binman

Cue 'well he would say that' or 'what else is he going to say' type comments......

Exactly. Add to that Weed and TMac are both excellent in the ruck at centre bounces and Jessie ok from throw ins. This allows Max (who is incredibly mobile and athletic for such a big fella) to play a kick behind the ball, 'rest' up forward, fill the hole down back or have a solid break on the bench to recharge his batteries (essentially giving us another mid/runner on the ground whilst he is on the bench). (Giving Maxy more time on the bench might be important next year because surely we will want to mange Max's time a bit more next season given the load he carries and his importance to the side.) On top of that the athleticism of our bigs and their ability to play in multiple positions makes us very unpredictable as they seem to be very fluid in terms of role and field postion at any given point in time. Hogan, Tmac and in the last few games Weed also go well up the ground to provide the marking target down the line All this fluidity creates huge match up issues for opposition coaches and headaches for opponents. How many players are strong enough to compete one on one with Hogan or Tmac but also good enough athletically to run up and down the ground with them too. Sure they can 'hand off' but this creates confusion. it also creates space in our forward line. There were two great examples in the first quarter against the cats of the problems this fluidity and movement from our bigs causes. The first was the Harmes goal. We go down the line (in what is obviously a set play/team rule) to Tmac who takes a big contested mark. He kicks quickly to Hannan in the corridor (the 45 degree kick the commentators are talking about now). The forward line is completely open (in large part because Tmac has dragged his man up the ground) and Hannan hits Spargo who hits Harmes running into open space. The second example was the final goal by Weed. Weed delivered the ball lace out from half forward to Melk - so about 70 metres from goal. He then runs a big arc and ends up unmarked behind the defenders (including Blicvacs) and takes an almost uncontested mark 5 metres out. They completely lost track of him and were defensively all over the place. This versatility is huge weapon for us and a massive point of difference to the Tigers - or any other club for that matter. It means we have the tigers ferocity, territory and chaos style but can control possession more. It also means there is no issue at all playing Hogan, Tmac and Weed in the same forward line. Not least because there would be very few occasions when all three were actually in the forward line together but also because of the incredible endurance and athleticism of Hogan and TMac. I can't wait.

Good points. But even in footy right now having a mobile tall who can mark the liong ball down the line is critical. We are the number 1 long kicking side. Richmond second. Territory is now king. Our advantage over tigers is we have more players who can take a big pack mark from a long kick from defence. Just as tmac, maxy, hogan and weed do so well. The critical thing is that the bigs are great runners and can cover ground. Like hogan and tmac. And unlike say hawkins, who is a one position player. The dees are ahead of the curve.

What is this talk about him 'thinking of going'. The only talk from Hogan has been the complete opposite as per my comment above. You mention rumors that 'News was he was off to docket land last year but didn’t happen'. Why didn't it happen? because he extended his contract with dees. Pretty good indication he wants to stay with us i would have thought. He aint going to Freo. Why would he? Why would anyone? Why does their best player want to leave? This whole thread is based on premise of he is 'thinking of going'. For the sake of argument lets accept he does not want to. If you accept that then the thread collapses because he is contracted. And would have to agree to a trade. Sure the club could 'encourage' the player to agree to a trade - Watts comes to mind - for example by saying if you don't agree to a trade you'll be playing twos but does anyone seriously think the club would say would give that sort of ultimatum to Hogan? No i didn't think so. Fugazzi. And i'm out.

Of course. Prudent. And i'm sure the club will start discussions once this season is done and dusted. Those discussions are likely to go on for some months. And of course the club will be hoping to have them finalised by say mid next season to avoid the palaver that comes with a player 'waiting until the end of the season.' I'm sure Jessie will want that too. It is worth remembering Jessie extended his last contract for that very reason. Because he loves the club and wanted to avoid fugazzi (and he is private fella and no doubt he wanted to avoid drama). What we know is he has expressed only recently, though his manager, that he loves the club and has no thoughts on going. We know Goody has come out and said the club loves Jessie and has no thoughts about trading him.So any pressure to sign now or be traded is pure Fugazzi. Jessie is a once in generation player. Here is little trade secret i have picked up. You keep them.

