Lucifers Hero

You're so right! Voss, Malthouse and others all said how great our list was. And it did look good on paper. What no-one could see was the damage between the ears. Therein was the list problem.

Did anyone say they would? Posters here all saying they won't/shouldn't.

I just had a mischievous thought: The other eligible, Australian CAS listed judges are probably rugby fans. And, Cronulla went down but not Essendon, the club with buckets of money. While they would be as equally impartial as any AFL or EFC judge, I doubt it would sit comfortably in the AFL/EFC suspicious camps! Helps explain why they are trying for an 'off CAS list' judge

They may try for an Essendon supporting judge but I suspect Roy Masters will research any 'off CAS list' nominee. He may then casually mention their Essendon fanship in an article as he has with Justice Hayne. Unfair on the judge but it subtly lets WADA/CAS know the lay of the land should CAS be asked to add him to their list. That the defence are even looking at Australian, pro Ess 'off CAS list' judges looks desperate at best, incriminating at worst. Anyway, Essendon players should choose a judge from the CAS list as everyone else in the world does. If AFL et al had not been filled with so much hubris, foreseen a WADA appeal and understood how CAS works then they could have not involved a preferred judge in the earlier legal processes. Keep a card up their sleeve so to speak. They have themselves to blame for not having a favourite CAS listed judge being ineligble to sit the panel

Its hard to imagine that we run out of puff this early in the season. If so, heaven help us in July/August! In a club story on the paleo diet, I recall the carbs would be increased in season to give players that energy boost on game day. I'm guessing we don't have the balance right between protein/fat/carbs just yet. So lethargy sets in (should be towards the end of a game, not before the first bounce!). 'Tapering', young players getting tired or some/all players affected by the protein/fats/carbs balance, could be 20% of the lethargy/tiredness last Saturday but IMO 80% was a complete lack of effort!

This is a quote from the team article on mfc website: “We were really keen for Jack to go back to Casey and go and get his hands on the football and win some of his own footy, which he was able to do,” Mahoney said. Clearly Jack was dropped. Why Roos protrayed it as Jack 'dropping himself' is beyond me. Did the kid a disservice as it made him look weak. I'm glad he is back!

I found that really interesting as Roos and to some extent McCartney are doing similar. I guess it would also be a great benefit to Daniher to be involved with footy. Very happy that he is helping us rather than the mob out near the airport

James Hird gets a parking fine...a great laugh. Arrogant and defiant to the end!! Moral of the story: The good guys win!!

Roy Masters: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/essendon-bombers/australia-may-not-have-representative-at-cas-hearing-into-essendon-case-20150520-gh5tbz.html Some quotes ( in itallics): In a nutsell: - "Essendon may even struggle to find a non-conflicted Australian advocate to appear in the court and argue their defence." - Essendon are struggling to find a judge to be one of the three arbitors who will make the decision.The gall and hubris continues: "...In order to guarantee the presence of one AFL-minded person in a jurisdiction of European lawyers, legal sources claim Essendon have suggested a recently retired Australian High Court judge, Justice Ken Hayne, as their nominated judge on the three-person panel. Justice Hayne is an Essendon supporter and is hugely respected for his independence and clarity of thinking. However, he is not on the CAS list so they simply wanted him added ie change the CAS rule so they can an Essendon supporter on the panel!! -The venue is definitely in Switzerland: "CAS's Sydney office has been in contact with the Swiss registry in Lausanne asking whether the case would be held in Australia and the answer has been a definitive no". If only they had not been so cocky and confident of WADA not appealing to CAS they would have had more time to get their ducks in order. Now they are doing everything on the run. While WADA is looking very cool, calm and collected having nominated their defence counsel and their preferred panel member. Who looks inefficient and incompetent now. WADA are going after the AFL with all guns blazing!

Young knows what he is taking on as: '...no stranger to the case having previously advised ASADA throughout the investigations into suspected doping at the Bombers and Cronulla in the NRL, will prosecute the case against Essendon before the International Court of Arbitration for Sport...' He must be very confident of success otherwise why would he risk his reputation on some two-bit group down under.

