Food for thought....

[rpfc 27,633]

From all of the media reports Bruce is most likely going to be on a single year contract with another club, along with a pay cut. This gets back to my original post. Boomer is happy to sign on, Bruce wasn't with us, but may with another club. Why? Is our FD not handling its dealings with our senior players as well as other clubs do theirs?

They are going to give him a second year trigger so hypothetically:

He could play the first 15 games and get 2012 automatically, then he could do his hammy be out for 5 come back and do it again ala Buckley (as per your previous example regarding Junior...).

So now, in this hypothetical situation, Hawthorn has $250/300k tied up in an injured 33 year old in 2012.

Is that what we would like to see at the Demons?

You get one year when you over 30 - why?

Because our talent derives from the 2007-2009 drafts.

30 year olds are 10 years older than our talent - why should we give them longer contracts?

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

I am still hoping Junior can be DB's runner next year (or one of them) that way he can still be a great leader.

Might even give a shephered Alistair Clarkson style.

5-6 weeks isn't unheard of. Grimes was gone for much longer than that.

It was a 1 week injury at first...a minor hamstring pull. It then went to 2 weeks then 3.....Oh Oh its out to six weeks. At 34, your body tells you...... Grimes injury was a full blown hanstring tear. It was far more serious than the one week niggle Junior had.

Fair comment rpfc on Bruce.

[e25 5]

I'm sorry but posts like this are just starting to do my head in. Aaaaaaaggggggghhhhhhhhhh.

There, that feels a bit better.

Hawthorn are desperate for a(nother) flag while they still have the Buddies etc. Our flag is some years down the track. Different situations so ... different needs and, suprise suprise, different approaches to contracts and list management.

In other words, just because Cam can get a contract with a second year trigger at another club, it doesn't mean that we handled the negotiations badly.

Phew.

Really good post... but I have a feeling some will still not get it.

It's hard when your judgement is clouded by emotion.

[Dappa Dan 2,188]

Interesting OP. Certainly.

The club, I imgaine, looks at every big call like the JMac and Bruce ones and considers the ramifications. They want to advertise themselves as a loyal club to any player that wishes to come here, which is a good reason to keep players who are a bit long in the tooth. But by the same tokenm they don't want to seem like a retirement home. Also... they set a theme with those big names you mention. The club makes a call and won't negotiate beyond the price they decide. It's a sound strategy. But it'll be interesting to see whether or not the end result will make us more desirable in the future... or perhaps less desirable in 5-10 years when we decline again.

[hoopla 418]

Interesting OP. Certainly.

The club, I imgaine, looks at every big call like the JMac and Bruce ones and considers the ramifications. They want to advertise themselves as a loyal club to any player that wishes to come here, which is a good reason to keep players who are a bit long in the tooth. But by the same tokenm they don't want to seem like a retirement home. Also... they set a theme with those big names you mention. The club makes a call and won't negotiate beyond the price they decide. It's a sound strategy. But it'll be interesting to see whether or not the end result will make us more desirable in the future... or perhaps less desirable in 5-10 years when we decline again.

Some years ago, I heard Kevin Sheedy say that the seeds for the Baby Bombers premiership in 1993 were sown in the last round of 1991 when Terry Daniher and Simon Madden were brought back into the team for farewell games.......................... why? ............ because the kids saw that they were playing for a club which had "heart".

Now this might be a bit extreme ..... and we might all say that any heart Essendon has every had is a pretty sick one ..... but it does make a point. The past does influence the future .. and intangibles do count

Ideally you want the majority of your once-favourite sons to leave on good terms .Clearly that is not always possible .... but that is not to say that you shouldn't work towards it. The fall-out with Junior may have been inevitable - but I'm not convinced that we couldn't have worked things through more amicably with Bruce - even if that meant helping him get to another club in return for a draft pick - anything lower than pick #52 would have been a plus.

Good management means no nasty surprises - and Bruce's departure at the eleventh hour ( leaving us with a 7th round rookie pick) - certainly was a nasty surprise

[rpfc 27,633]

Ideally you want the majority of your once-favourite sons to leave on good terms .Clearly that is not always possible .... but that is not to say that you shouldn't work towards it. The fall-out with Junior may have been inevitable - but I'm not convinced that we couldn't have worked things through more amicably with Bruce - even if that meant helping him get to another club in return for a draft pick - anything lower than pick #52 would have been a plus.

Getting back to Old's incredible question - what would you have said if we traded Bruce for pick 45?

What if we did that trade when he hadn't made up his mind yet?

What would the people think then about the way we treat our players?

Stop applying hindsight to decision - it is metaphysical impossibility, intellectual wankery, and a waste of time.

[old55 21,611]

I'm still feeling hungry ...

[Demon3 2,541]

Whatever it takes!

[hoopla 418]

Getting back to Old's incredible question - what would you have said if we traded Bruce for pick 45?

What if we did that trade when he hadn't made up his mind yet?

What would the people think then about the way we treat our players?

Stop applying hindsight to decision - it is metaphysical impossibility, intellectual wankery, and a waste of time.

Thank-you for your thoughtful contribution to the discussion.

I may not have been thrilled with pick 45 .... but the club would have been better off than it is now. I presume you would have been stoked !

[e25 5]

I would have been personally, but the supporter backlash would have been ten-fold.

