My observation this year is that we have been involved in a lot of high tackling games, more than other teams but I don't have either the expertise to check this online or the time to do it manually.

I have checked our stats for tackles.  We have won the tackle count this year 5 times (GWS, Rich, Suns, WB and Brisbane). Our aggregate is +24 over those 5 games (ave of 4.8 per game) of which we've won 4. In the other 9 games we have lost the tackle count by 228 or 25 per game.  Where we've lost the tackle count we've only beaten Collingwood.

Does anyone know if our games are higher tackle games than "average" and can anyone throw some light on why this might be.  Is it coincidence?  Are we easier to tackle because we are young and not as strong as other teams, is it because we play a more contested brand of footy, is it decision making that means when we handball we do so to someone in a poor position meaning they are easier to tackle?

I've watched a fair bit of footy this year and there have been a lot of "bruise free" games.  We don't seem to be involved in our share.  When we get a chance to use the ball we do it well and I think the key to stopping us (and a lot of other teams) is to pressure and tackle.  It makes me think we've been a bit stiff to strike other teams when they are "on" (Essendon after their call to arms, Adelaide, Swans after their GWS flogging to name three).

I'm interested in others thoughts.

tackle count is always important. shows intent and desire to win the ball. adelaide smacked us in the count yesterday,and no coincidence that we've lost count in all games we've lost.

We were absolutely smashed in the Swans game 155-89 tackles. 

I get the feeling teams always get high tackle numbers against us. Our players are easy to tackle as opposed to other teams just being on. 

We don't have many outside runners so I think oppositions are looking to exploit us by stopping the ball, creating a stoppage and then playing to win the clearance from those situations. Those stoppages create a lot of tackles, and Melbourne being one of the best midfields in clearances, we tend to get our hands on the ball first, hence why we're getting tackled so much. It's also an inability to effectively break free of the stoppage on enough occasions. Hospital handpasses, a number of players who struggle in marking contests (Dawes, Frost, OMac, even Tyson, Stretch) and bring the ball to ground. 

Against the Bulldogs they were just far too good at stoppages and had 2-3 players hanging out around the play. We got on hands on the ball against Sydney but they were maniacs and held us in every time. 

It's a combination of things, really. Inexperience, ineptness, stupidity. Seeing blokes have the ball with no one in front of them, only to stop, prop and look for the handpass, only to get tackled or handball to a teammate who gets tackled. As the year progresses it seems to be going up and down: when we break free we're better than we've been for a while, but once we got caught up, the opposition seems to break tackling records. 

 

I heard an interesting stat on MMM on the way to the ground.

We are ranked number 1 for most head high tackles against. Often it is because we have been up against actors who have made a fine art of dropping knees and ducking ( L Thomas, R Mathieson and C Cameron gave it his all yesterday) but clearly this is something we need technique training for.

Our players stand too close together through the middle. Not enough space to move. Poor positioning may also explain why we struggle to hit targets by hand, which leads to being tackled

7 minutes ago, Je Roos Salem said:

Our players stand too close together through the middle. Not enough space to move. Poor positioning may also explain why we struggle to hit targets by hand, which leads to being tackled

Agree that this happens too often.

For me the Essendon game stands out as the one we're pure desire to tackle was at such odds between the two teams. They were really desperate and relentless, while we let them stroll around as if they had some infectious disease. 

I overall it's still better than what we've seen in the past but I would be very interested to see the stats of our forwards and how many tackles they've laid. For me the that's the crucial part of the ground for tackling, if we get the ball in there enough and are able to lock it in with pressure it creates more scoring opportunities.

8 hours ago, TRIGON said:

Agree that this happens too often.

Happens all the time

N Jones worst offender

Great topic to raise.  In three of our last four games, the opposition have had season high tackle counts against us - Hawthorn had over 100, Swans a game record 155, and Adelaide I think got to the century this week.  You could argue that the wet conditions played a part in the Hawks and Swans games, but I've got no doubt that the no 1 instruction from opposition coaches is to put extreme pressure on us at the contest, because even though we'll often get first hands we tend to handball to teammates a metre or so away who are immediately swamped, and they'll handball again to someone in close.  Someone said to me we should have won on Sunday because we had 34 more disposals but the only reason we had more was because of all the ring-a-ring-a-rosy handballs trying to get out of trouble.  Watch the Dogs and Crows - they do whatever they can to handball long and out of the contest (often virtually throwing it, as we saw in our own game v the Dogs) because they know they've got guys on the outside who are generally quick and can explode away.  We don't have that yet....it's why someone like an O'Meara would be fantastic for us. 

Essentially, our game style can be really exciting when it gets going but it invites pressure, and the good teams make their tackles stick.  Expect Freo to be all over us this week - Ross the boss described us as a "high handball" team on the couch last night so they will love the greasy conditions in Darwin which should help amplify their pressure and tackling.

