Little Goffy

How much difference does a year make? In 2008, players with ten games or less experience at the start of the year played a combined total of more than 150 games for Melbourne. That's one in every three players on the ground each week having less than half a season to their name at AFL level. Here's the list - Morton Wonaeamirri Garland Buckley Martin Warnock Maric Valenti Frawley Newton Plus Bode and Weetra who have since been delisted, and I didn't include Grimes in the main list as he only played the one game, similar deal with Petterd. There was a fair pile of guys in the under 50 games category too - hell, by that point we seem to be expecting them to be core players or something - Jones, Dunn, Bate, Bartram, Bell, Johnson. There's an awful lot of development to look forward to there.

Valenti could be the next James McDonald. Or could be the equivalent of that at VFL level. Having a guy with his attitude around is certainly doing no harm, and if he improves just a little then he deserves a spot on an AFL list. Remember at the moment he's on the rookie list, which makes him ridiculously good value for both the money and the 'space'. And again, I'm gonna pull people up on the 'not win premierships with this guy in our team'. It's my personal pet hate, that line. Quite a few orindary players have got premiership medallions because they filled a need at a basic level in a team with numerous other strengths. Let's start with Steven Armstrong and figure it out from there - Delsited by Demons. Rookie listed and then played by Eagles to fill an entirely vacant small forward role. Wins premiership, makes a good contribution over that season. Delisted at the end of the next season. Next.

I've just finished a look thorugh the fire news from today and my head is spinning a little. Would it be possible to do a mini-community camp later, perhaps during the gap between NAB cup and round 1, in one of these places. Anything to cheer those communities up and let them know they wont be ingnored, and hopefully mobilise a bit of extra practical support in the form of donations. Maybe we can even get a small contingent of people up there to help with the clean-up. Horrible thing to have to do alone, coming back to a burnt-out property and shovelling the ruins into a hopper. I reckon I'd be up for making the trip, if there was some kind of central organisation getting together temporary accomodation (i.e. City of Casey and MFC).

Did I say red then? It looks kind of pinkish, next to the grey.

I'm a little over the age bracket, and I got my word in ad the first summit, but my thoughts that might be useful are - Number 1 Discounted group tickets for under 25s - the bigger the group the better the discount. A group of 'rowdy youths' are always going to have more fun at a game than just a handful, and a group also makes it easier to have fun even if the game goes to $%#$. Also encourages people to invite others along, and makes it cheaper for people who have pretty tight cash flows. Could even get a 'group youth membership' going, similar to a family membership except a bunch of friends can sign up together for X number of admissions over a season which they can use in big chunks (like ten at one game). Number 2 Events where you actually get to DO something. Quad bikes, windsurfing, battle of the bands, hip-hop classes, hire out the indoor rock climbing place in the city, anything. We get to say we're promoting active healthy lifestyles, and the people who go actually get to have fun. Working with venues and tying it in with a promotion, the club could actually get young members and their friends cheaper access to things that might not be worth the money for thm normally.

It's creepy how much people are willing to slash eachother's throats sometimes. I guess it feels odd to just post a message saying 'I'm really tense about the sponsorship', then add either 'especially since I don't have much confidence in the new board' or 'but I'm confident that the new board will come through'. But those three phrases pretty much cover the whole thread, bar the shouting. I'm with option B there, for the record.

Oh no, I really don't think you would. Frankly, I can't even see much that makes it look like Demon's merchandise, as opposed to random red, grey and blue horizontal stripes... Reminds me a little of the horrible rugby union polo tops you see sometimes. I'll just be buying the simple dark blue witha bit of red ones, thanks.

I think Ron Barassi is a handy person to have around, asseting the primacy of football and the club over business. I don't think anyone here would disagree that the business element is only pursued as a necessary step for maintaining the club element. Ideally, the Demons would be like the old duck on the pond analogy - calm and graceful footy club as far as anyone can see, but paddling like hell underneath. As for the derision directed at someone asking a question - are you kidding me? Who does that, who thinks it helps anything to sneer at teammates? People have a right to be angry about the off-field consequences of playing so many sunday games, playing only one other bottom 8 team in Melbourne in the first half of the season, and playing the lowest-drawing possible combination of opponents at home games over the season. Never mind if they express it through unrealistic counter-claims, who boos fellow members? That kind of thing gets you punched in the head and kicked in the balls. No, wait, wrong thread.

