binman

Not a great comparion i don't think in terms of the point DV8 is making. You'd take Rance in a heartbeat but JW isn't really the classic key forward. Don't get me wrong a terrific player but he is relatively small and so less remarkable from that perspective. A better comparison might be Rance v Kennedy. That would be more of a conundrum. But to be honest i'd still go with Rance. He is one of the best defenders i've ever seen, no doubt. And his ability is proven over many seasons Rance v Buddy? That gets more tricky and i'd take Buddy. What about Lever v Patton? Or for that matter Lever v Hogan? For what its worth i'd take Patton and Hogan, no question.

A professional courtesy to agree to a trade that you are not keen on? You're kidding aren't you. He doesn't owe us anything. He is professional footballer. Would you leave your job and go to another workplace, one you didn't like and for no more pay as 'professional courtesy'? Players rarely say no trades? Give some examples where a contracted player who is not keen to leave the club agrees to a trade? It is an entirely different scenario for out of contract players. They are much more likely to go to clubs they are not keen on going to To be honest i can't recall if Trengrove was still under contract when we were going to trade him to Richmond. If he was then it is a good example actually. But not of the point you are making. Contracted players leave for more opportunity and clubs trade such players to get a good outcome for them. If contracted he could have said no to a trade but in his case there were good reason to go. The tigers are a strong side who were playing finals and we were the opposite. He was struggling to get senior time at the dees, the writing was on the wall in terms of how the club saw his future (and no doubt this was made clear to) and they needed inside mids and wanted him. We were going to get pick 10 for that deal (and use it for Lever). A win win win. Watts on the other hand is very unlikely to play much VFL footy at the dees. The only reason he would is because of insufficient application. If he was traded and showed insufficient application at his new club he would also be playing in the magoos. So where's the advantage for him in moving clubs if it is not for more opportunity at senior level?

No worries. He might want to leave that is true. But there is no evidence is he is unhappy at the club. And i maintain that he will have zero interest in going to a club in the bottom half of the ladder. Why would he? He's had more than his fair share of being in crap teams

Who is assuming that?

No. No. No A million times no. Why on earth would watts agree to a trade to the blues? The crows maybe (and he would slot in beaitifully in that side). But not the blued. AND WATTS NEEDS TO AGREE TO ANY TRADE AS HE IS A CONTRACTED PLAYER!!!!

A bit like the lions king's circle of life

Oh i thought it referred to the year judd won the norm smith medal....

I want the dees to rookie. And when he plays his first game start him on rhe bench to build anticipation. And when goody sends down tbe order to put him on i want to hear macca break into song and sing with gusto: 'I'm putting on the Fritsch!!!'

Wasn't meaning to be rude JDM. Apologies if it that is how i came across. Insert deity was not a shot at you. I meant that watts is unlikely to leave a team that (please god) should make finals. As in please god let us make finals. It is up to jack. He has a contract. And quite a big one at that. If the club don't want him they could threaten him he will play VFL all season but really that would be a hollow threat or at the least one that Watts could call them on. Lets say he did call them on it. Do the club dig in and play a player with his class, not to mention the skill we so badly lack -elite kicking skills - in the magoos. And pay him 700k? i don't think so. Though you could argue the Pies have with mayne. but where has that got them?

Rubbish. If JW wanted to leave the dees he would have considerable trade value.

Can you please explain to me why Watts would want to leave a team that (please - insert deity) should make finals for one that is miles off. A penchant for playing for teams near the bottom of the ladder? A love of navy blue?

I want rhe dees to rookie him. And if he gets injured i want to hear mison crack a joke and say 'he's on the fritsch'

Personally i liked my defenders to spoil the ball at least 36.2 metres. Kill that ball. Let it come back from the grave. Then kill it again. Now that's insane.

If we askee nicely would they put him on ice?