11 hours ago, Je Roos Salem said:

Our players stand too close together through the middle. Not enough space to move. Poor positioning may also explain why we struggle to hit targets by hand, which leads to being tackled

This was the case on the weekend against the Crows. We had too many that were standing too close to the contest, the ball would come out and the Crows were able to dish it off to runners very easily. In contrast, we were too close and either we gave short handballs to someone under pressure or if we did get it out those same Crow outside runners were able to tackle us creating another contest.

I think our tackling has bveen generally good this year.We seem to wait a split second before committing and players are very conscious of where they begin the tackle (ie the height).

Always plenty of work to do but the first issue in this post is realtively easy to resolve.

 

 

20 minutes ago, Glenn Molloy said:

Great topic to raise.  In three of our last four games, the opposition have had season high tackle counts against us - Hawthorn had over 100, Swans a game record 155, and Adelaide I think got to the century this week.  You could argue that the wet conditions played a part in the Hawks and Swans games, but I've got no doubt that the no 1 instruction from opposition coaches is to put extreme pressure on us at the contest, because even though we'll often get first hands we tend to handball to teammates a metre or so away who are immediately swamped, and they'll handball again to someone in close.  Someone said to me we should have won on Sunday because we had 34 more disposals but the only reason we had more was because of all the ring-a-ring-a-rosy handballs trying to get out of trouble.  Watch the Dogs and Crows - they do whatever they can to handball long and out of the contest (often virtually throwing it, as we saw in our own game v the Dogs) because they know they've got guys on the outside who are generally quick and can explode away.  We don't have that yet....it's why someone like an O'Meara would be fantastic for us. 

Essentially, our game style can be really exciting when it gets going but it invites pressure, and the good teams make their tackles stick.  Expect Freo to be all over us this week - Ross the boss described us as a "high handball" team on the couch last night so they will love the greasy conditions in Darwin which should help amplify their pressure and tackling.

Yep this.

11 hours ago, Je Roos Salem said:

Our players stand too close together through the middle. Not enough space to move. Poor positioning may also explain why we struggle to hit targets by hand, which leads to being tackled

Thats what happens when we play so many inside mids. They all get drawn in because they want to win the ball. Which normaly isnt a bad thing individually but as a team it doesnt work. Having the likes of Kent, Hunt, Stretch, and M Jones playing on the outside made us look better at times because there was someone out with space. When those blokes wern't on the outside of the contest we struggled.

On 4 July 2016 at 4:10 PM, Vogon Poetry said:

My observation this year is that we have been involved in a lot of high tackling games, more than other teams but I don't have either the expertise to check this online or the time to do it manually.

I have checked our stats for tackles.  We have won the tackle count this year 5 times (GWS, Rich, Suns, WB and Brisbane). Our aggregate is +24 over those 5 games (ave of 4.8 per game) of which we've won 4. In the other 9 games we have lost the tackle count by 228 or 25 per game.  Where we've lost the tackle count we've only beaten Collingwood.

Does anyone know if our games are higher tackle games than "average" and can anyone throw some light on why this might be.  Is it coincidence?  Are we easier to tackle because we are young and not as strong as other teams, is it because we play a more contested brand of footy, is it decision making that means when we handball we do so to someone in a poor position meaning they are easier to tackle?

I've watched a fair bit of footy this year and there have been a lot of "bruise free" games.  We don't seem to be involved in our share.  When we get a chance to use the ball we do it well and I think the key to stopping us (and a lot of other teams) is to pressure and tackle.  It makes me think we've been a bit stiff to strike other teams when they are "on" (Essendon after their call to arms, Adelaide, Swans after their GWS flogging to name three).

I'm interested in others thoughts.

I reckon you,re spot on bringing this topic up, Vogon, because it seems to me that tackling is one of the most important aspects of our game.   Though there's nothing in the rules to say that a good tackle should be "rewarded", a good tackle impresses umpires, and is likely to result in a free. If a player is tackled immediately he receives the ball(" no prior") ,one arm is pulled back, and the ball drops free,the home crowd yells "BALLLLLL", usually a free is paid(incorrectly).

We  should coach our players to tackle by grabbing one arm,and pulling it off the ball. The good teams do it to us.

One of the most important assets of tackling is to make sure the opponent doesn't  somehow get the ball off to a team mate. Players are amazingly quick at this now.    Multiple short hand passes occur within the pack situation , until , eventually, someone manages to find a team-mate free enough to seek an option downfield.The question is... Should the tackler go for the waist( old theory),the arms,or the ball?

Perhaps in the congested, pack situation, the tackler should attempt to knock the ball, to disrupt the "give off" to a team-mate.

But if a tackler " blind sides " the opponent, he should grab one arm, while pulling him off his kick,trying to make the ball fall free.

Its noticeable that when a side starts to get the ascendancy in a match, one of the most obvious features is that they continually tackle the opposition effectively every time they get the ball.

 

Roos should send them all over to a tackling session with the Storm. That'll show em how it's done