Wells 11

I hope so. It definitely takes us out of the mind set of " just wait a few years for the highly rated kids to come on" and more in the mind set of "lets cut our losses and start again with a new tougher blueprint" Maybe its the best way to go....it sure didnt look like the first way was bearing fruit.

Without knowing the real inside info re why he's out of favour I think we have to back a new coach and the players he wants and doesn't. Having put Neeld in we cant be half arsed in our support. His risking big and putting a LOT of noses out of joint. While that may be a good thing it may also also be someone who's just not a good leader and is hard for people to follow. Time will tell. If he doesn't work the results will be catastrophic....or should I say simply a continuation of current catastrohpe. It is a disturbing thought though to think that if Moloney was playing for say an Essendon and was an available free agent we'd be mad about him wouldnt we? Won a B&F last year...19 brownlow votes. Big body, mature age...had trouble with a new coaching regime but so called clearance specialist. I just hope in our eagerness to cut off the "dead wood" that we are able unearth some real talent with players that don't seem to dislike the coach.

Somehow the whole tanking story has been turned into the "inquiry into Melbourne tanking" so whichever way this goes now we've been seriously tarred. Amazing really when you consider that went before us. The media witch hunt this year has been at least as hard to stomach as our on field performances. By way of contrast, if anyone didnt notice, WB lost 11 staright at the end of the year ... and almost no one even whispered their name. No one doubts their coach's credibility, his game plan, his relationships with his players ... or wonders about their "culture", their CEO or their brand. We're definitely the team everyone likes to dump on. I think the only thing thats going to shut everybody up or at least change the tenor of the stories coming at us is to start winning. I'm just not sure when that's ever going to happen!

........except this.

I havent read all this thread and this may have been said already but when we picked Jurrah...wasnt Rockliff training with us looking for a chance? Brisbane picked him after we passed but I think if there was no Jurrah we would have gone that way. Its definitely a torment being a dee in 2012 isnt it. I have a semi ridiculous theory that, after the Jurrah machete incident, the bone was pointed at us...black magic. How the FU$K else do you explain whats happened this year!

Feel like we've been on a starvation diet for "puff pieces" this year...bring it on! It was a satisfying read. And, Im embarassed to admit, that even this soon after the season from hell is over Im willing to enetertain slight hope for 2013. Even though Ive have been doing that every year since 1971! Either I never learn or Im a tortured fan. Now...if we if could only just strap Jonesy onto Delsanto and Watts onto Cloke...and...etc.

yep...make or break for him I think. If we produce the same kind of football in 2013 and finish up with 3 or 4 wins again I think we can safely say that the 3 year contract wont make it past 2. I WANT him to succeed but the signs so far are just really hard to read. I think this is has been the longest and hardest supporting season in memory. At 3/4 time round 1 I pretty much knew what was going to happen for the rest of the year and, barring the Essendon game and Mitch Clark, there wasnt much to lift the spirits.

Re your description of Neeld. Looking at him, particularily in the weekly segment with Robbo you could be right. I guess the question for me is,as the head coach, could that be a commanding or an undermining attribute? We dont expect a Lyon or a Malthouse to be "loved" but to create tight standards. In a losing season everything looks black but, from what you know, are the players not "with" him?

yep. Thats the truth....but I need to postulate, because I back them financially and emotionally want the dees back in it! My suspicion is that the issues lay in a few areas. Bottoming out at the same time we were going broke. Coach unsupported by enough FD staff and finances. Clearing out previous solid leaders. Clash between Bailey and CS. Scully drama running on. 4 week long drinking holiday in China that may have condoned a certain type of behavour. I think its pointless just pointing at the players or Greens leadership or CS or Bailey. We're all just looking for a single scapegoat and an easy answer when it may have been all combining to make a big toxic stew....a stew that was hidden by some big wins over crap teams, Stynes illness and the afterglow of the debt reduction. I just HOPE with Neeld and Criag and Rawlings that there's enough experience, and they're given enough backing to turn this all around. Ive said it before but I have to repeat...I got worried when we cancelled our high altitude training program this year and instead decided to go to darwin this pre season. I hope its not history repeating.

Someone is going to be willing, and will magically find a way, to do that Robbie F. Most likely Carlton and, amazingly with Judd and Murphy, some twisted economics and brown visy cardboard boxes ( or bags) it will get done. It made me nervous re cloke because of our financial state I have to admit, but at the same time it pains me that Carlton are a club that do that kind of stuff and we're just not. EIther not yet or not ever.

Im sure its been discussed somewhere else....but Tippet would be an enormous pick up. Apparantly he wants to go back to the gold coast, but Mitch wanted to go back to WA also. Personally Id rather have him for less dough and with less of the media bullsh$t than Cloke. Are we any kind of chance in this?

