Agree with you RR entirely.

The AFL would be greatly embarrassed by our position. We are non competitive and a non viewing TV option. That hurts the AFL. We are also unbalancing the ladder, by who we play.

I can see the AFL quietly "directing" other clubs to not poach MFC players this year.

I can see us getting not 1 PP but maybe 2 or even more depending on our finish to the year and where the PP's are placed. I don't think you would get that much argument from the other clubs given our situation and their need to keep the AFL happy.

I can see us getting a large AFL grant to pay off the extraordinaries this year, like the fine, the CEO termination , the Coach termination and any other staff terminations.

I can see some help from the AFL on sponsorship in some way.

I can see another favourable draw next year.

I can see the AFL leaning on certain personnel to join the club.

I can see Jackson staying on well after his suggested 6 months, to get the ship going the right way.

As I have said previously I think we are in bed with the AFL now and clearly need to be and this will provide a lot of help.

I pray to God Jackson gets the right people in place in the right structures and that they all do a brilliant job, that is our only hope.

We are very, very lucky in that the AFL has just started a new 5 year broadcasting contract. If we were coming into the end of that contract and Melbourne were in this state, things could be much, much worse. Imminent extinction or relocation would be on the cards. As we have it we have 4 years...maybe 3 years to get our act together. The AFL will step in and run our club and get us back on track for the good of the game. However, be warned if we are not strong and independent again in 3 years, the AFL will consider other options. We must move forward, we must sack Neeld today.

I hope you're right Redleg. For my money i'm more than happy for the AFL to come in and do what is required - we as a club have proven we are incapable of doing it on our own

youve definately missed the point of the mark neeld is a good coach people

you reasons for sacking him are not relevant

he WAS appointed to build a 3 year fitness base level. tick

he WAS appointed to keep young draft picks at reserve level until thier bodies were strong enough to COMPETE at senior level. tick

he had to get some average senior level players with ready made bodies to play this year to cover the learning period of the youngsters. tick

yesterday he attacked gws down the middle and by q/time this was proving a bad decision. they then changed game plan , i personally thought this was a sign of improved understanding of strategy by the players.unfortunately they were definately not good enough to carry out this exercise.

i have heard mn talk and it does nothing for me. but he WAS employed to do a job and so far has carried it out to the boards requirements

any statistic wont get him sacked . it will be the boards desire to see this rebuild through or else a complete walkout and members looking for a new board.

ps members with business background and 45 hours a week to donate to a football club are hard to find at this stage.

we havent been able to find them for 30 years, so please if you know 10 or 12 good available people let the club and present board know

Jazza, if you think Mark Neeld has filled his brief or met his KPIs you are smoking the really good stuff.

if thats the case 17 coaches would be sacked every year

It is the case mate like it or not and it's why coaches are turned over of the 17 that miss, it doesn't even guarantee the one who wins. Think Clarkson/Kennett

If any other club had our results then that would be the case and we can't include the 2 new start ups even though the pressure has now come on McKenna and Sheedy is stepping back at the end of this season.

No I stick by the scoreboard as the stat that drives everything in football.

It is the case mate like it or not and it's why coaches are turned over of the 17 that miss, it doesn't even guarantee the one who wins. Think Clarkson/Kennett

If any other club had our results then that would be the case and we can't include the 2 new start ups even though the pressure has now come on McKenna and Sheedy is stepping back at the end of this season.

No I stick by the scoreboard as the stat that drives everything in football.

yep, thats why were in this mess

yep, thats why were in this mess

We're in a mess because we haven't had the right people in control of the club.

We're in a mess because we haven't had the right people in control of the club.

think about it

IF they sack neeld some of the antineeld posters will have typist withdrawl symptons

probably lodge a claim on the club.

Crawf not trying to be rude, as we are all upset and extremely angry at present but our largest loss ever at the MCG in 150 years against essendon, west coasts highest ever score in a quarter in their history, Gold Coasts first win at the MCG and their highest winning margin in their history all of this within 7 rounds and you state we need good evidence to support the decision

Yeah, I saw that. It hasn't passed by unnoticed.

