Lil_red_fire_engine

2nd in the 2015 B&F and twice in the 22 best under 22 in his formative years after being a highly rated junior. Hard to say he did not excel early on its more about whether he can return to that and more. HIs career stalled once concussion hit and being it is well touted how poor their culture player management and development has been seems like a player who could significantly improve into the player he looked like he would become with a hit of the reset button at another club.

We dont know whether Lever, Omac, Frost would really work as we only played the three of them together once I believe in round 3. Based on us choosing to not though at the time it was clearly not our preferred set up. This is my take though on the situation based on each player. Lever is an emerging super star who will play better in his customary role as the third tall/marshall the backline. He will in essence replace the Lewis role in my view next year. People have got over excited by Frost having a good month of footy. I will still remember how many marks he misjudged under pressure and cant see him playing more consistent footy than what he showed. He has good dash and has improved his decision making and execution but I will never trust him fully. I would trade him whilst his value is at its highest. Oscar is trending toward developing into a very good player. When I watch him though I think second quality tall like Astbury or Hooker or Thomson rather than a Rance or Hurley or Tarrant. Whilst he will get stronger and will improve his athleticism he will never be fast off the mark and I doubt will ever be aggressive. This is where May comes in. May played on Hawkins in the last game of the year when the Cats smashed them by 100 points. Hawkins kicked 2 goals. Ben Brown kicked 4 goals across 2 games on him. Buddy was held goal less the one game they played against them whilst May took 14 marks. The only one that really beat him all year was a Kennedy with a 5 goal performance in an 80 point West Coast demolition. He is a quality player with a competitive aggressive streak and that has been in a low team with poor culture and development. He will be better than he already has shown with us and that says alot.

He will cost more than a 3rd I suggest. Former 5 pick with 78 games to his name and slowed by injury. I wonder if Tyson could work?

Do you think we played better with or without him this year? What role would you train him for next year over preseason? Where you see his improvement coming from? I would not be pushing him out but for the amount we have invested in him cap wise I would want a clear plan or be maximising any want he has to go home if it's there.

The question isn't whether Jesse is a good player. The question is do we play better without him and IF he wanted to go home whether we could maximise it to fulfill some of our key deficiencies in outside speed both this year via a high position in the draft as well next year loading up in a trade or FA with the cash saved.

I get it and he can play but I don't get why he would agree to be an alternate ruck. He could potentially go to GWS and be their first ruck. He would be better than anything the cats could have thrown at us last night including those that were not fit. He would be better biding his time North and taking over from Goldy.

This makes perfect sense for us but no sense if I was Preuss. You would be better waiting Goldstein out and passing him next year probably vs second fiddle to the best ruckman in the AFL in his mid 20s. The only way would be if we plan on a different set up with 2 rucks with potential rule changes next year.

Oops Revise that to pick 4 or 5.

I would not trade Hogan unless he wanted out but I am not overly concerned if he chose to go compared to prior years. I believe we do play a better brand without him as focal point. I personally don't believe he has much more upside and I am not convinced on him in pressure situations. He is a good player but I don't think he will be the great we once hoped and even still we no longer need a messiah. If I was asked to order players who you would not trade ahead of him I would have Gawn, Oliver, T-Mac, Lever, Brayshaw and Viney ahead without hesitation and would have Harmes and Salem trending upward at a rate of knots. Weid's development in games 15-18 makes this even more interesting. This is not about is Hogan a good player, this is about what makes us a great team. Lets assume Neale gets to the Suns for their first pick. Pick 2 (Sam Walsh) and Ed Langdon would be a reasonable deal and give us the outside speed that we may be shown up to lack. Not my preferred option but if it happened now would be the year you would want him to ask. Now to turn my focus back to what matters and is happening on the field in September.

We’re built for this September stuff. Who’d have thought that watching finals is better than watching the draft.

I plan on reading this thread from start to finish over breakfast tomorrow. A lot of amusing humble pie I suspect.

I suggest the form of Brayshaw and Harmes would have them rethinking any plans from April. In saying that I think we still need another half back runner but I would be keeping my powder dry for Whitfield the following year unless we think he can be extracted this one.

I have no inside info but his JLT was poor aside from a quality second half of JLT 2. We now have serious quality depth and he does not have runs on the board to be named without decent form or performance. I rate him highly but he needs to show more and I suspect if we hold him back to when he's cherry ripe and in hot form it will likely be the last time he is not a permanent first 22 player.

Could not agree more. Our absolute priority needs to be locking Petracca away on a long term deal. Sloane is a good mid who can't play a tag. You don't pay overs for that type and you will need to to get him.

Could not be happier. Hope he gets a good run at it and fulfills the promise he originally had.

that answers that then. its a no from me.

Not interested unless rookie. Looks like a human highlight reel with no defensive game. Maybe its just me but a small forward needs to have the ability to also actually play small. Its a no from me unless he's there for the rookie draft.

Jason Taylor has stated we will be looking over the draft/trade period to increase our midfield depth and possibly look for some small pressure forwards. I can't see how Fritsch fits the bill and in fact seems to fit a role we have depth in already. I doubt we would take him inside 40.

How is this a huge gamble? At worst you get the existing output of a 21 year old elite intercept defender as already seen. At best you get the expected incremental improvement of a 21 year old 196cm defender over his next 4 years of development into what should be his peak. Skys the limit. Anyone that thinks we paid overs over rates the draft. Even so I suspect we will use 27 and 35 to get back into the top 20 some how. Those that say let him walk to the draft, North have deep pockets and I suspect would have snapped him up before us. Similar to the Hawthorn, Sydney and Geelong models, pick your targets, be open with what you think is fair, get your player and move on.

Let me get this right. He was taken pick 14 (probably pick 3 on count back of that draft now). Now has 50 games investment in him, enough to be an AA squad member at 21 yet is not worth 10 and 20. What would you want for an out of contract Petracca? I am not saying we pay 10 and 20 but if thats what ends up being required it is fair value.

Fair few there you're over rating. i think it's assured he will finish top 10 in their B&F and probably top 5. Will be interesting to see. Also we are talking about a kid 5 years away from his best footy with 10 years probably left. Not exactly apples with apples.

How did the Cats tall forwards go tonight. 8 marks and 5 massive spoils to go with the best disposal efficiency on the ground in a pressure match. Not his best but I would suggest he would feature higher in the coaches votes than 16th or lower. Is a super player who is already statistically the best intercept mark in the comp which is fast becoming a crucial role in today's game.

You have noted they're 13 cms and 8 kilos in size difference yeah?

Likely if I asked most who the best 3 key position defenders are they would say Rance, Hurley and McGovern. Would be worth looking at how often any of them play on the main key forward or even the second one this year.

Lever went as a mid first round picked and if you re-ordered that draft now you would have him at worst 3rd behind Trac and Heeney. He is a player type that will only get better as his body matures. Our first pick is likely to be around about where he got picked that year (but not better) yet some think that and some steak knives will get the job done. It will take our first pick and some serious quality unless we put a deal forward that means we could walk him through the draft (unlikely). Whilst I am sure we wont entertain it unless he wanted out,the Hogan article aside from the emotion attached is not that far off logic. We have proven we can kick good scores without him and this was before we unearthed T-Mac as a forward option. We have proven we leak multiple goals against tall forwards and need to improve the quality of our transition from defence. A lot on here are unsure whether O-Mac and Frost are the answer. I assume some on here are worried whether we have already seen the best of Hogan. It could be argued Lever is more important to us having a tilt than Hogan. Granted you would want to keep both but if push came to shove........