I am going to try and stay out of this thread because reading some of the frankly ridiculous comments (we must act! he has to prove he want to stay! he needs to sign! yes he is gun, but we could trade in another gun! we don't need him! i'm not saying we SHOULD trade him, but if he wants to go home! etc etc) does my head in. The thread keeps popping up in the recent posts function and like a fool i can't help but to look. But its not all silly posts. This being a good example of a rational, logical one. Leaving aside the fact Jessie is incredibly unlikely to want to leave a club on the brink of a sustained period of finals success for one who is on the complete opposite trajectory (and he would have agree to a trade of course) the club has been shouting from the roof tops about building a team first, 22 brothers running out together , fully connected, group love culture. For pete's sake it recently became public that our motto this year is one borrowed form the great Norm Smith - Esprit de corps. Why on god's good earth would the the club risk that culture by putting any pressure on Jessie or considering trading him. I mean please. He is a loved team member who the club has nurtured and looked after during incredible personal issues. One of the brothers. Been at the club since he was 17 years old. The MFC is his his extended .Goody won't have it. And thank go for that. What about trading Weed instead (jokes)?

Good lord.

Best thw autumn sun. Rosehill race 4 no 1. A class above. Like the dees

Maybe. But highlights the stupdidity of the idea of trading hogan. Trading hogan now would be equally stupid

And further to that im pretty sure roosy said it the context of a scenario like steve may who is rumoured to be considering a move or fielding offers.

As i said nothing wrong wirh having a discussion a year out. There is something wrong with demanding a player prove his loyalty by extending and deciding if he doesn't yoy MUST trade him. Particularly a player who has shown loyalty already and rejected huge offers to stay with us

Did you miss rhe fact he is not a free agent unti 2021? And lets pretend he did become a free agent to be clear you would support shopping hogan if he did not prove his loyalty by commiting to an exstension?

One i never threw any insults around. I don't play the man. Two, you said: Don't get me wrong, if Hogan wants to stay, we keep him, but he has to prove this with a contract extension. Sounds lot like threat to me. At the least you are saying we should ask him to prove his loyalty and commit to an extension. Prove being the key word. As i said he does not have to PROVE anything. And to suggest he does is patent nonsense. Which is not an insult. it is an opinion.

I have no issue with us asking if he wants to sign a new contract. But you said he has to prove his loyalty by agreeing to a contract extension. The implication being we demand he sign or we will ship him. Which is total bulltish. And as i understand it (might be wrong) he will be a restricted free agent so we can match any offer. And if we do lose him to free agency we will be well compensated given the price on his head and age in the same way we were when we lost Frawley - who we got a number 3 draft pick for (which allowed us to pick up Oliver IIIRC). So we are under no pressure whatsoever to sign him again now and putting a bloke who has already committed to our club under pressure to sign is totally disrespectful and no way to build a cohesive, team first culture. Not much esprit de corps in that. You must of gone to the Mark Neeld school of culture building.

Honestly this is the biggest load of rubbish i have ever heard. Why does he has to prove anything? In good faith he has signed a contract till the end of 2019. Unbelievable what some people think players owe the club and their fans. Fair dinkum i have never read so much baloney on this site. And that is seriously saying something.

Was funny day with a mixture of long odds winners and a few shorties. Ended up having a good day after an average start and some big hits on Vega Magic and Voodoo Lad who i thought would smash them. No idea what happened to Jameh - who i also took a big hit on! I backed Redzel who was brilliant. Drifted too so happy with the odds. First time i've backed it. I um and ahhed on who to back against Le Romain, swinging back and forth between Coming Through and Dixie Blossoms. Landed on Coming through, had a saver on Dixie and took them in the quin, which i thought i had snagged. Got Unforgotten and then pure elation and only just realised that was four Sydney winners in a row. Should have all upped! I backed Lite in Veins and thought it might win mid race. Win only unfortunately, though the Sportsbet (and Bet Easy) deal of 50 back for 2nd or 3rd is a great offer. Got three of those back for the day. Snagged a couple of winners at Caulfield so a profit on the day - though not as huge as all the winners might suggest. We bet in every Sydney and Melbourne race so plenty of losers too.

