Demonland Podcast featuring Jason Taylor LIVE Tuesday 15th December @ 8:30pm

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

4 hours ago, Pollyanna said:

How could anyone accurately rate the overall strength of next year's draft at this stage when everyone has been saying that this year's crop is underexposed?  That goes double at least for next year's crop.

In normal years there’s a few players drafted on their under 17 form but mostly it’s assessing guys in their 18th year. In theory there should be a handful of Clayton Oliver, Bontempelli type bolters who would’ve jumped up in addition to next years crop. So possibly a  few players per round in the draft more than usual.

The counter to that is those guys are eligible for the midseason draft as far as I know. So if they come on strongly in the early games they could be snapped up mid year.

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

6 hours ago, dazzledavey36 said:

Go to 11:29 @DeeSpencer

I think you owe Jason Taylor an apology. Not only did you kick up a big fuss over the Max Holmes debacle you still didn't provide any evidence.

Jason Taylor pretty much confirmed that while we were interested to some degree,  we had hoped that he would be there at our 3rd pick.

Taylor was not fazed one bit that Geelong jumped in early.

I don’t think I need to apologise to Jason specifically. I still think there was way too much smoke about a bolter with no form at all. But if he wasn’t so high on our board I’ll say I was overly critical of the football department staff and I’d withdraw some of those comments. 

 

[cantstandyasam 700]

31 minutes ago, cantstandyasam said:

Is Tay eligible for this year or is it more for 2021. So if Deakyn, Taj and maybe Kobe, any idea who the other 3 might be...?

Did some research apparently Taj is not eligible for this year's intake.

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

The most interesting parts for me:

- Bowey is going to start with the defenders.
Which I like. Confirms what I saw in his footage that his best attribute is his ability to change angles and kick quickly and accurately.

- Laurie will be with the forwards but has midfield potential. Great spacial awareness and ability to release a team mate in space
- Petty resuming training with the defenders
- Nietschke always finding the ball at training (which I’ve witnessed). Will be with the wingers
- Sparrow made good progress last year 

Is Deakyn Smith still eligible to be added as a cat B rookie? If he is I’d imagine he’s a decent chance to get a year if he trains well.

[Demonland 70,238]

45 minutes ago, cantstandyasam said:

Is Tay eligible for this year or is it more for 2021. So if Deakyn, Taj and maybe Kobe, any idea who the other 3 might be...?

According to Jason he is eligible for next years draft.

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

47 minutes ago, cantstandyasam said:

Is Tay eligible for this year or is it more for 2021. So if Deakyn, Taj and maybe Kobe, any idea who the other 3 might be...?

We typically haven’t had a lot of players training on. I’m not sure we’d try to fill all 6 potential spots. 

And I’m not sure Taj counts. Clubs usually get father son / academy players in for a look the summer before their draft, that’s different to train on players.

Smith might still be cat B eligible. Farmer is obviously a special case. Otherwise I’d expect only guys they are serious about adding to the list rather than a trial group

[whatwhat say what 22,075]

taj woewodin sounds like a prospect we have serious eyes on, as does kalani white some further years down the line

very interesting that they're focusing on bowey being a defender straight away; we clearly have a position becoming available in the coming years for a small defender who can hit targets by foot and execute the switch

[The Chazz 4,077]

59 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

The most interesting parts for me:

- Bowey is going to start with the defenders.
Which I like. Confirms what I saw in his footage that his best attribute is his ability to change angles and kick quickly and accurately.

- Laurie will be with the forwards but has midfield potential. Great spacial awareness and ability to release a team mate in space
- Petty resuming training with the defenders
- Nietschke always finding the ball at training (which I’ve witnessed). Will be with the wingers
- Sparrow made good progress last year 

Is Deakyn Smith still eligible to be added as a cat B rookie? If he is I’d imagine he’s a decent chance to get a year if he trains well.

Petty training with the backs is a no-brainer for mine.  We have 3 quality tall forwards, which I strongly believe, all things equal, that we go in to Round 1 with next year.  We can always play with 2 if one gets injured, and if 2 of them are out, it'll depend on which two they are as to how we line up (ie if Brown and Weid are out, we will need another tall, which could easily be McDonald/Petty to fill the gap, or if it's Jackson and Weid out, I'd imagine they'll play Brown and possibly Mitch Brown or Fritsch as the 2nd target).

Down the other end, however, our key posts aren't batting as deep, hence why I think it's quite important that Petty spends preseason down there.