My point is that if we sack Neeld we are still left with players who lack the drive to do their bit in this debacle. Six of them could not even execute one tackle for the game. Given we were chasing the Suns all day you'd reckon we might have been able to do better than that. This is a pretty basic skill - grab someone and hold on. We apparently spent a lot of time practising it over the pre-season. These clowns are killing their coach and killing the club. How is a fill-in coach going to address this simple fact? Please don't tell me it's because Neeld has upset them. I've played football under coaches who were nothing but pricks. [censored] with no credentials other than having the right mates. It made no difference to me and how I played the game. My pride was at stake every time I went on the field. I might not have had silky skills but I cared enough to give it my best effort at every contest, despite the coach.

Neeld might well be the wrong man for the job but if we're ever going to change the poor player culture at Melbourne it's time to send some messages. Sacking the coach is not the right message at this point in time. It's a quick fix to a long term problem. Let's start making players accountable. I don't care if we don't win another game as long as we don't give games to the pea-hearts on our list. These guys have to know that pulling on the jumper is an honour. I'm sick of seeing it defiled by tossers who won't even run to make a contest.

think about it

IF they sack neeld some of the antineeld posters will have typist withdrawl symptons

probably lodge a claim on the club.

It would be good to have normal everyday subjects like selection.

Yeah, I saw that. It hasn't passed by unnoticed.

My point is that if we sack Neeld we are still left with players who lack the drive to do their bit in this debacle. Six of them could not even execute one tackle for the game. Given we were chasing the Suns all day you'd reckon we might have been able to do better than that. This is a pretty basic skill - grab someone and hold on. We apparently spent a lot of time practising it over the pre-season. These clowns are killing their coach and killing the club. How is a fill-in coach going to address this simple fact? Please don't tell me it's because Neeld has upset them. I've played football under coaches who were nothing but pricks. [censored] with no credentials other than having the right mates. It made no difference to me and how I played the game. My pride was at stake every time I went on the field. I might not have had silky skills but I cared enough to give it my best effort at every contest, despite the coach.

Neeld might well be the wrong man for the job but if we're ever going to change the poor player culture at Melbourne it's time to send some messages. Sacking the coach is not the right message at this point in time. It's a quick fix to a long term problem. Let's start making players accountable. I don't care if we don't win another game as long as we don't give games to the pea-hearts on our list. These guys have to know that pulling on the jumper is an honour. I'm sick of seeing it defiled by tossers who won't even run to make a contest.

The problem is that Neeld has split the players and lost the players. Few players have developed under him. The players have lost confidence in the coach, so have I. Not changing coaches imminently would be a grave mistake.

Crawf I agree with your last post especially that personal pride should make you want to do the best you can.

Unfortunately we have a player list totally devoid of confidence which is making our performances even worse.

A coach is responsible for making young men believe in themselves and the game plan formed.

We have an inexperienced coach running our club who is clueless about how to turn this mess around.

We need a new experienced coach to develope our list and get the best out of the players and we cannot wait to sink into further financial mess as Jackson has stated in 2014

James Magner is not up to AFL standard.

Simple.

He gives his all and sticks tackles. That will do me for now.

Crawf I agree with your last post especially that personal pride should make you want to do the best you can.

Unfortunately we have a player list totally devoid of confidence which is making our performances even worse.

A coach is responsible for making young men believe in themselves and the game plan formed.

We have an inexperienced coach running our club who is clueless about how to turn this mess around.

We need a new experienced coach to develope our list and get the best out of the players and we cannot wait to sink into further financial mess as Jackson has stated in 2014

As a good friend of mine likes to say, "You just can't make strawberry jam out of camel shite."

Yeah, it's the coach's job to motivate but when you're dealing with a culture that has seen the last three coaches sacked I think it's time to tell the players to get stuffed and fix things up. Sacking the coach, whoever it might be just reinforces a culture in which players refuse to accept responsibility for their own performance.

What do you think will happen under a new coach? Will these blokes actually grow a pair and turn into men? Can't see it! When the youngest player in the team leads the way in desire and effort, it speaks volume for the intestinal fortitude of many on our list.

Go ahead, sack Neeld and appease the supporters, but don't expect it to make a difference until we fix the real problem.

Crawf do you know what the definition of stupid is.

