P-man

Absolutely. Giving him away for chump change now would be essentially giving up on him, which would run contrary to everything Roos was saying prior to this season. Toump can still become a decent player. We've seen the talent he has in glimpses. It's just going to take patience. I'll be disappointed if we basically chuck in the towel and give him away for nothing.

Might be better to celebrate this by getting his name right.

A condescending dismissal? How out of character Yes, let's move on.

I think we've been over this before so I won't derail the thread to go over it again. You have your view, I have my own. I've witnessed it too often to not believe that it happens with some regularity.

I know you've copped a fair bit of flack for your criticism of Garland but I'm glad you've opened up the discussion and stuck to your guns. Groupthink is a very real thing on this forum, and if you're on the wrong end of it, look out. Just be thankful you're criticising Garland and not McDonald. Or worse yet, not being in favour of the club receiving a priority pick. I'm a bit on the fence with Garlo. Due to his experience and versatility, I don't think we're in a position to be letting him go just yet, but I'd hope the next iteration of our back six will see a few upgrades.

There's no way known that Whitfield is behind Mayes or Vlastuin, let alone well behind. He's next in line behind the big three from that draft. As for Plowman, he's shown very little to get excited over. I however don't think we are necessarily all sorted down back, certainly not all sorted forward, and with the prototype modern midfielder being the size of Cripps and Fyfe, there are few restrictions on where they could end up playing.

I also rate him but he definitely stagnated in 2015. Needs to smash the pre-season and make some big steps in 2016 to restore the faith.

Fantastic speech. The best of the night, although Bernie's was a close second and the great man PJ always delivers. The club is rooted in greatness. It has it coursing through its blood. It may have lost its way, but in its origins and in its history, it is a giant of the competition. Every other club is content while the giant is asleep. Of course, the club should be whole heartedly applauded for its support of the women's game. It takes a special breed of halfwit to think otherwise.

For a third time, keeping his cards close in terms of refusal to can existing policies despite some of them running contrary to his own personal views.

"Thank you gentlemen for coming to this introductory meeting... KICK THE BLOODY THING!!! DON'T MUCK ARIUND WITH IT JUST KICK IT DOWN THE GUTS!!!! ..see you all next week."

Not even annoyed if it turns out to be BS. It's a very nice thought.

Even a half interest in Turnbull's political career would inform you of his stance on those issues. He is a lot more progressive than Abbott in those areas, but he has to win over his colleagues' trust before coming in and upsetting the apple cart. In saying all that, I'm still aware that Turnbull's reputation as a champion of the left is very much overblown. He is still every bit a Lib.

No doubt he was very good. Richmond are rubbish without him. But at the expense of Kennedy who was superbly consistent, is a joke. Particularly when Deledio missed a chunk of the season.

THREE Richmond players: Rance, Riewoldt and Deledio. Riewoldt at the expense of Walker and Deledio at the expense of JPK. Deledio played 17 games this season. Kevin Bartlett has no place in this process. He simply can't control his bias.

You seem to not understand the concept of best 22. It isn't the same as best available 22. When someone asks "is he best 22?", it is under the premise of having a full list of players to choose from.

It's a mixture of bewildering and amusing seeing rusted ons in the last week scrape the barrel in an attempt to paint Abbott's horrible legacy as Prime Minister in a positive light. His "hard work" with regard to same sex marriage. Genune lols. History will give zero shits about him scrapping the carbon tax. Many conservatives struggle to feign interest now. People cared about it as part of his election campaign because he flat out lied about the damage it was doing and the benefit that would result from him scrapping it. Its removal benefitted very few in any substantial way other than his mates at the top end of town, and the dope kept the compensation packages in one of numerous budgeting "mishaps". Australia WILL MOVE to a price on carbon. Fools can stick their head in the sand in perpetuity. The world is moving in that direction. Fast. We're just now back behind the eight ball with the economy in a state of complete disrepair. Far worse than when he came to office, as can be said for unemployment, job security, the budget deficit, business confidence...almost any indicator you can name, Tony has slammed us into reverse. We'll give him a tick on "stopping the boats", and temporarily ignore the secrecy, coercing cover ups, paying off people smugglers, neglect towards detention conditions, relocation of deaths, and the fact we don't actually know they were stopped. Turnbull is retaining existing policy more as a political move than anything else. He knows from past experience that rocking the boat too much isn't good for his capital inside party room walls. He has stated publicly he intends to negotiate. Most importantly of all that means with the cabinet and his own party. You can rest assured that "captain's calls" will be a thing of the past. We know what he REALLY thinks constitutes suitable action on climate change, same sex marriage and the NBN. But for now, the cards are to be kept close to the chest. He needs to ease into the bath this time, not dive head first. I honestly don't know how Turnbull will fare as PM, although his business acumen can't hurt at a time when foreign investors are hitting the snooze button. I do know that the Libs now have a much better chance of being re-elected. You would hope this will spurr Bill Shorten into actually doing something. He can no longer sit back and watch the other job self destruct. The problem for the ALP is that Shorten is about as inspiring as a wet tea towel. Turnbull might be more charismatic than his predecessor but he also has more substance as a leader and a greater likelihood to ultimately put the greater good ahead of political point scoring. One can only hope.

You didn't use logic though. Saying that Watts is best 22 because he finished 18th in the BnF this year is not a logical conclusion. You haven't accounted for injured players being kept off the field who make a strong case for best 22 - Kent, Frost, Petracca, Trengove etc. It's a false argument, unless you're changing the customary definition of what best 22 means, i.e. the strongest fielded side with a healthy list. If he's best 22, it's certainly not clear cut. He's on the very fringes and will get pushed out very quickly if he can't make sizeable improvements next season.

That's not logical. It doesn't account for injuries to players this season or different positional requirements for fielding a "best 22".

I doubt they would be silly enough to underrate him give our lack of key position depth. He's been far more consistent than Dawes and provides healthy competition for selection. Easy decision to give him another year.

I'm a believer. Yes he's not the quickest but his skills and decision making are good enough to give him some longevity in this caper if he continues to work hard and improve on his two way running. As mentioned, this season mirrored the last with a run of games seeing an increase in his numbers and overall impact. I hope to see him given reasonable opportunity in 2016.

You can't rule anything out in terms of players coming good but he's well and truly in the Melksham class right now. 24 year old midfielder who averaged just over 16 disposals in his last two seasons. Soft as butter and poor under pressure. When North are going forward, it's often when it gets in the hands of Bastinac that the play breaks down. For the right price maybe, but the right price is a third round pick. North will want more.

Cats fans were bitterly disappointed that we snared this guy ahead of them. Knowing little about him I thought we may have had a rough diamond on our hands. Round 1 had me more convinced. Unfortunately Round 1 was something of a high point in his season. He will pop up and do something that makes you sit up in your seat, then go missing for 20 minutes. I'm really over those kind of players. There may still be a role carved out for him in the forward line if he can improve his defensive pressure, but I rate Michie well ahead of him in terms of being able to hold down a spot in the side moving forward.

Hasn't always played in the midfield and his numbers reflect that. You have to give something to get something, especially in our position. Hartlett has elite traits and is a proven performer in big games. At 25 he'll still be at a high level when we are ready to be knocking on the door. Pick 6 is a no brainer.

Grant, Melksham, Bastinac... Can't wait for the next name that pops up.

If we're a chance, do what it takes.