BUMP. I despair! AFL may lower FA elibility to 5 or 6 years to 'fringe players' (ie not 'stars'). http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-flags-prospect-of-a-lessrestrictive-free-agency-system-20150520-gh5t69.html - Definition of fringe: # of games, salary position in the team - Receiving club gets the player for free. - Giving club gets zip in return! Effectively, development of that player is worth nothing! Players currently can virtually go to club of choice be they in or out of contract but at least a trade needs to occur, so I'm not a fan of the proposal. Feeling pessimistic atmo but the proposal just looks like a recipe for more pillage of lower clubs IMO.

This made me chuckle! The AFL et al must be getting desparate! This is the same Eddie that has been totally silent for the last 2 years! All of a sudden he is flying the flag (as none of the participants can be seen to publicly complain) The extent to which AFL et al treat the public like fools and WADA with contempt is beyond belief... ...as if everyone can't see thru this 'Eddie' charade!! The cynic in me wonders if Collingwood will get some favourable treatment down the track, in return for Eddie's support.

I thought of something similar ManDee. The practical reason (supposedly) for holding it in Australia is this is where the evidence, players, lawyers etc are vs the cost of going to Switzerland. -Of course, this is but a 'red herring' by AFL et al...they want all their current lawyers etc to have easy contact with the players' official CAS legal team eg David Grace can't represent players at CAS but he can give input to their legal team...easier if all the comings and goings are in Australia. - That 'red herring' is merely camouflage for the hope of a more lenient jurisdiction here... My thinking is: 1) register and undertake the appeal in Switzerland so all the argy bargy about introduction of evidence, subpoenas etc etc is sorted out in that legal jurisdiction. Legal teams for the players and WADA would attend the court. 2) to hear and receive evidence the 3 arbitors could do this by: coming to Australia for a few weeks, skype, video conferencing, email etc etc. 3) consideration/decision would happen in Switzerland. Looks lower cost and takes away the 'supposed' practical limitations of it being held in Australia. True independence is achieved.

1) I said there is no point of the AFL et al. chatting to him 2) I said that: maintain Australia's clean reputation. Not sure where you get the idea of two rules: many examples of footballers being banned eg Saad. Clean Australian sport of all types is Coates' interest, full stop! 3) I doubt they would even need to consult Coates to hold it Switzerland...blind freddy could see the need for it. If anything, he would have made a point of not being lobbied because he is Australian and needs to remain neutral in the eyes of the international community. 4) I hope not - that is just as bad as the AFL pulling the strings in the Tribunal hearing. This time the process needs to be squeaky clean. BTW, if as you have intimated during this saga, you somehow have more than general public knowledge of this, you should not be making such comments about Coates' sway in the ultimate outcome. I am sure you are wrong but it can still be damaging. Coates will be keenly interested but he will bend over backwards tomaintain his independence...I would go so far to say that if there was a meeting or a vote on any AFL related matter he may well absent himself or abstain.

Not only was the AFL bluff called when ASADA passed on the right of appeal to another AFL Tribunal, the AFL et al have been 'snookered' by WADA! The way I read it Swiss law will apply on the conduct of and evidence allowed in the case. The posturing and maneuvering will make interesting theatre. 'Checkmate' is how this saga will end!

Interesting that electronic News Ltd media 'journos' who are usually very outspoken have yet to place write and article re the Switzerland development. The Hird/EFC/AFL camp must be shell-shocked and are in a bunker somewhere...with lawyers of course to plot action to discredit the process or look for some other technicality to try and stop the on-coming sh.. storm. The said 'journos' must be waiting for them to come out of the bunker with the script and spin to put in their stories. What I like is that an aussie is head of President of CAS (John Coates) and he would be keen to see Australia's reputation for clean sport maintained. Not that he would be involved but I doubt the AFL et al will get anywhere if they try to use their sporting network buddies to have a chat to him.

I wouldn't put it past them bb, the article also includes Little's comment from last week: "It's early days but I would've thought it probably could be heard reasonably quickly unless the club decides to, in some way, drag the process out. And I can assure you that's not what we want," he said. He has deep pockets. However, All this thinly veiled provocation and the Hird family bleeting will not go down well with WADA!

a de c, I think the words are all ready: English: Comfortable Satisfaction Italian: Confortevole soddisfazione German: Komfortable Zufriedenheit French: Confortable Satisfaits No matter how it is pronounced they all say: GUILTY

Oops! Just noticed another line in the article I quoted in above post: "...CAS decisions are binding but there is an appeal possible to the Swiss Federal Tribunal on a very limited number of grounds which according the CAS website would be "a lack of jurisdiction, violation of elementary procedural rules (e.g. violation of the right to a fair hearing) or incompatibility with public policy". I wonder if the Hirds would have the gall to use the 'lack of jurisdiction' clause to appeal an adverse decision given they have labeled the CAS process as 'unconstitutional'!!

