Ralph has it pretty right, I reckon. Hard to disagree with any of it.

And the language he uses is pretty measured.

I think Artie Bucco is Dean Bailey.

Bailey must be some kind of supercoach, how did we win two and a half more games than Richmond last year. I mean with all their gun middle age players, what a joke. Dean Bailey and the club must be the best sales people in the world, still can not believe how many people are buying where a young list excuse. Even the club has stopped useing it since the pre season and so they should have. The average age of last years grand final winning side was 24.1, which is a young team and they won a flag. Clarkson and the Hawks won a flag in his fourth year as coach, lets all stop accepting mediocrity and demanding success. Dean Bailey is going to have to pull a rabbit out of a hat to be coaching the Dees in 2012 and beyond.

  On 23/05/2011 at 05:59, Artie Bucco said:

Nope, as I said, you have NFI.

Richmond also have a hole around this age bracket, but not half as bad as us.

They also went through a period of terrible drafting that just extended their earlier bottoming out period, which they are now experiencing the upswing from.

An asterisk denotes players drafted after normal draft-age, some due to being late-comers to the game, some doing the equivalent of an apprenticeship in the VFL.

>Players born in 85

MFC - (1) Colin Sylvia.

RFC - (1) Nathan Foley.

>Players born in 86

MFC (1) - Stef Martin*

RFC (2) - Daniel Jackson, Will Thursfield.

>Players born in 87

MFC (3) - Matthew Bate, Michael Newton, Lynden Dunn.

RFC (7) - Brett Deledio, Luke McGuane, Mitch Morton, Matthew White, Robin Nahas*, Angus Graham*, Tom Derrickx*

We'll even include 88 to give you more of an idea.

This where the spread of our players comes in - much younger than RFC.

>Players born in 88

MFC (8) - Clint Bartram, James Frawley, Colin Garland, Nathan Jones, Ricky Petterd, Liam Jurrah*, Rohan Bail*, Austin Wonaeamirri*

RFC (6) - Daniel Connors, Shane Edwards, Shaun Grigg, Bachar Houli, Jack Riewoldt, Jeromey Webberley*hat does that matter??

Fact is, they are more advanced in list maturity.

You make a good salesmen Artie. Lets even go back to 83/84 shall we?

MFC (6) - Joel MacDonald, Brent Moloney, Jared Rivers, Mark Jamar, Aaron Davey, Matthew Warnock.

RFC (3) - Jake King, Brad Miller, Kelvin Moore.

Weak point.

  On 23/05/2011 at 05:47, why you little said:

Which is why Bailey might get another contract...I thought he coached really well on saturday.

If Davey had pulled his weight we had a solid chance of winning that game.

Dean should not always take the heat for Lazy players.

And at the selection table, we have a more mature defence, with a more physical edge to it. That helps with a young team who make mistakes and soft turnovers. A strong defence helps the kids to take the game on, knowing If they F*^$up, the defence is reliable enough to absorb most of it.

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:06, Deeflated said:

You make a good salesmen Artie. Lets even go back to 83/84 shall we?

MFC (6) - Joel MacDonald, Brent Moloney, Jared Rivers, Mark Jamar, Aaron Davey, Matthew Warnock.

RFC (3) - Jake King, Brad Miller, Kelvin Moore.

Weak point.

Look, you're obviously stupid if you don't get why Richmond is better than us.

Brisbane is older than us too. That means Bailey is a better coach than Voss.

  On 23/05/2011 at 05:47, why you little said:

.....

If Davey had pulled his weight we had a solid chance of winning that game.

We should have won it; the saints are now a mediocre side.

  Quote

Dean should not always take the heat for Lazy players.

But he should when he keeps playing them.

  On 23/05/2011 at 07:45, Artie Bucco said:

It is pretty clear, but I'm not sure it's correct.

We've introduced more youth and inexperience to the 22, and while they have more talent, it will lead to inconsistency and some putrid results in the short-term.

Therefore, should Bailey be judged solely on wins this year?

Some of you on this forum need to consider the next phase of this football club's development. When 2007 ended the board needed to assign a man that could rebuild the list and bring in the right talent. For this I give Bailey a big tick. He is also excellent with the media and seems like a great bloke.

But what wasn't as important in 2007 was a game-day tactical coach who would bring out the best in the 22.

This is where I question Bailey as it stands in 2011. Who they appoint next year needs to be top-notch in this area if we are to move forward.

If you ask 2 former club champions they believe its up to Bailey to show us what he's got. Gary Lyon and Jim Stynes have both publically said this.

Oh and I think one of them is working for the club...

  On 22/05/2011 at 14:29, Striker475 said:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/melbourne-coach-dean-bailey-is-under-pressure/story-fn7si0bn-1226060646636

Funny, he says everything yet nothing. What a joke bit of inflammatory journalism. Not that I'm going to come out and defend DB, but that is one of the worst-written articles I have seen in a long time.