Rfpc is on the right track.

[rpfc 27,633]

Thank-you for your thoughtful contribution to the discussion.

I may not have been thrilled with pick 45 .... but the club would have been better off than it is now. I presume you would have been stoked !

It is thoughtful...

I assume you are being sarcastic?

I would have wondered why we were trading a player against his will, out of thin air, for pointless return.

I would have preferred he stay, like the club.

But I am not about to apply what we know now to a decision during trade week that would have been incongruous and not understandable then.

[Nasher 33,166]

I may not have been thrilled with pick 45 .... but the club would have been better off than it is now. I presume you would have been stoked !

Yes, but the point is, we would not know what we know now, i.e. we would not have known that the alternative was Bruce walking. On face value it would appear that we traded Bruce for pick 45 (or whatever) for no reason whatsoever. The assumption would be that the alternative was signing him - nobody ever really assumes that a player is going to walk (heck, I certainly didn't, even with the massive delay in his dealings). So the great unwashed would not realise that that that was actually the best outcome even though it was. Those who are disappointed with this outcome would still have been disappointed with that one, and those who are pleased with this outcome would still be pleased with that one.

As rpfc says; it makes no sense apply 20-20 hindsight to these situations unless you're willing to discount the knowledge you already know.

[daisycutter 28,681]

Yes, but the point is, we would not know what we know now, i.e. we would not have known that the alternative was Bruce walking. On face value it would appear that we traded Bruce for pick 45 (or whatever) for no reason whatsoever. The assumption would be that the alternative was signing him - nobody ever really assumes that a player is going to walk (heck, I certainly didn't, even with the massive delay in his dealings). So the great unwashed would not realise that that that was actually the best outcome even though it was. Those who are disappointed with this outcome would still have been disappointed with that one, and those who are pleased with this outcome would still be pleased with that one.

As rpfc says; it makes no sense apply 20-20 hindsight to these situations unless you're willing to discount the knowledge you already know.

and all this self-flagellation, wasted emotions and histrionics is becoming very passe

its all done, we will never know all the true story and the nuances etc

bottom line is there is no great damage to our objectives and future

cam missed an opportunity to be a one-club player which in time i think he may regret. big deal.

I for one am sick of this topic, what else is there to say? Can we move on to drafting and other issues?

I suspect this plea will be ignored and the CB threads will continue to thrive for 1,000s of more posts

[rpfc 27,633]

and all this self-flagellation, wasted emotions and histrionics is becoming very passe

Yes, but it's very Melbourne...

[daisycutter 28,681]

Yes, but it's very Melbourne...

Touche!

Canberra on the other hand . . . . . . . . . . .

[rpfc 27,633]

Touche!

Canberra on the other hand . . . . . . . . . . .

I meant Melbourne Football Club.

And I don't live in Canberra, I live in a very northern Melbourne suburb...

[hoopla 418]

I meant Melbourne Football Club.

And I don't live in Canberra, I live in a very northern Melbourne suburb...

.... and I live in a slightly northern Melbourne suburb.

.... and I promise not to start a thread on the subject - Was Canberra a mistake?

[Rogue 585]

Yes, but it's very Melbourne...

Yeah, there are never any of those sorts of comments on other AFL fan forums..!

[daisycutter 28,681]

And I don't live in Canberra, I live in a very northern Melbourne suburb...

Bumbles would be very pleased to hear that

[bing181 8,208]

Good management means no nasty surprises - and Bruce's departure at the eleventh hour ( leaving us with a 7th round rookie pick) - certainly was a nasty surprise

You don't know that. Nor do I. For us, yes, a suprise. But for the club?

As for this trade talk, Cam was pretty well at the end of his contract. The chances of getting a (decent) trade would have been pretty slim given he could always do what he's just done. Walk.

[Sir Why You Little 34,818]

You don't know that. Nor do I. For us, yes, a suprise. But for the club?

As for this trade talk, Cam was pretty well at the end of his contract. The chances of getting a (decent) trade would have been pretty slim given he could always do what he's just done. Walk.

Bruce didn't go to China, i am guessing but i think the club had a fair idea what was going on. It just took a while to reach us.

[rpfc 27,633]

RE: Canberra

Get a girlfriend/boyfriend or you will hate the place.

RE: Rogue & Other Clubs Fans

Yes, but when there is a choice between inward navel gazing and handwringing and stubborn, arrogant defiance, Melbourne supporters love to go the first port of call.

I realise I am navel gazing, but it's the good type of self-reflection.

It's the kind that doesn't blame AFL conspiracies, our 'victim status', or our lot in life, for all the things we believe 'are being done to us.'

[daisycutter 28,681]

RE: Canberra

Get a girlfriend/boyfriend or you will hate the place.

RE: Rogue & Other Clubs Fans

Yes, but when there is a choice between inward navel gazing and handwringing and stubborn, arrogant defiance, Melbourne supporters love to go the first port of call.

I realise I am navel gazing, but it's the good type of self-reflection.

It's the kind that doesn't blame AFL conspiracies, our 'victim status', or our lot in life, for all the things we believe 'are being done to us.'

Oh dear, How maudlin. I feel I have walked over someone's grave.

But don't worry, I have consulted my medico friend.

There is a cure! You need a Premiership transplant within the next 5 years. He guarantees it will fix everything.

Now where did I put that bottle?