I have backed agaonst le romain today. Yet to win at 1400 after 6 goes is a worry for a 2.90 fav.

My best on what might be a good day for favorites is Jaahmeh. Race 1 no 3 Caulfield. In a small field with only one orher realustic chance, red alto, 2.20 is terrific value. Surprised it is not in the red. Though surely will tighten. Could have gone cega magi or redzel but like races with 8 or less runners. Less chance of trouble in running.

Of course he will be. Just as he was when we had all defenders fit for thw first 8 rounds of the season. Sure frosty has been good last couple but not a patch on omac. The coach obviously agrees given last year and this year omac was selected ahead of him. But happy to make an avatar bet. None of his critics took my bet that he would play every game up to round 11. Im happy to bet he wont be dropped next season. He wont be dropped until rhe end of his career.

A terrific season. Still a kid and huge upside. A beautiful (and much underrated) kick as evidenced by the sublime kick to lewis that set up our first goal and the later one to maxy. He is very calm and makes excellent decisions with his disposals. The coach and team mates have complete trust in him. Rarely beaten one on one and has some big scalps this year. He is already strong but but will get much stronger, fill out and possibly still get a touch taller over the next three years. He is already one of the fittest players at the club and will only get fitter. Very durable which speaks to a fella who does everything right to prepare and recover. His key weakness is his pace and really is unlikely to get much quicker. So that will remain an issue but not a deal breaker, particularly with a fit and firing Lever playing alongside him. Like most big fellas won't hit his peak until he is 25, by which time he will have close to 100 games (and a handful of finals) under his belt. As i noted at the beginning of the season will be a 200 plus game player for the dees and a mainstay of our defence for the next decade.

Well yes. But in this instance Jessie's manager and his coach has come out and categorically stated he is staying at the dees. Which never happens when move is on the cards. So it is safe to assume he ain't going nowhere. Super offer or no super offer.

Of course clubs pay overs. Get desperate if that is the word you want to use. But in each of the above scenarios the player chose to leave so they could get more coin. It appears you are making the assumption that if a club makes a huge offer the player will naturally choose to accept it. But there are plenty of examples of plaers knocking back bigger offers. Kelly resigning with GWS is just one example . I'm sure Jessie himself knocked back a much bigger pay check from freo before resigning with the dees as did TMac no doubt. Riddle me this. Why would players knock back much bigger offers? Two reasons come to mind - loyalty and chance of winning a flag. Every example you listed above the clubs involved were an even money chance of winning a flag or better, but certainly no worse. Why on earth would Jessie leave a club that is a very good chance of winning a flag in the next 5 years and go to one that has zero chance of winning a flag in that same period. Players want success. They want to win flags. And even if they are motivated by money success brings coin. Being in losing team in the west for the next 10 years might earn Jessie a good salary in that time but that's it. Winning flags for a Melbourne club will provide opportunities to earn income for the rest of his life.

I think so. Weed was average in that period.

I can absolutely see the dees playing Weed, T Mac and Hogan together in the forward line and fully expect, if all 3 are fit, to see them line up in the forward line round 1 next year. I think they have shown their hand this year. I understand why some might query the wisdom of 3 bigs up forward, particularly with small forward lines being all the rage atm, as i don't think there are many examples of it working but TMac and Hogan are such aerobic beasts that they can get around the ground, offering down the line options, and Weed can play as the classic full forward leading from the square. With Weed and Tmac also providing great chop out duties for Max there would be big chunks of the game where only two of them would actually be in the forward line at the same time. Hogan for me is the CHF, Weed full forward and Tmac the third tall. Huge nightmare for defensive units and opposition coaches as not only do you need height and strength you need players with motors to match Tmac and Hogan. Throw in a team that gets huge inside 50 numbers and hopefully improved delivery of the ball into the forward line and you have a huge offensive weapon. Bring. It. On.

Hello DrD. I can only assume you have not seen this or the other posts directing you to it. Other wise your avatar would be changed already. So once again here is the your new avatar - i look forward to seeing it next to your name: So paging Dr D here is your new avatar (note; please ensure if needing to crop the picture below you get Mark's whole face):