It is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

Neeld is gone, appease the supporters by providing some hope by removing a clueless coach who has delivered the worst 7 rounds of results possible.

Change is needed for the sake of change

As a good friend of mine likes to say, "You just can't make strawberry jam out of camel shite."

Yeah, it's the coach's job to motivate but when you're dealing with a culture that has seen the last three coaches sacked I think it's time to tell the players to get stuffed and fix things up. Sacking the coach, whoever it might be just reinforces a culture in which players refuse to accept responsibility for their own performance.

What do you think will happen under a new coach? Will these blokes actually grow a pair and turn into men? Can't see it! When the youngest player in the team leads the way in desire and effort, it speaks volume for the intestinal fortitude of many on our list.

Go ahead, sack Neeld and appease the supporters, but don't expect it to make a difference until we fix the real problem.

This is out and out rubbish. Since Neeld became coach in September 2011, half our list has been turned over. Only half our list even played under Bailey. These are Neelds hand picked troops. We are not even half the team we were in 2011.

Either: The recruiting has been terrible - this is Neelds responsibility.

Or: The players are alright but the coach can't get them to believe in him, other players, the club or themselves - this is also Neelds responsibility.

Which ever way you look at it responsibility lies with the head coach Neeld.

Reality is Neeld has recruited poorly, and coached poorly. He has divided the playing group and his people management skills are beyond appalling. He has shattered self belief, he has destroyed self confidence, he has publically humiliated players (Watts, Green, Maloney, Martin, Rivers) on numerous occasions. He has traded players we should have kept for worse, older players. He has put up the two most inexperienced captains in the history of the sport in the most difficult of times. Do I need to go on? This bloke is a disaster, suggesting Neeld is not responsible is defending the indefensible.

You know what, a big part of this IS appeasing supporters, because they're leaving in droves. Without supporters, we fold.

Whether it be 5 years or 50, many simply can't justify supporting this team any longer. People need hope and right now there is zero.

Reality is Neeld has recruited poorly, and coached poorly. He has divided the playing group and his people management skills are beyond appalling. He has shattered self belief, he has destroyed self confidence, he has publically humiliated players (Watts, Green, Maloney, Martin, Rivers) on numerous occasions. He has traded players we should have kept for worse, older players. He has put up the two most inexperienced captains in the history of the sport in the most difficult of times. Do I need to go on? This bloke is a disaster, suggesting Neeld is not responsible is defending the indefensible.

Moloney (note spelling) - most public humiliation was demotion from Vice Captaincy after being drunk in a public place - NOT under Neeld's watch

Brad Green's greatest public humiliation was being played as a sub - NOT under Neeld's watch

Jack Watts was sent back to Casey under Bailey and Neeld for underperforming. His greatest public humiliation was being played in the Queen's Birthday game - NOT under Neeld's watch.

Martin and Rivers - can't recall either being publicly humiliated by any coach... but of course, if you care to elaborate, as I said previously, I'm all eyes.

His recruitment efforts are yet to be proven poor... Hogan will be a plus, Toumpas will be a plus, M Jones is already a plus, Barry we don't know enough about yet, Kent has shown a bit already, Viney is going to be very good, Dawes will be a worthwhile get, Clark has been our best get for a long time, Byrnes and Roden were brought in for leadership (not necessarily purely onfield) and cost us next to nothing - who else do you suggest we could have got in their place?

Moloney (note spelling) - most public humiliation was demotion from Vice Captaincy after being drunk in a public place - NOT under Neeld's watch

Brad Green's greatest public humiliation was being played as a sub - NOT under Neeld's watch

Jack Watts was sent back to Casey under Bailey and Neeld for underperforming. His greatest public humiliation was being played in the Queen's Birthday game - NOT under Neeld's watch.

Martin and Rivers - can't recall either being publicly humiliated by any coach... but of course, if you care to elaborate, as I said previously, I'm all eyes.

His recruitment efforts are yet to be proven poor... Hogan will be a plus, Toumpas will be a plus, M Jones is already a plus, Barry we don't know enough about yet, Kent has shown a bit already, Viney is going to be very good, Dawes will be a worthwhile get, Clark has been our best get for a long time, Byrnes and Roden were brought in for leadership (not necessarily purely onfield) and cost us next to nothing - who else do you suggest we could have got in their place?

