haven't or have short memories in regards to the injury history of Paul Johnson.

BB time to find your dummy and tidy up your toys.

[Demon16 69]

And other clubs who don't have to take a complete nosedive before pushing for a premiership eg Sydney and Geelong

sydney buy players and geelong have had an unbelievable father/son crop of late.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

I hope you're right but for every club like Hawthorn there is many clubs who spent years on the bottom and not make the climb to the top of the ladder. St.Kilda, Bulldogs and Fremantle come to mind. (Carlton have yet to prove themselves despite 'farming' draft picks for half a decade)

It's not a free ride.

Jarka the socialist AFL gives any side an opportunity to rebuild through the draft and put themselves in position to win a flag. These days flags come from teams who finish in the top four with a double chance. How many teams can you name who haven't finished top four this millenium? The system works. Our chance will come again.

[Demon16 69]

Jarka the socialist AFL gives any side an opportunity to rebuild through the draft and put themselves in position to win a flag. These days flags come from teams who finish in the top four with a double chance. How many teams can you name who haven't finished top four this millenium? The system works. Our chance will come again.

to add to that, in the last 20 years the 3 sides to play finals the most are west coast, essendon and melbourne. no we haven't won a flag but people's memories are short. what would richmond fans give just to play finals again.

[Dee tention 616]

essendon gave pick 39 for prismall to geelong

surely we would/should have offered pick 35 for him

how nice would have this been

1

17

19

Prismall (35)

51

67

83

99

115

PSD 1

Melbourne would have offered Pick 35! Prismall wanted to go to Essendon though and Geelong are only 4 picks worse off. Would have been different if the picks were 10-15 apart. Glad he did'nt come tu us. I could'nt fit him in the best 22 for a start! No joke! Not with our young kids and draftees we will have coming through! Go you Demon's! More incentive to get to the footy and stick up the competition. We will be a force! Just need them to get rid of there man boobs and gets some balls like the Brock.

[Eastie Boyz 0]

Prismall would be your #1 midfielder if he was on the list

[Demon16 69]

Prismall would be your #1 midfielder if he was on the list

that would make him the highest payed players at bomberland then.

[Eastie Boyz 0]

Doubt it.

Lloyd, Lucas and Fletcher would be ahead of him (though one or 2 could be on the veteran list) and McVeigh would probably be just ahead of him in our midfield

[Jarka 767]

Jarka the socialist AFL gives any side an opportunity to rebuild through the draft and put themselves in position to win a flag. These days flags come from teams who finish in the top four with a double chance. How many teams can you name who haven't finished top four this millenium? The system works. Our chance will come again.

No, I don't buy that for one second. It's not fait accompli that a club who receives alot of early draft picks automatically gets a shot at a premiership a couple of years down the track.

Our chance will only come if we do everything right, from drafting and developing the kids to getting our game plan right. Premiership are earnt through hard work, not having a couple of crap seasons.

[Red and Blue Flame 187]

like i have said in other threads, we are pathetic right now and a laughing stock

also having players like carroll and bell on 250K + is bloody insane

one bloke has 1 good year and picks up a contract like that?...

and the other never proven anything and still able to have a pay packet like that??wtf

although i must ask you why do you say bartram being a robot? i don't think he's that bad,

we have alot worse than him still there

name one player, apart from carroll or meesen, who is worse

[45HG 1,539]

Prismall would be your #1 midfielder if he was on the list

How's the crack pipe going for you?

[bjgc 0]

Prismall would be your #1 midfielder if he was on the list

From the same person who said Carroll was a star at the start of the year.

He isn't a quarter of the player Brock is.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

No, I don't buy that for one second. It's not fait accompli that a club who receives alot of early draft picks automatically gets a shot at a premiership a couple of years down the track.

Our chance will only come if we do everything right, from drafting and developing the kids to getting our game plan right. Premiership are earnt through hard work, not having a couple of crap seasons.

Well for a start I didn't suggest "a couple of years down the track" would be the time frame. A proper rebuild takes time. The nucleus of the Geelong premiers of 2007 came together 5 - 8 years ago. I agree that we need to do everything right to win a premiership but the past decade is littered with teams possessing serious deficiencies that have made the top 4. You could argue that that is the reason they haven't won premierships but I'd argued that if you're top 4 you're always a chance of having a great fortnight. Consider the Adelaide premierships. Collingwood in 1990? Essendon 1993? Perhaps in a few years time we might say the same about Hawthorn. They were a solid top 4 team, everything fell for them and they won a cup. St Kilda may not have won a premiership but put themselves in a position to have a genuine crack and they did so thanks to 3-4 years of high draft picks. Injuries have been cruel to them. Hawthorn followed the same model and Carlton seem next in line.

To be brutally honest, if this model can't win a premiership then we're in real strife. If football department funding and training facilities are the keys we'll not win a premiership in the short to medium term. As much as I rate these two elements, I still believe having 22 very good footballers is handy when wanting to win a premiership. So much so that I think Melbourne has the best opportunity to be the next cab off the rank (after St Kilda, Hawthorn and then Carlton) in the bottoming out/early draft picks approach to winning a flag.

I'll be very interested to see if this makes any sense in the morning. German beer is dangerous.

[mo64 5,875]

No, I don't buy that for one second. It's not fait accompli that a club who receives alot of early draft picks automatically gets a shot at a premiership a couple of years down the track.