Update: http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/wada-wants-essendon-case-heard-in-switzerland-20150519-gh5ath.html Confirmation of intention to go to Switzerland. Some extracts from the article: ...It has also been interpreted as a provocative move by WADA to seek to move the matters as far as possible from the AFL environment.... ...Lawyers for the 34 current and former Essendon players will strongly object to the request... ...The question arises from the WADA application as to whether there is more power in the Swiss jurisdiction for witnesses to be compelled to testify... The last point will allow Charter, Aliva etc to be called without the influence of the EFC friends with bags of money getting to them. The vice is tightening. For the first time I feel confident Hird and Co will go down!!

Tim Watson has reported 'they' are preparing for the appeal to be heard in Switzerland! If it is it shows Hird/AFL/EFC how serious CAS are about having am unobstructed hearing. I'm guessing they are getting increasingly nervous.

Hard to see Viney come back to seniors before QB weekend. He has already missed 5 weeks with possibly 1 or 2 more. He will be really lacking match fitness - no footy/work serious runnning for 6 weeks so will he need to come back via VFL? Touch and go even for QB game I reckon.

Its a fair question but will it get fair treatment? Will it stay on topic? To me it just opens the gate for people in the media and DL to give their critique/rant of Jack (again) which to me is bordering on abuse. It just keeps Jack's name front and center for another week. Gee whiz...KB has just made it a discussion item on his radio show. Why hasn't the media picked on (say) Bryce Gibbs for the last 5 years - also a # 1 pick who has done little more than Jack (in a lot more games)? Answer: Jack's name gets discussion going so the media will use/abuse him for their own ends. Jack needs clear air to get back on track. He deserves that from eveyone. Perik could write his article later in the year but no, he writes it when the kid is at his lowest ebb. Since when do aussies condone kicking someone when they are down.

I saw it and decided not to post it because I have had enough of the media just finding new ways of writing negative sh.. about Jack. They use/abuse Jack to create headlines. Then DL goes into another anti-Jack frenzie. So I repost my post a few minutes ago from another DL thread: I was not happy how Roos portrayed Jack 'dropping himself' as it just turned up the heat especially from past coaches. Unheard of, they cried!! More negative Jack headlines resulted. Last night on footy shows it was really good to hear Wayne Carey, Luke Darcy and Garry Lyon speak in strong support of Jack 'dropping' himself. They said players are human, they should be cut some slack or untold psychological damage could occur. Furthermore they said: - If physically injured players are given time to recover with understanding and without fan-fare. - If emotionally challenged they should also be given time to recover with understanding and without fan-fare. In any other environment the frenzied media 'headline' grabbing criticism and berating would be considered abuse. I hope the Carey and Lyon comments are followed by the media to be more considered in their comments on players, not just Jack. Not suggesting a 'kid-glove' treatment - just everyday respect being shown when criticising. If the mainstream media changes its approach to Jack, hopefully it will rub off on the rest of the football public at games, on social media etc. Then we might get to see the real Jack! So if DL's are going to post here can they show some respect and consideration toward Jack as Carey, Darcy and Lyon have.

I was not happy how Roos portrayed Jack 'dropping himself' as it just turned up the heat especially from past coaches. Unheard of, they cried!! More negative Jack headlines resulted. Last night on footy shows it was really good to hear Wayne Carey, Luke Darcy and Garry Lyon speak in strong support of Jack 'dropping' himself. They said players are human, they should be cut some slack or untold psychological damage could occur. Furthermore they said: - If physically injured players are given time to recover with understanding and without fan-fare. - If emotionally challenged they should also be given time to recover with understanding and without fan-fare. In any other environment the frenzied media 'headline' grabbing criticism and berating would be considered abuse. I hope the Carey and Lyon comments are followed by the media to be more considered in their comments on players, not just Jack. Not suggesting a 'kid-glove' treatment - just everyday respect being shown when criticising. If the mainstream media changes its approach to Jack, hopefully it will rub off on the rest of the football public at games, on social media etc. Then we might get to see the real Jack!