Think Collingwood 4 years ago.

Think Travis Cloke 4 years ago.

Cloke was or about to turn 25 when he received his payday. Collingwood tried to lure Johnathon Brown down but failed, then When Clokes contract was up for renewal his dad played hardball a secured a five year deal worth (speculative from media) around 800k a year, today's equivalent of 1-1.2 million. Cloke had the bodywork and was arguably the greatest contested mark getting around, but there was a question mark on his kicking for goal. This year was his fourth year of that contract, dropped 3 times? Missed a goal from 5 metres out directly in front playing in the VFL, now the club which payed overs for him can't get him out the door quick enough. Yes they're different players but there are similarities, start missing easy shots, confidence drops then can start to affect other areas of your game. When a club is preparing to offer a player a 5-6 year deal potentially worth upwards of a million dollars a season you'd like to think that player is the complete package. Having said that Buddy struggles to take a contested mark and Danger (yes I'm aware he's not on a million) is no stranger to the occasional shank. 

50 goals a season is what we've come to expect from a Luke Bruest, Mark Lecra, Jack Gunston or a Stevie J, medium forward type of player. If we are paying upwards of a million per season id be wanting 70 goals as a minimum for the home and away season. 

If Hogan can fix his issues when kicking for goal he could become one of the games greats. 

Not sure what Brad Green's role is at Hawthorn but he was one of the best kicks of the footy when having a shot on goal in recent memory. Let's get him or someone else (no idea who that would be) to work with Hogan,because regardless of where he plays in 2018 his kicking needs to addressed. 

Remove all offers from the table, if his kicking doesn't improve he's back to being a 600k player, and he won't like that, so he will go anyway to where he can get his payday.

Start talking to Peter Wright now, would be very surprised if other clubs weren't already doing so.

 

Surely if someone were to force him to watch Freo playing the Lyon style any sane player, especially a  KPP forward would cringe and say "no way"!

Not sure if trading Hogan now shows we are weak.  Need to act in the best interests of the club so if Jesse indicates he's leaning towards leaving and we think we can get a better deal now then trade him now. 

5 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

Plus do you really think the rest of the afl wouldn't stand up to the afl if we got dsrling and a pick for hogan a 22 yo super talented kpp. It would be robbery and completely unfair advantage

Standing up to the AFL. That would just like the time when ...... um,,, or just like that other time when .....

Hmm. Never mind.

3 minutes ago, monoccular said:

Surely if someone were to force him to watch Freo playing the Lyon style any sane player, especially a  KPP forward would cringe and say "no way"!

Very true. Where they're happy to score 8 goals if the opposition scores 7. A forward's dream. He'd reflect fondly on the heady days of 40 + goals a season.

32 minutes ago, RalphiusMaximus said:

People are making out that this is a recent thing. It's not. We've had contract offers in front of him for over a year and he's refused to consider them. SEVEN MONTHS AGO he told the club he would not consider their offer until after this season. He's had seven months to think about whether he wants to keep playing for Melbourne. It's not unreasonable to want an answer. 

Agree....

Jesse stated many months ago he  would look at another deal. 

He then placed all this on hold. 

3 minutes ago, Goffer said:

 Do you really believe this would have attracted the same attention if Hogan hadn't publicly shelved contract talks? 

Maybe not the same level. But the speculation would still be there. The "going home" rumours have been around almost since day one.

11 minutes ago, Return to Glory said:

Does it not show the opposite? Either you are with us or you're not.

Sure... ask for loyalty but making ultimatums

Great theory 

10 minutes ago, Ted Fidge said:

Standing up to the AFL. That would just like the time when ...... um,,, or just like that other time when .....

Hmm. Never mind.

No offence but if u think wce or freo can bully out a trade then im not the silly one here 

When and if hogan asks for a trade if a reasonable mv isnt paid it will open a huge can of worms about free agency 

If this goes into next year it will take away so much from our club. 

Instead of a reported asking Goodwin about our performances it will be "how Jesses contract negotiations going". 

Im honestly sick of it. It was Frawley a few years back. Before that Scully, before that Farmer, before that Thompson and so on. 

1 minute ago, Unleash Hell said:

No offence but if u think wce or freo can bully out a trade then im not the silly one here 

If we're in this same position in 12 months time, what kind of deal do you think we can do then?

2 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

Sure... ask for loyalty but making ultimatums

Great theory 

I don't want it to be a theory. I want it to be what we do.