Our chance will only come if we do everything right, from drafting and developing the kids to getting our game plan right. Premiership are earnt through hard work, not having a couple of crap seasons.

Spot on Jarka. Many on this forum actually believe that the only way for us to become a premiership contender is by bottoming out, and obtaining early draft picks.

People are suggesting that we are following the Hawthorn model. This is a fallacy. Hawthorn were able to obtain so many early picks through astute trading, and any short term lack of success was underpinned by a strong financial position.

This draft proved that clubs will not be so generous in giving up early picks in the future, and we aren't in a financial position were we can afford to remain uncompetitive.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

Has the topping up approach worked? Ellis, Bizzell, Vardy, Pickett? I'm not suggesting that we blindly follow the approach of just one team. As Bailey has suggested more than once, we need to be a step ahead of where the game is going. Hawthorn have certainly been astute with their trades, drafted well and had a fair slice of luck along the way. They had early picks at the right time and traded senior players at a time when draft picks weren't valued as highly as they have been over the past 5 days.

Sure, every part of our operations need to be over-hauled to ensure success, but when it comes to shaping a premiership 22, the reality is that the draft is our only avenue. We must draft and draft and draft until we have a team of winners and if that means 3 - 4 in the wilderness, so be it.

[mo64 5,875]

Has the topping up approach worked? Ellis, Bizzell, Vardy, Pickett? I'm not suggesting that we blindly follow the approach of just one team. As Bailey has suggested more than once, we need to be a step ahead of where the game is going. Hawthorn have certainly been astute with their trades, drafted well and had a fair slice of luck along the way. They had early picks at the right time and traded senior players at a time when draft picks weren't valued as highly as they have been over the past 5 days.

Sure, every part of our operations need to be over-hauled to ensure success, but when it comes to shaping a premiership 22, the reality is that the draft is our only avenue. We must draft and draft and draft until we have a team of winners and if that means 3 - 4 in the wilderness, so be it.

We can't afford 3-4 years in the wilderness.

Sydney have realised that their market is so fickle, that they have to remain competitive to be financially stable. They have done this by topping up, and snagged a premiership in the process.

Our situation is more like Sydney's than Hawthorn.

[Guest skipper3]

Who the bloody hell are you trying to kid by saying that our situation is more like Sydney's than Hawthorn's????

We have to be in the wilderness for the next couple of years - we are already there.

No topping up this time around - pick the kids & play them! (AS DB & CC are doing)

We can't afford 3-4 years in the wilderness.

Sydney have realised that their market is so fickle, that they have to remain competitive to be financially stable. They have done this by topping up, and snagged a premiership in the process.

Our situation is more like Sydney's than Hawthorn.

[Goodvibes 3,596]

We can't afford 3-4 years in the wilderness.

Sydney have realised that their market is so fickle, that they have to remain competitive to be financially stable. They have done this by topping up, and snagged a premiership in the process.

Our situation is more like Sydney's than Hawthorn.

If we start trading like Sydney we'll definitely die. If you consider we've already had 2 years in the wilderness, I'm suggesting we need to buckle up for another tough year, enjoy the progress of our young players and again enjoy the benefits of early draft picks. My approach to the next 12 months is simple. If we win quite a few games of footy that means our young kids have taken massive strides and early draft picks won't be as essential. If we have a similar year to this year then we'll be looking at three more top 20 picks in the draft possibly including the top 2 and then definitely in a position to see a team with class and skill evolve. Can I also suggest that the Melbourne market is far less fickle than Sydney. Put simply, we're the proof. 30,000 plus record membership in a year with just 3 wins suggests that the supporters of this team have a bit more substance about them than popular, stereotyped opinion would have you believe. The debt demolition month has shown me that the club is indeed in a position now to tough it out for another year and then jump on board and enjoy the journey back up the ladder.

If we were to follow the Sydney model as you suggest, how would you have wheeled and dealed during this past week?

[Jarka 767]

Well for a start I didn't suggest "a couple of years down the track" would be the time frame. A proper rebuild takes time. The nucleus of the Geelong premiers of 2007 came together 5 - 8 years ago. I agree that we need to do everything right to win a premiership but the past decade is littered with teams possessing serious deficiencies that have made the top 4. You could argue that that is the reason they haven't won premierships but I'd argued that if you're top 4 you're always a chance of having a great fortnight. Consider the Adelaide premierships. Collingwood in 1990? Essendon 1993? Perhaps in a few years time we might say the same about Hawthorn. They were a solid top 4 team, everything fell for them and they won a cup. St Kilda may not have won a premiership but put themselves in a position to have a genuine crack and they did so thanks to 3-4 years of high draft picks. Injuries have been cruel to them. Hawthorn followed the same model and Carlton seem next in line.

To be brutally honest, if this model can't win a premiership then we're in real strife. If football department funding and training facilities are the keys we'll not win a premiership in the short to medium term. As much as I rate these two elements, I still believe having 22 very good footballers is handy when wanting to win a premiership. So much so that I think Melbourne has the best opportunity to be the next cab off the rank (after St Kilda, Hawthorn and then Carlton) in the bottoming out/early draft picks approach to winning a flag.

I'll be very interested to see if this makes any sense in the morning. German beer is dangerous.

Nah, good post. German beer is good but I prefer the Japanese stuff at the moment - clean and fresh!