I'm sorry but a number of D fans I spoke to today commented that he was right on. Yes we have different opinions but those who have made their decision is significant. Get used to hearing it for the rest of the year.

Getting rid of Bailey won't change anything.

I pity whoever the next coach will be, he'll get eaten alive on here.

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:20, BattlerBailey said:

Getting rid of Bailey won't change anything.

I pity whoever the next coach will be, he'll get eaten alive on here.

Not so sure about that.

I think the last 2 games have shown that many of the players (not all) are showing endeavour; having a real crack. With a little luck, they would have beaten the saints (they won most of the key stats), but that's not saying much.

The team plays as if it has no leadership, and as if it is uncoached. Repeat: Uncoached (think chooks with their heads off).

Little has changed since the start of 2008, with the possible exception of the the last half of 2010 (when Wellman was the defensive coach).

Read my lips: leaderless, and uncoached.

I reckon there's plenty would like to have a go (at coaching MFC).

Ed: Corrcted spelling for Wellman

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:36, Mono said:

Little has changed since the start of 2008, with the possible exception of the the last half of 2010 (when Wellham was the defensive coach).

God that is a stupid thing to say, the bloke's name is WELLMAN and as if you have THE SLIGHTEST CLUE to be able to attribute Bailey's success purely to him, why do people just fabricate things purely from their imagination and state them as fact. Grrrrr

We should have won that game, if we hadnt anything like a full side in we would have, and even so we just needed to not have as many poor errors as we did. We ahve flogged sides by 15 and 16 goals this year and are a game out of the eigt. I honestly don't get why everyone is so pizzed off we are actually going OK. I am going to be bumping some threads when we get a big scalp soon and everyone is back kissing Dean's arse.

  On 23/05/2011 at 07:45, Artie Bucco said:

It is pretty clear, but I'm not sure it's correct.

We've introduced more youth and inexperience to the 22, and while they have more talent, it will lead to inconsistency and some putrid results in the short-term.

Therefore, should Bailey be judged solely on wins this year?

No, but where did I say that?

He should be judged on his ability to get us playing decent football. And his game day tactical coaching. Neither of which are at an acceptable level at the moment.

I want to see him become a better match day coach. His plans are predictable and ineffective.

Being young does not mean you have to be wildly inconsistent. That too is an area he needs to work on. We should not be 54 points down, then 96 points up, then 41 points down, with wavering and varying levels of effort, against three sides who are thereabouts (by that I mean not Collingwood, Geelong, Hawthorn, nor Port Adelaide, Gold Coast, or Brisbane). That's not good enough, and whilst you can go on as long as you want about youth, injuries and whatever else, there have been plenty of things in our control that have not been dealt with well enough.

I think Bailey is the right man for the job. I also think that the MFC is still playing catch up to the top teams in terms of coaching resources, development (of coaches) and augmenting the coaching team with what they need to succeed.

I hope that the review conducted over Summer into the Footy dept has shown the way forward. Too often the media and fans desire to blame someone focuses in on the coach, despite the blame being elsewhere.

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:54, Curry & Beer said:

God that is a stupid thing to say, the bloke's name is WELLMAN

you're correct, my mistake.

  Quote

and as if you have THE SLIGHTEST CLUE to be able to attribute Bailey's success purely to him, why do people just fabricate things purely from their imagination and state them as fact. Grrrrr

quite simply, I didn't.

  Quote

..............I am going to be bumping some threads when we get a big scalp soon and everyone is back kissing Dean's arse.

Don't hold your breath. But then again, and if, I invite you to be first: tongue out.

  On 23/05/2011 at 01:10, Gotzy15 said:

Can someone please explain to me why were all having a go at Jon Ralph??He is one of the very few footy journalists out there that actually does make some sense. If you all just calmed down and took the time to read his article again you will notice it is well constructed and there is nothing 'sensationalist' about it at all.He talks about the fact that Bailey has had 3.5 years to prove he can coach and time is running out which we all know.He mentions that even though weve been decimated by injuries that thats irrelevant and Bailey has to show inspiration and tactical innovation to keep his job. He then goes on to talk about how Bailey has been totally outcoached this year especially by teams implementing the forward presses. He then goes on to question whether weve actually improved at all this year and gives the only examples i can think of of players that actually have shown progression (excluding perhaps Jack Watts and Stefan Martin). Theres then a mention of our lack of leadership which is blatantly obvious and some comparisons drawn with a team that failed to improve from a promising 2009 in Essendon and their coach lost the supporters and ultimately his job which is an eerily similar scenario to what were potentially facing. I think its a very good article and it sums up exactly where were at!!Ease ofF Jon Ralph boys

Because the bloke is a peanut! Surely Rodney Eade's A hole is about to cave in yet you don't see John Ralph reporting on that! I think David Smorgon's line went something like a passmark is to make the GF. They just got fingered by WCE to the tune of 125 points! We are a team of young players still, we are at least a year behind in progression to the likes of Essendon and without continuity of playing together due to suspension or injury our progression will be diminished! We are on the same amount of wins to the same stage as last year. All he can say about Maloney is that he has been stripped of the VC, nothing about his position in the player of the year polling, and that him and Jamar(now injured)had the highest tap to receive ratio in the league! Or how Jordy Gysberts has been fantastic for us this year. Morton has been played this year and has done sweet FA! If Bailey gets ousted at the end the year so be it however if the coach that comes in gets our full list fit and a full pre season into them all then he will look like the messiah!