5 minutes ago, Unleash Hell said:

When and if hogan asks for a trade if a reasonable mv isnt paid it will open a huge can of worms about free agency 

"We lost Hogan, but at least we opened a huge can of worms about free agency."

 

Just quietly, free agency is already a huge can of worms.

1 minute ago, Ted Fidge said:

If we're in this same position in 12 months time, what kind of deal do you think we can do then?

No doubt we are in a better bargaining position this year than we will be next year. 

For starters Freo has pick three this year. 

From memory we got pick 17 for Farmer and a similar pick for Thompson. I think the days of us being bullied at the trade table are long gone. 

10 minutes ago, Flamingdees said:

Need to act in the best interests of the club so if Jesse indicates he's leaning towards leaving and we think we can get a better deal now then trade him now. 

As if he is going to say gee boys im leaning towards leaving

18 minutes ago, Return to Glory said:

I don't want it to be a theory. I want it to be what we do.

No probs... I completely disagree.

we'll leave it there.. Sorry rtg I can't double up the debate

If Hogan walks into the club tomorrow and says I'll sign for 5 years, what's he worth?

3 minutes ago, binman said:

As if he is going to say gee boys im leaning towards leaving

True. 

Ok if he says boys I want out...

12 minutes ago, Flamingdees said:

If this goes into next year it will take away so much from our club. 

Instead of a reported asking Goodwin about our performances it will be "how Jesses contract negotiations going". 

Im honestly sick of it. It was Frawley a few years back. Before that Scully, before that Farmer, before that Thompson and so on. 

It is very likely the club will not sign or trade him this year. Im assuming from your many posts on this matter you think this would be a major error by the fd - a professional unit who have barely put a foot wrong and obviously have intimate knowledge of the situation. Well, call me crazy but i think ill back the fd on this

4 minutes ago, Bombay Airconditioning said:

If Hogan walks into the club tomorrow and says I'll sign for 5 years, what's he worth?

My guess is maybe 7 mill over 5 years. Not a bad earn.....

That Chris Dawes and Harry Lumumba would have been taking up a mill between them this year. 

2 minutes ago, Ted Fidge said:

"We lost Hogan, but at least we opened a huge can of worms about free agency."

 

Just quietly, free agency is already a huge can of worms.

I agree totally agree

Where we don't see eye to eye is you want an outcome now. I think showing loyalty and support shows maturity in our organisation. The simple question is why would you trade players you want to keep. It makes no sense and shows no loyalty even if it disadvantage the club. It's not a great look.

I do understand the advantage and appeal, But a this is not then nba. If we want loyalty we need to show it.

i also understand the argument to want an answer now and maximise the trade value, but you know what... What does that say to brayshaw, Oliver etc. Where is the loyalty? How do u ask a player to take less to keep the team together if u can't work with the players best interest in the first place?

we can only control as a club what we can offer the rest is up to Jesse. We can only act when Jesse wants us to act. That is the afl we live in now. Blame free agency, blame Gil. This is what the aflpa wanted. Small clubs being feeder clubs for the big clubs. 

I understand the reality all too well. I know what history tells us will play out, I know like you the likely outcome. Let's not for to pressure as a club though. It's a great test for this organisation and our leaders 

but for the sake of discusion 2017 comes and we are here 12 months later, considering we investe 2 x top picks in Jesse and invested 4 years anything under 2 x top 10 picks would be a robbery.

9 minutes ago, binman said:

It is very likely the club will not sign or trade him this year. Im assuming from your many posts on this matter you think this would be a major error by the fd - a professional unit who have barely put a foot wrong and obviously have intimate knowledge of the situation. Well, call me crazy but i think ill back the fd on this

It's very likely their hands are tied as it were.  Actually as opposed to desire, should there be doubt. 

We ought not lump everything into one basket.

8 minutes ago, Flamingdees said:

My guess is maybe 7 mill over 5 years. Not a bad earn.....

The more I think about the situation, the more I believe it's a financial reason for the delay in signing the contract.

Family matter is definitely clouding the situation but at the end of the day, it's all about the money. Show me the money.

If the club lays on the table 10 million over 5 years, do you think he's going to say... nah, let me think about it next year.

We are probably offering him around 3m for 4 years. Maybe less?

Do you guys really think he is worth over 1m? The best paid player at our club?

Ultimately I'm saying, I don't believe he will sign this off season. Setting us up for a year-long circus that will make the Scully situation look small time.

Our bargaining position next year will be worse than this year, so I'm saying let's go for it this year.

I have strong doubts that showing loyalty makes any difference to not showing it. The player managers are hard-@rses who wouldn't know the meaning of the word.