I think he has a valid point though. Your comments suggest you know something or you have some inner knowledge about how Martin trains and works at the club. At least mention that or say you are assuming that Martin is like that.

Anyone can all do mindless speculation. Some do it better than others:)

I think he has a valid point though. Your comments suggest you know something or you have some inner knowledge about how Martin trains and works at the club. At least mention that or say you are assuming that Martin is like that.

No, no inner sanctum - just a member that's been watching him closely. He plays unaccountable footy. He still does it at Casey. He will not block for his ball carriers, will not give off, his kicking has not improved and he runs into space he shouldn't.

Further, I need to reiterate that comments and discussions can be had without resorting to puerile insults.

Edited September 12, 201212 yr by jumbo returns

Maybe a half chewed Minty

No, no inner sanctum - just a member that's been watching him closely. He plays unaccountable footy. He still does it at Casey. He will not block for his ball carriers, will not give off, his kicking has not improved and he runs into space he shouldn't.

Further, I need to reiterate that comments and discussions can be had without resorting to puerile insults.

Oh I'm sorry. You said with such authority that Martin is "un-coachable". And "will not listen". "not a team player". Now you admit you don't know but it's your observations.

I'd say you wouldn't have a clue.

As for your comment he "has not improved in 5 years" - your observations are clearly worth nothing because anyone could see he held the ruck together last year when Jamar went down.

Stop drinking your own bathwater buddy.

I am not sure if the famed Stef Martin breakout year was real or imaginary, maybe just another Melbourne supporters thing to hang onto.

He scored zero brownlow votes in 2010/2011.

For a really big guy he just doesn't know how to dish out physicallity, if he works hard he may be able to eke out a carreer like big Al, a hundred or so games over ten years.

Oh I'm sorry. You said with such authority that Martin is "un-coachable". And "will not listen". "not a team player". Now you admit you don't know but it's your observations.

I'd say you wouldn't have a clue.

As for your comment he "has not improved in 5 years" - your observations are clearly worth nothing because anyone could see he held the ruck together last year when Jamar went down.

Stop drinking your own bathwater buddy.

The Bailey years were rubbish. Time to recognise that and start a new rebuilding process.

I'm going to leave it at that.

Good luck to your posturing and clinging onto mediocrity.

This seems to be a win/win for both clubs. The Pies need a replacement for Brown and Martin can play that role. The Dees need more midfield class and could take advantage of a situation in which the Pies need to offload a player or two due to Salary Cap issues (Cloke). The Dees have the money to take hopefully, 2 good mid fielders from the Pies. As a poster who has connections to the club said the Dees are looking for up to 3 experienced midfielders to add to the mix. This could be the window the club is lkg for.

As I said, a win/win situation

Haven't seen enough of Grundy but I know he has taken a long time - 2005 rookie draft.

Martin was the 2008 pre-season draft. Give Martin another 3 years and then compare.

My gut says martin.

No, Grundy in this years NAB Draft...

Oh I'm sorry. You said with such authority that Martin is "un-coachable". And "will not listen". "not a team player". Now you admit you don't know but it's your observations.

I'd say you wouldn't have a clue.

As for your comment he "has not improved in 5 years" - your observations are clearly worth nothing because anyone could see he held the ruck together last year when Jamar went down.

Stop drinking your own bathwater buddy.

Jnr some on here have contacts, it's obvious to many, & just because they cant divulge, doesn't mean they should just shut up & let those who are further removed, guess all the time.

I'm always interested in bits of Info that come from the side bleachers, & when you take the time to ponder them, rather than just immediately discard them in some kind of manic rush.

One could just reject a pearl amongst the shells.

Jumbo has always had strong Ideas about our rucks so,,,, I'd say I've never heard him say garbage. I mayy have disagreed with him from time to time, but thats just my opinion against his.

I suspect he knows a great deal about rucks & footy. Especially from an earlier time.

I am not sure if the famed Stef Martin breakout year was real or imaginary, maybe just another Melbourne supporters thing to hang onto.

He scored zero brownlow votes in 2010/2011.

For a really big guy he just doesn't know how to dish out physicallity, if he works hard he may be able to eke out a carreer like big Al, a hundred or so games over ten years.

Basketballer. Skilled Basketballer. Too skilled & too smart.

Jnr some on here have contacts, it's obvious to many, & just because they cant divulge, doesn't mean they should just shut up & let those who are further removed, guess all the time.

I'm always interested in bits of Info that come from the side bleachers, & when you take the time to ponder them, rather than just immediately discard them in some kind of manic rush.

One could just reject a pearl amongst the shells.

Jumbo has always had strong Ideas about our rucks so,,,, I'd say I've never heard him say garbage. I mayy have disagreed with him from time to time, but thats just my opinion against his.