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:14, Choko said:

Look, you're obviously stupid if you don't get why Richmond is better than us.

Brisbane is older than us too. That means Bailey is a better coach than Voss.

You think Richmond SHOULD be better than us, and you think I'm stupid???

  On 23/05/2011 at 11:55, Deeflated said:

You think Richmond SHOULD be better than us, and you think I'm stupid???

Hasn't Richmond been rebuilding for like 18 years?

Did Wallace have a 5 year plan in place about 8 seasons ago?

  On 23/05/2011 at 10:36, Mono said:

Not so sure about that.

I think the last 2 games have shown that many of the players (not all) are showing endeavour; having a real crack. With a little luck, they would have beaten the saints (they won most of the key stats), but that's not saying much.

The team plays as if it has no leadership, and as if it is uncoached. Repeat: Uncoached (think chooks with their heads off).

Little has changed since the start of 2008, with the possible exception of the the last half of 2010 (when Wellham was the defensive coach).

Read my lips: leaderless, and uncoached.

I reckon there's plenty would like to have a go (at coaching MFC).

Agree with you Mono.

I reckon prospective coaches might be drooling at the prospect of getting their hands on our list and taking it to the next stage.

I'm holding out hope that Dean will show us he's a coach who is capable of having an impact over the course of a game. If he does, then perhaps we will claim a big scalp or two.

  On 23/05/2011 at 12:59, Jaded said:

Hasn't Richmond been rebuilding for like 18 years?

Did Wallace have a 5 year plan in place about 8 seasons ago?

Have a Tiger mate who says they've been rebuilding for 30 years...that's well and truly before us..

  On 23/05/2011 at 13:00, High Tower said:

Have a Tiger mate who says they've been rebuilding for 30 years...that's well and truly before us..

Chr!st...weve been trying for 47 !!!!

A few comments made by Gary tonight on footy classified, when asked about his decision not to appoint Hardwick over Bailey:

He commented that from Hardwicks presentation it was obvious that he needed another year before he was "ready to be a senior coach", and that Hardwick would admit that

Also said that he would never be involved with any future decision making processes for the next Melbourne coach(if and when we need one) when asked, he said that he had had his time etc, and that it was to draining considering you make such an important decision over a short period of time

Does it sound like he thinks he made a bad call over Bailey? and that he doesnt want to be responsible for another similar decision again? If we do need to assign another coach at years end it would be the most important coaching appointment in our clubs history, considering where we have been for so long and the list which has been developed thus far...

Sounds more and more like it will be the case at years end, in saying that i think Bailey can still hold on if he gets a few wins and the players show some passion and drive

A few wins being 9-10 or more

There was a bit to read between lines . Gary is always somewhat cryptic these days when commenting on Melbourne I feel. He noted thaty IF the Dees were to look at a new coach then they ought to be aseembling a panel NOW as its an arduous and time consuming process that ought tohappen over a LONGER period of time . I read into that that maybe it was , not so much rushed last time as much as they ought to take more effort THIS time....and look harder !! You sort of got the notion that maybe we didnt get the right man and lets not do that again.

He is impressed with Hardwick for sure...and probably wonders where it all went pear shaped for us.

I also got the idea there was a certain amount of "my bad " re Bailey there.and doesnt want to do that again.

But definitely the message was...get a selection panel together now..and start looking...all between the lines of course

  On 23/05/2011 at 00:42, Artie Bucco said:

I think we have shown desperation. Like RR said, on Saturday we showed it, except for a select few.

I'm not sure we need to see a change in tactics to account for lost players.

We seemed to cover ok, and were not convincingly beaten on Saturday.

Bailey coached well, restricting what the Saints were able to do, but at the end of the day, the bounce of the ball and the polish of their senior players pushed them ahead.

Conversely our inexperience and the presence of our 27th and 28th best players meant we made some poor decisions and skill execution errors - tactics were not the problem.

You do make your own luck, but only to a certain extent.

Bailey can't be held accountable for injuries, or supporters' short memories and impatience, leading them to ignore the fact we are still developing a list of very young players that have played very few games.

I'm not sure why anyone would expect improvement when more youth is being pushed into an already young team.

Other than ignorance.

Here here