Ugh

It is indisptuable our pressure dropped of significantly in the last 6-8 games. Injuries and general tiredness took their toll. As i have been at pains to say that pressure drop exposes zone defences. But given our scoring was also based partly on that same zone defence through run off hb and super quick ball movement and transition our scoring also suffered. If we had - as seems to be the case - simply ran out of gas goody had to respond somehow. And dropping tmac back to play man on man and essentialy replacing frosty's aggressive run might have been that response.

see below

Interesting comments from bmjnr. I have no doubt we had many players playing injured. Gawn is an obvious one. Watts wasn't right. Viney obviouly. Hogan of course. Even jones. All struggled to come up from serious injuries. And it would make sense also that injuries played a role in the mid field pressure dropping off, which was the key reason our season fell away. I have always maintained injuries are the biggest determinant of a teams success. And the culture in footy is still strong not to blame injuries. Gives another soldier a chance and all that palaver. Its not just the games lost it is players struggling to get back to their optimal level. Often they simply don't until the following season. A key factor in the tigers this year has been their run with injury. And obviously a big factor in gws struggles is their shocking run. Amazing they are top 4. The zone comment is interesting. Im pretty sure they were full zone against port. My sense is that tmac was largely man on man when he went back which disrupted the set up. I wasn't against dropping frost at the time but they also dropped salem. And then tmac went back. And he was actually pretty poor down back. Particularly against the pies but also the lions. Robbed us of a really good forward and hurt our backline. In hindsight goody made a big error.

Good post Farmer. The bottom line this season is we did not score enough. To put our defence into the proper perspective we only had 100 or more points scored on us 5 times for the season. Five. In one of those games we won . Two were early on when all teams were scoring high (with the cats swamping us after we lost gawn at half time) and the last one was the rampant crows when we ran out of legs. No question Tmacs younger brother was better when Tmac went back. I think he will end up being the better player full stop. I have watched him closely all season and he is better kick and decision maker who makes very few errors. As evidence of this i i have little doubt he will poll well in the bluey. I have been told that the club is very confident about him eventually being the better player than Tmac. This was a big factor in why, much to one posters immense frustration, they let Dunn and did not see the need to replace him with a stop gap whilst they were wating for Lever to compliment him down back. A star? I think he has the ability but has long way to go. But what gives me enormous confidence is he is a kid. Only 21 and since making his debut in 2016 has barely missed a game such is the confidence the club has in him. He is tracking fantastically and well ahead of his brother at the same age - indeed ahead of many players of his size at comparable stages. He will fill out and put on 5-10kg more muscle and be a beast in years to come. A star is a big call but i'll tell you something for free. If it comes to pass you will have earned a great deal more credit in the talent spotting stakes than predicting a top draft pick will become one. Lever for example.

What makes you deduce bandicoot can't see real talent from the comment of his you quoted?

Sorry, i'm a bit confused. Did i miss something? Who on 'here' is saying 'his stats aren't good enough???'

Yep 100% agree. Really only Oliver is an A grader ATM. Plus we have focused so much on contested ball winners we really lack outside skill. As you say any side with really good midfields hurt us, even if they are otherwise not that strong. Brisbane, North and the pies come to mind. But the situation was made worse by Gawn's dramatic drop off in form and influence. He must have been carrying injuries as he first half of the Port game was the only time post his hammy he was anywhere near his best. And then he got injured again. And Ports midfield dragged them back into the game.

You're funny Steve. Surely to goodness you realised i was having a joke and this quote is an attempt at irony. My bias? Surely you are jesting? Your Lever bias is more than a little concerning. But if you didn't get my joke i'll spell it out Lever is a terrific player. No question. I have never said any different. I hope we get him. But it doesn't a take a football talent savant to have worked out Lever is a really good player. Few if any people overrate him. With perhaps one exception. You. The way you rave about him $850 would be a steal.

Shhh. Lever is going to be the greatest defender of his generation. Better than Rance (so much more advanced at the same age i can hear the acolytes whisper). And so young. So much potential. Will be the best recruit the dees have ever had.

I think a more accurate comment would be lever is (more than) a tad over rated by some on this site. Well one on this site.