This is more crap. He has improved markedly below his knees, is showing great strength and dash through the middle and will become a real weapon for this club. Move on, stop pulling out these tied old lines about players it seems you aren't even watching.

Formulated opinions??

Yeah he's improved pretty much everything!

Dont forget he's 192cms an 90+ kgs..

Doesn't need to twist and turn that much. He just bullocks and hustles the ball forward, straight thru the lines.. doesn't [censored] around unless he has to.. brings others into the game..

Leadership material? -[censored] if Brad Millers in the L/ship group - anyone could be

Why would we be discussing Negs when there are so many Positives?

He'll be one of the great attacking wingmen for this footy club - (bar major injury ...) IMO

He is good in a straight line and he has quite reasonable pace - his acceleration is not great but once up to speed he is enough to be a handful. His bodysize is nice now too and he will draw defenders b/c he's a good kick at goal from set shot or on the run.

Average pace, nothing flash.

Formulated opinions??

Yeah he's improved pretty much everything!

Dont forget he's 192cms an 90+ kgs..

Doesn't need to twist and turn that much. He just bullocks and hustles the ball forward, straight thru the lines.. doesn't [censored] around unless he has to.. brings others into the game..

Leadership material? -[censored] if Brad Millers in the L/ship group - anyone could be

Why would we be discussing Negs when there are so many Positives?

He'll be one of the great attacking wingmen for this footy club - (bar major injury ...) IMO

Because he's not quick, I'd like to see him put on another 5 Kgs of muscle, whilst doing plenty of yoga & agility exercises. We'll need him to bust packs & tackles frequently.

Dee-luded, I'm trying to remember where I heard it, but I'm pretty sure that Bate was rated as fairly quick during training. That or I'm totally mistaken.

Dee-luded, I'm trying to remember where I heard it, but I'm pretty sure that Bate was rated as fairly quick during training. That or I'm totally mistaken.

I remember them touting him as having a level 15 beep test, but nothing to do with speed.

I thought beep tests demonstrated at least a bit of both - the emphasis on endurance but endurance at pace.

I thought beep tests demonstrated at least a bit of both - the emphasis on endurance but endurance at pace.

You're right.

The beeps get quicker until you reckon they are just having you on, and then you go over to the side and throw up...

Average pace, nothing flash.

see i disagree here...i have seen him speed away from his opponents a few times in the last couple of weeks...he is very underated in this regard.

the criticism comes from the fact that he is horrible when the ball hits the deck, he can't pick the thing up...he also has a horrible turning circle and his kicking (whilst he is a big long kick) takes too long to load up and he gets caught out with this, either being tackled, being forced to handball or getting his kick smothered. These are his negatives.

This assessment is pretty spot on. His defensive pressure isn't the greatest either, seems to overcommit on the tackle and get side-stepped too easily.

Love his workrate though, and his ability to drill a low ball into the leading forward (when he hits them flush). Add to that his marking ability and improved goal conversion this season and we have a pretty dangerous player on our hands. He seems to get better as the season gets older, and will only improve as our midfield gets stronger over the next couple years.

Bater's got great straight line speed, but his lateral movement and agility isn't the best.

Big call from Gaz, top 50? Not so sure, but i agree with those here that have said he is underrated by many Demonlanders. I rate him and was baffled by some of the scathing criticism he copped earlier in the year. Deserves a top 5 finish in the b&f this year IMO.

This assessment is pretty spot on. His defensive pressure isn't the greatest either, seems to overcommit on the tackle and get side-stepped too easily.

Love his workrate though, and his ability to drill a low ball into the leading forward (when he hits them flush). Add to that his marking ability and improved goal conversion this season and we have a pretty dangerous player on our hands. He seems to get better as the season gets older, and will only improve as our midfield gets stronger over the next couple years.

In the old parlance we called this getting sucked in and have notived at time he'll let up on a chase instead of corraling /going the player and smothering etc..i.e He..like a lot of players just lets the play continue.. and this when the opportunity to stop often exists.

He needs to improve this and then he'll be more the complete player

Bater's got great straight line speed, but his lateral movement and agility isn't the best.

Big call from Gaz, top 50? Not so sure, but i agree with those here that have said he is underrated by many Demonlanders. I rate him and was baffled by some of the scathing criticism he copped earlier in the year. Deserves a top 5 finish in the b&f this year IMO.