Hardtack you have selective memory

Moloney was put back in leadership group then dumped back out by Neeld

Brad Green was dumped as captain and not deemed worthy enopugh to be in leadership group yet was chosen as Australian captain in the Ireland versus Australia series

Jack Watts was dragged against Essendon

Rivers was dumped from leadership group

Your post was super ordinary

This is out and out rubbish. Since Neeld became coach in September 2011, half our list has been turned over. Only half our list even played under Bailey. These are Neelds hand picked troops. We are not even half the team we were in 2011.

Either: The recruiting has been terrible - this is Neelds responsibility.

Or: The players are alright but the coach can't get them to believe in him, other players, the club or themselves - this is also Neelds responsibility.

Which ever way you look at it responsibility lies with the head coach Neeld.

Reality is Neeld has recruited poorly, and coached poorly. He has divided the playing group and his people management skills are beyond appalling. He has shattered self belief, he has destroyed self confidence, he has publically humiliated players (Watts, Green, Maloney, Martin, Rivers) on numerous occasions. He has traded players we should have kept for worse, older players. He has put up the two most inexperienced captains in the history of the sport in the most difficult of times. Do I need to go on? This bloke is a disaster, suggesting Neeld is not responsible is defending the indefensible.

I'm talking about a culture that transcends the current playing list. It has become ingrained. I don't know why people can't see this. Do you only read the bits you want to argue with? I'm not defending Neeld. I've said he may not be the right person. I'm not arguing to keep him regardless. I'm saying that the problem is bigger than Neeld.

I've worked in organisations where a culture established fifty years before was still impacting on decision making and stunting growth; despite management changes and staff turnover. You have to root out the problem before it will go away. I'm not even sure it can be done at MFC. I'm just certain that if these players are allowed to keep killing coaches nothing will ever change.

14 players is not half a list. Would you really have kept Cale Morton? Would you have hung on to Gysberts? Did Jamie Bennell ever fill you with hope? Liam Jurrah self-destructed and Lucas Cook was never going to make it. Jai Sheahan? Kelvin Lawrence?

Yes, we lost some experience and some talent, but in the end, if they ask to go, it's better they leave.

Neeld has not finished building his list. He's in the middle of a three year list re-build.

Don't reply. I'm done with this stuff for a while. I'm at the point of not caring any more. I promise not to post any more "out and out rubbish."

Moloney (note spelling) - most public humiliation was demotion from Vice Captaincy after being drunk in a public place - NOT under Neeld's watch

Brad Green's greatest public humiliation was being played as a sub - NOT under Neeld's watch

Jack Watts was sent back to Casey under Bailey and Neeld for underperforming. His greatest public humiliation was being played in the Queen's Birthday game - NOT under Neeld's watch.

Martin and Rivers - can't recall either being publicly humiliated by any coach... but of course, if you care to elaborate, as I said previously, I'm all eyes.

His recruitment efforts are yet to be proven poor... Hogan will be a plus, Toumpas will be a plus, M Jones is already a plus, Barry we don't know enough about yet, Kent has shown a bit already, Viney is going to be very good, Dawes will be a worthwhile get, Clark has been our best get for a long time, Byrnes and Roden were brought in for leadership (not necessarily purely onfield) and cost us next to nothing - who else do you suggest we could have got in their place?

Total hogwash.

As I said: suggesting Neeld is not responsible is defending the indefensible. Are you watching the games?

Give Neeld a Contract extension.

Crawf do you know what the definition of stupid is.

It is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

Neeld is gone, appease the supporters by providing some hope by removing a clueless coach who has delivered the worst 7 rounds of results possible.

Change is needed for the sake of change

Like sacking coaches and letting players decide what they'll do?

Crawf I thought you weren't posting anymore like the bold red type you added to my post stands out better

14 players is not half a list.

Yes, but 26 is. That's the number of players that have been turned over since Neeld arrived.

Crawf I thought you weren't posting anymore like the bold red type you added to my post stands out better

Couldn't let it pass. That's it though I'm done for now on this topic. I might start a new thread on something important like the issue of Jeremy Howe's beard and whether it might hinder his high-flying escapades..