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

56 minutes ago, The Chazz said:

Petty training with the backs is a no-brainer for mine.  We have 3 quality tall forwards, which I strongly believe, all things equal, that we go in to Round 1 with next year.  We can always play with 2 if one gets injured, and if 2 of them are out, it'll depend on which two they are as to how we line up (ie if Brown and Weid are out, we will need another tall, which could easily be McDonald/Petty to fill the gap, or if it's Jackson and Weid out, I'd imagine they'll play Brown and possibly Mitch Brown or Fritsch as the 2nd target).

Down the other end, however, our key posts aren't batting as deep, hence why I think it's quite important that Petty spends preseason down there.

It's an easy decision from a depth perspective and maybe that's the most important consideration. I liked Petty at Casey as a defender, he's a very talented mark but I'm worried his lack of speed could be costly at AFL level. And his forward play was a really pleasant surprise late in 2019. The most important thing is to get him fit and healthy, but after that we need to do develop him well because his size, marking and reading of the play are valuable tools.

[Loose Men Everywhere 159]

Well done guys, excellent podcast.

I'm surprised none of you recalled No 17 was Harley Bennell. So quickly forgotten!

 

[58er 5,915]

2 hours ago, The Chazz said:

Petty training with the backs is a no-brainer for mine.  We have 3 quality tall forwards, which I strongly believe, all things equal, that we go in to Round 1 with next year.  We can always play with 2 if one gets injured, and if 2 of them are out, it'll depend on which two they are as to how we line up (ie if Brown and Weid are out, we will need another tall, which could easily be McDonald/Petty to fill the gap, or if it's Jackson and Weid out, I'd imagine they'll play Brown and possibly Mitch Brown or Fritsch as the 2nd target).

Down the other end, however, our key posts aren't batting as deep, hence why I think it's quite important that Petty spends preseason down there.

We are going iN a bit light with Fritta as No 2 That's  why heshould be 3 all the time and we will get the best out of him.

[58er 5,915]

3 hours ago, whatwhatsaywhat said:

taj woewodin sounds like a prospect we have serious eyes on, as does kalani white some further years down the line

very interesting that they're focusing on bowey being a defender straight away; we clearly have a position becoming available in the coming years for a small defender who can hit targets by foot and execute the switch

Why do so many supporters dismiss Jay Lockhart?

Easily The best  small defender Developing and was outrageously left out from about Round  12 in 2020 by a Coach who just stopped developing him.

Faith in ability  needs to be shown fir confidence and Jays style and dare are just what our backline needs from the BP.

[58er 5,915]

4 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

In normal years there’s a few players drafted on their under 17 form but mostly it’s assessing guys in their 18th year. In theory there should be a handful of Clayton Oliver, Bontempelli type bolters who would’ve jumped up in addition to next years crop. So possibly a  few players per round in the draft more than usual.

The counter to that is those guys are eligible for the midseason draft as far as I know. So if they come on strongly in the early games they could be snapped up mid year.

No Panna that's not so as all players are exposed this year so can be judged whereas Vic draftees were not in games so only 2019 form was exposed in their initial year.

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

33 minutes ago, 58er said:

Why do so many supporters dismiss Jay Lockhart?

Easily The best  small defender Developing and was outrageously left out from about Round  12 in 2020 by a Coach who just stopped developing him.

Faith in ability  needs to be shown fir confidence and Jays style and dare are just what our backline needs from the BP.

Simply doesn’t get enough of the ball at this stage and if you’re a small back flanker who doesn’t rack up disposals you better be elite at everything else and he’s not. He’ll have his chance to get his spot back over summer and I really like him but the coaches haven’t done anything wrong with him. 

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

29 minutes ago, 58er said:

No Panna that's not so as all players are exposed this year so can be judged whereas Vic draftees were not in games so only 2019 form was exposed in their initial year.

Can I have that again in English? 

[Demonland 70,238]

57 minutes ago, Loose Men Everywhere said:

Well done guys, excellent podcast.

I'm surprised none of you recalled No 17 was Harley Bennell. So quickly forgotten!

With some things my memory is a sieve but somehow I remember the most inane things. 

We didn’t get to see much of Harley and perhaps not physically being at games and getting a wide view of games resulted in me not recalling. 

[binman 41,930]

1 hour ago, Loose Men Everywhere said:

Well done guys, excellent podcast.

I'm surprised none of you recalled No 17 was Harley Bennell. So quickly forgotten!

 

Who?

[binman 41,930]

36 minutes ago, DeeSpencer said:

Simply doesn’t get enough of the ball at this stage and if you’re a small back flanker who doesn’t rack up disposals you better be elite at everything else and he’s not. He’ll have his chance to get his spot back over summer and I really like him but the coaches haven’t done anything wrong with him. 