Easily Top 5 for the Bluey this year, possibly Top 3

The only thing I see that is stopping Bate from going from a good footballer to a very good footballer is that he only uses his right foot if he is forced to. It means that he will waste a second or two looking for a left foot option before he considers the right. I hope they work hard on his right this pre-season and the next to overcome this.

he is quick. and was rated in the top handful at the club in his early years. i dont know where the article is but you will be able to find it. search for articles mentioning bate the year we drafted him.

he will be a very good player, especially as we start to win more games will people start to take more notice.

The 'top 50' comment is a bit flattering but, as someone else said, I've been surprised by the flak Bate's received this season.

In addition to improving on some of the flaws others have raised, I'd like to see Bate hold his overhead marks when on a lead.

Forwards

KA-POW!

You're right.

The beeps get quicker until you reckon they are just having you on, and then you go over to the side and throw up...

It's an endurance test.

Obviously we're not interested in endurance of players while walking, and the time needed to reach their exhaustion point would be significant, so the pace increases as each level is reached.

Good call Gaz.

Not sure about top 50, but I feel he is severely underrated, especially by Demonlanders. Has really improved this year, and, in a good team, as Garry said, would be even better.

I mentioned in a thread somewhere a week or two ago, I thought that at the start of this season he looked very much underdone, that I wasn't sure how much of a pre-season he completed and that he looked a little top heavy. As the year has progressed he seems to have increased not only his endurance but importantly his speed. I agree with Rogue regarding his over head marking - improvement required/needed, but overall I am wrapped with the improvement in form and his taste for the footy.

Matthew Bate appears to be much leaner and 'cut' than he was back in Rounds 1-5.

the criticism comes from the fact that he is horrible when the ball hits the deck, he can't pick the thing up...he also has a horrible turning circle and his kicking (whilst he is a big long kick) takes too long to load up and he gets caught out with this, either being tackled, being forced to handball or getting his kick smothered. These are his negatives.

These were some of my criticisms very early on in the season. But for me, he hasn't put these to bed entirely, but he has improved in a lot of these aspects. Definitely getting caught alot less than he was and finding ways to avoid/get rid of the tackler, which is a sign of strength and improvement.

I noticed last week he's improved in this area... There were a few times last week, where he got the ball off the deck in one grab, when it was in dispute...

Yes, agree vanlo.

HT, you don't think he's in the top 50 in the comp though do you?

I think as supporters it's very easy to underestimate our own players.

The thing holding Bate back from being seriously recognised in that bracket is the performance of the team.

The top 50 is such a subjective thing, and is very much about the current form of players.

As an example, Birchall was in Sheahans top 50 earlier this year on the back of a flag with the Hawks, but Bate would have had a better season than him this year, so based on that, Bate's name in the top 50 doesn't look out of place.

Is Brett Deleidio a better player than Bate.........looks to be more talented, but Bate is a more valuable player to his team IMO.

Cameron Ling is well down on last years form as well, so Bate could take his spot this year as well!

As I stated earlier, it so subjective, but I don't think Gary was way off the mark in suggesting it at all.

Would he be in the first 50 players you'd select picking a side from scratch?

Even just in his position as a 3rd tallish/floating forward he's competing against the likes of Ryan O'Keefe, Robert Murphy and Steve Johnson.

Would he be in the first 50 players you'd select picking a side from scratch?

Even just in his position as a 3rd tallish/floating forward he's competing against the likes of Ryan O'Keefe, Robert Murphy and Steve Johnson.

No he wouldn't.

But with his output this year, he is quickly closing the gap on those very good players you mention.

27 goals, 26 assists, 113 marks, 70 I50s, 61 tackles, 333 disposals (124 contested), and 90% game time for a 22 year old in the worst team in the league is a great effort.

HT, you don't think he's in the top 50 in the comp though do you?

No, I don't think he is, but take note, IMO he's not far off. I think Garry may have been excited in what he saw of Matthew Bate in play a few times, so yeah I think it's just good acknowledgement of Matty's game. But what Garry did do effectively, he has highlighted the improvement in Bate. TBH I'm just as excited and I think there might be more scope or another level of his game to come.

Strange player.

Burst on the scene I thought he had all the upside in the world. Positives are long kicking outside 50 (which he would be top 50 in the league in). Marking, speed on a lead.

Downsides - poor agility, very poor in close. No right foot.

He is 22 now, but he's definitely showing more upside than downside. Only question remains, where does he play?