I suspect he knows a great deal about rucks & footy. Especially from an earlier time.

Thanks dee-luded. The sad part is that jnrmac always contributes thoughtfully to this forum and we've always had healthy debates.

I'm quite close to some information and it would be remiss to divulge where this info came from.

But, regardless of this, as a lover of footy and this club, Neeld's message has been clear all year - unfortunately, as the 'buy - in' continues, Stef cannot commit to the discipline required.

Im 50/50 on Martin and Spencer...i woudln't be opposed to trade either for a Josh Caddy.

I see our Ruck future as Gawn and Fitzpatrick with Jamar as the experienced third option while these two develop.

Why? Mainly because Gawn is second in height only to Sandilands and will give us a huge edge in the middle.

Fitzpatrick is developing nicely and he can run and knows how to kick a goal.

With the Hun reporting that Tippett is pretty much on the way out of Adelaide would they be interested in making a play for Martin? If we felt as though we had cover and we could live without him we might be able to land something of value if he is in demand come the trade period. I still think the bloke has some real talent and he can play a role for us going forward but wouldn't be surprised to see him moved on.

I hope we are actually going for Cloke and Neeld was just playing games with the media. If we get Cloke then they'll want Martin even more and we can make them pay.

Imagine that- Carlton take their ex coach and we take their FF. Brilliant! Then we can bend them over in a trade for Martin.

Jnr some on here have contacts, it's obvious to many, & just because they cant divulge, doesn't mean they should just shut up & let those who are further removed, guess all the time.

I'm always interested in bits of Info that come from the side bleachers, & when you take the time to ponder them, rather than just immediately discard them in some kind of manic rush.

One could just reject a pearl amongst the shells.

Jumbo has always had strong Ideas about our rucks so,,,, I'd say I've never heard him say garbage. I mayy have disagreed with him from time to time, but thats just my opinion against his.

I suspect he knows a great deal about rucks & footy. Especially from an earlier time.

This is an opinion forum. And he has given his. However, he stated as if they were facts the shiite about Martin. When challenged he simply said it was his observations.

He wasn't protecting 'sources', wasn't asked in any case to reveal sources but simply his speculation. You can value it and that's fine.

I put zero weight on what he has said.

I think the eagles would be keen to have Wellingham, and he would see the benefit. Collingwood would like Stef Martin.

We should not be throwing in too much.

Maybe Martin to Pies, Wellingham to Eagles and pick 17 to Dees. With pick 17 I would see if we could get Ben Jacobs back from the Power. He is 20, and would be the perfect left footer quarterback/half back we need. Great skills. Would be a Grant Birchall type.

This is an opinion forum. And he has given his. However, he stated as if they were facts the shiite about Martin. When challenged he simply said it was his observations.

He wasn't protecting 'sources', wasn't asked in any case to reveal sources but simply his speculation. You can value it and that's fine.

I put zero weight on what he has said.

If Jumbo wanted to hide if he had 'connections', then he wouldn't elaborate even closely, that may lead in that direction, would he?

No, I take his assertions as Honest & from his former posts, he seems to have a Strong interest in the Rucks especially. I believe he knows what he's talking about, but that just my opinion.

Big Call to get rid of Martin....They better be sure..our back up big men have hardly impressed.

Big Call to get rid of Martin....They better be sure..our back up big men have hardly impressed.

Why is a big call, WYL? What have you seen in Martin to keep him on list?

Forget the Bailey era - that was junk time.

Edited September 15, 201212 yr by jumbo returns

Why is a big call, WYL? What have you seen in Martin to keep him on list?

Forget the Bailey era - that was junk time.

We kept White too long too IMO.

Good follower, particularly in his early days, but in his latter, He like the other Hollywood lane players just didn't do the heavy work & show the way.

This eroded further our soft culture.

We kept White too long too IMO.

Good follower, particularly in his early days, but in his latter, He like the other Hollywood lane players just didn't do the heavy work & show the way.

This eroded further our soft culture.

Well, yes and no - a couple of horrific injuries stalled Whitey (kicked in the face and the bleeding shin EVERY game) but the clincher was the line across the centre circle that negated his leap. I agree, wasn't a heavy body player.

Jamar got three years because he 'protects' space and plays a disciplined role.

Martin is value. But you've got to give something to get something.

Assuming the rumours are true of course...

One ruckman will go.

Yep .Martin has the skills and the technique to go off and play in a flag for another club now.

He's ready to go.

Next year or three we can watch Gawn and Spencer make mistakes while Stef kick arse somewhere else.

If Jumbo wanted to hide if he had 'connections', then he wouldn't elaborate even closely, that may lead in that direction, would he?

No, I take his assertions as Honest & from his former posts, he seems to have a Strong interest in the Rucks especially. I believe he knows what he's talking about, but that just my opinion.

Good for you.