Agree with this. And he is not alone, unfortunately. Last year Hannan, Melksham, Vandenburg, Baker, Neal Bullen, Spargo and Hunt all had the same issue. Kozzie too but i'm less fussed at this stage about him given his age and role (and skill set). 

[DEE fence 4,923]

On 12/14/2020 at 7:07 AM, adonski said:

Does he lurk Demonland for advice on players? If not, why not? 

Gold

[jnrmac 19,890]

6 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

Simply doesn’t get enough of the ball at this stage and if you’re a small back flanker who doesn’t rack up disposals you better be elite at everything else and he’s not. He’ll have his chance to get his spot back over summer and I really like him but the coaches haven’t done anything wrong with him. 

He is more of a lockdown defender that was being groomed to take over Nev's role wasn't he?

Not sure he was expected to "rack up disposals". In any case its not like we have a lot of small defenders other than Salem who rack up disposals....

[Pickett2Jackson 3,904]

 

 

11 hours ago, DeeSpencer said:

The most interesting parts for me:

- Bowey is going to start with the defenders.
Which I like. Confirms what I saw in his footage that his best attribute is his ability to change angles and kick quickly and accurately.

- Laurie will be with the forwards but has midfield potential. Great spacial awareness and ability to release a team mate in space
- Petty resuming training with the defenders
- Nietschke always finding the ball at training (which I’ve witnessed). Will be with the wingers
- Sparrow made good progress last year 

Is Deakyn Smith still eligible to be added as a cat B rookie? If he is I’d imagine he’s a decent chance to get a year if he trains well.

Would prefer Boweys creativity inside forward 50.   Will be wasted in defense.  Seems like a Goodwin decision to play him down back (see James Harmes).

I like Petty as a forward but we are now loaded up there for talls... if he can make his mark as a CHB look out.  Has some great attributes that compliment May and Lever.

[Tarax Club 3,741]

On 12/14/2020 at 3:35 PM, 58er said:

Automatically dismissing Any player BELOW 180 cm ( 6 ft) and calling a 179 cm recruit a "MIDGET".

The perception running through Demonland boards around the recruitment of Jake Bowey (ht.175cm wt. 67 kg)  and Bailey Laurie (ht.179cm wt. 78kg) as lacking sufficient height or body size for AFL football. Does seem to be a trifle ingenuous when you consider present and past players of similar physique, some of who other posters have mentioned. Of course the standard in the modern game is for bigger bodied 'midfielders', a trend started with the advent of ruck-rovers. Norm Smith's innovative use of Ron Barassi (ht. 179cm wt. 87 kg) with the followers (rucks and rovers) gave great drive around the packs in the halcyon era. 

'Rovers' it appears have gone the way of the dinosaur, both as a term to refer to a particular type of player and among the present cohort of players which constitute a team. Fortunately some smaller men are still to be found scattered across the AFL and are most capable contributors. Just to add some historical perspective, these past champions of the Melbourne FC measured up as follows; Stuart Spencer (ht. 178cm wt. 76kg), Frank Adams (ht. 168 cm wt. 76kg) and Ian 'Tiger' Ridley a formidable (ht. 166cm wt. 68 kg).

postscript: 6 ft = 182.88 cm

Edited December 16, 2020 by Tarax Club

[DeeSpencer 24,683]

1 hour ago, jnrmac said:

He is more of a lockdown defender that was being groomed to take over Nev's role wasn't he?

Not sure he was expected to "rack up disposals". In any case its not like we have a lot of small defenders other than Salem who rack up disposals....

Hibberd took most of the lock down jobs and on a couple of occasions Smith.

Lockhart and even Jetta were played as pretty standard back flankers in a lot of games and restricted to limited minutes to protect against their lack of fitness. Rivers took over Lockhart's spot in the side and averaged 13.3 which is significantly more of the ball than Lockhart's 8.8.

[binman 41,930]

7 hours ago, Pickett2Jackson said:

 

 

Would prefer Boweys creativity inside forward 50.   Will be wasted in defense.  Seems like a Goodwin decision to play him down back (see James Harmes).

I like Petty as a forward but we are now loaded up there for talls... if he can make his mark as a CHB look out.  Has some great attributes that compliment May and Lever.

Do you think Caleb Daniels is wasted in defence?

I don't. He his arguably the dogs most valuable player.

Bowey is exactly the sort of player we need in that same role.

We have kozzie, spargo and now Laurie for small forwards.

Seems like they identified a clear need and Taylor filled it.

[DEE fence 4,923]

Listened to the show yesterday while driving around Cyprus of all places, thanks fellas was most appreciated, thought JT was very forthright, would love to sit with him during a game and hear how he sees things, would be quite the education. Was it just me or did he give the impression of being most interested in Taj over White and Farmer?