Its a gloomy prediction and one I dont think is accurate North has less members and less money but I think there after more than respectability this year.... and in the next few years.

Interesting to hear them talking about this tonight on FC. Thomas suggesting Freo will try and manipulate the result with the Dees to get the home final and Gary agreeing. Its my hunch that no one will point at a Freo tank if they lose.

Yes they did. But not being able to afford a decent FD to bring those kids into also really hurt. Two big errors. We did exactly what Richmond did before us except worse. They still got Cotchin and Deledio from their botched drafts. ALL clubs could make a list like this, so its not like we're alone. But for mine what makes it painful reading is that we really dont have ANY real stars in our team. Nadda. The other team ( the life we COULD have lived lol) had at least 10. If we even had 2 or 3..... Anyway lets hope you're not writing this again a few years on from this draft.

Thats also true...and I hope you're right. Something about this looooong season has me anticipating the worst.

Something to think about. If Hawthorn beat WC on Friday eve (probable) and if Coll beat Essendon ( V probable) it may pan out better for Freo to lose on Sat eve against us , finish 8th, and play a home final against WC. After the season from hell that would just about put the final nail in it for me. Between the beatings on the field and the beatings off it, we beat freo in the last game (when they're trying to lose) and give up both the better draft picks and Viney as a 2nd rounder. Would that create a "winning culture" for the future? Tell me Im being paranoid.

If we DO accept this for a moment....and Im torn between this thought and mighty demons post. Whats the optimum treatment? Would playing make it worse or merely just make it harder to play? I'd find it hard to believe they were risking his long term value to the club by playing him in a year when we sucked the big one. Can he recover over a summer?

Oh come on folks. Most people, not wearing serious red and blue goggles, would say we blew it. Nait is an out an out gun . G.U.N. I dont feel too bad as Im not unhappy happy with Watts (as a work in progress) ....but man, give me Nait any day of the week. Do we really have to keep picking open this scar? I console myself with the thought that he may not have wanted to stay in Victoria and Imagine the riots if we had 2 number ones walk out! If I go with THAT scanario then I choose Watts.

Definitely must keep, he's been one of the few that seemed to have gotten better this year! We may be [censored] off that he's been inconsistent over the years and that its cost us, but THIS year, when he's been back, he's has probably been his most consistent yet. Im not sure why, in a team bereft of experience, people want him gone now. Maybe its hard to believe in him now? I could argue that having a tiny, low spending, crap FD, hurt sylvia more than most over the years. Maybe he's one that really needed and responds to the external drive, focus, attention of a professional mutli coached FD?

Great post....but as point six is about the only thing I can think of to be positive about I want to focus on that.

Worst game Ive ever seen him play ....and Im big fan. Maybe Walker is THAT good? or Frawleys injured? If neither then he's seriously got some work to do. Ive never seen him make a fool of himself before...he's usually the only one that doesnt. sigh.

As bizarre and painful as its been, we had a big win here didn't we. In all the gloom of this year the footy gods may have turned our way. Imagine ( and no disrespect to an improving and hopefully great Jack Watts) but imagine the pain if we had 2 underachieving number one picks hanging around and the type of crap we'd be getting about that.

For mine, its not so much about the fact that he actually left. Ward, Ablett, Harbrow etc all did the same.....and if someone dangled 6 mill in front of me Id find it hard to say no to as well. So, I don't blame him for taking the money and going.... as tough as it was to lose a no 1 pick. Its the system etc etc. we got compensated well. What I really do still feel [censored] about is the WAY he left. Its not even the "He lied to Jim" thing...although that sucks too. But by what he said and inferred (and by what he DIDNT say and thereby allowed to be inferred) was that he left because of our "culture", because we sacked Bailey, because he didn't believe we would ever be successful etc. None of the other teams that lost players got tarred that way...we did because of how he ( read his management team) handled it. All he had to do was say the money was irresistible, sorry everyone Im out of here. MFC great place...hard to leave..part of my heart etc. Instead of that, he tried to protect his arse, make himself look like a golden uber professional and make the club look like it sucked. Thats the road he chose and the pain he left behind him and why its left an ongoingly sour taste. I think we did well out of the trade but the slur he left hurt us.

Good summary....and yes "bewildering" is also a good description of the amount of NGE on that list. But I do think that "not good enough" tag on Jetta, Nicholson and Bail is still premature and put on Jamar (former AA) and Davey is just plain wrong. Not sure about where to put Dunn.

Thats a massive admission. I havent bought the book yet but what was the reason they did that? Not that it matters so much I guess.