It's staggering that the club somehow didn't know about this amazing new European sponsor which the CEO declared as his 'mission critical'. You'd think that for $1,000 a day he could write a damn memo. Feels a bit like he had a whole house of cards fantasy - In his mind he had already recruited Brown, and had already convinced the sponsors to sign on, since we were going to have this superstar of the game with us. And now to undermine the club on the day of the AGM, obviously trying to stir up trouble amongst supporters... There's some serious ego going on there. Imagine the damage he'd be doing if he was still at the club. We sure as #$#@ wouldn't have gotten Brown, and in the meantime we'd still have Carroll, and maybe would have lost Green as salary cap space was opened up to try to lure the imaginary Brown.

Can I also throw in - I think it is absolutely awesome that the whole town of Yuendumu has shifted to the Demons on account of Jurrah's recruitment. Would anyone else here be interested in sending them some kind of 'welcome to the club' present? It mentions in the article that Jurrah hadn't been on a treadmill before he came to Victoria - maybe we could all put in a send them some training gear like tackle bags, and of course a whole pile of footballs. Who's interested and what do you think would be a good welcome present?

Dammit. Another sensible, informed and friendly Collingwood supporter. Where are they all coming from? I haven't heard Eddie gloating about how other clubs will have to relcoate much lately... that stuff is now Kennett and Hawthorn's territory. I haven't heard a whole lot of 'Collingwood are going to win everything because we're the best no matter what' lately either... that's Carlton now for sure. As is 'let's play unscrupulous off-field games even if it undermines the integrity of the sport'... Carlton have that down firmly. But this has tipped it, this support for Liam Jurrah as if his time in the Collingwood 2's was his local, junior club, and now all these Pies fans are just thrilled to see him get a go at AFL level. I... I... don't hate Collingwood. I'm going to have to revise my position to 'enthusiastic rivalry and cheerful ribbing'.

I'm hoping he turns into a David Neitz. If we're hoping, we might as well hope big.

Yep, if I were laying a bet for Rising Star, Jack Grimes would be my first choice from Melbourne. Very keen to get a decent look at him playing at AFL level - videos, comments, training reports even a paragraph here and there in books (The Draft) and just one game of AFL where he seemed poised but wasn't going to do much as still unfit and in a team getting thrashed - it's just not enough to go on. But I will take a moment to recall that first half-a-game 'just easing back in' with Sandringham Ressies, where he got something like 30 touches in a half. Ahh..

You'd hope they'd have something to announce by the AGM / information night, otherwise the mood could be very unpleasant. If they do announce that night, and keep a bar open at the 'G, they'll make thousands just out of people buying celebration drinks.

All up, your choices and reasons are pretty fair. I think we all need to just get over the fact that Cameron Bruce will never be in Yze_Magic's best 22. I'm going to to with a pretty conservative 22, with the proviso that I think it might be different by the end of the year - I'll not the differences after. F: Wonaeamirri Robertson Miller HF: Davey Bate Sylvia C: Morton Bruce Green HB: Buckley Garland Wheatley B: Whelan Warnock Rivers Foll: Jamar Mclean McDonald Inter: Johnson Jones Moloney Dunn Emerg: Petterd, Bell, Bartram, Maric, Martin, Newton You'll notice that at this point there are no first-year draftees on the list, and I've started the season with all of Robertson, Rivers and Moloney available. The unpopular Jamar is still our only true ruck (because Johnson can do so much more around the ground). Jamar will fill ruck for most of game time, with rests as a goalsquare gorilla. Changes over the year I think could include - Wheatley to be replaced gradually replaced on the HBF by one of Petterd, Grimes or Strauss, but to remain as a depth player. Warnock will be continuously competing for a spot with Frawley and Martin. Garland and possibly (here's a predicition) Rivers may both spend time swung up to the forwards. But both, and Rivers in particular, will remain defenders as their main task. These moves will open space for an extra person in the three-way tussle for a defender slot. Watts will play a handful of games this year, be excellent, and still be eligible to win the rising star next year For what it's worth, my 'big step up' list for 2009 includes - Mclean Davey Wonaeamirri Sylvia Jones Johnson Bate Buckley Then of course there's the young kids from the last few drafts and the new kids from 09, and the injury returns like Robertson, Rivers, Moloney, and to be fair Bartram. I actually expect substantial improvement this year, nothing spectacular, but a little more than anyone would credit us for.

Chris Johnson, Nathan Carroll. Two pieces of evidence that under this coaching panel, if your try to yank us around we'll just stick you. We we're prepared to make a payout for the sake of getting Carroll out, and we didn't cave on Johnsons arrogant expectations. Brad Green getting three years instead of two was fought right down to half-way through trade week. And it's not like he's been inconsistent, or was asking for lots of money. The only reasons for that fight was fear of an Yze-style decline. But the difference is, Brad Green isn't a [censored].

Excellent. The club is serious about getting the kids in. First the membership pack comes out covered in pictures of kids having fun at the footy, and now this. I wonder if this was an idea raised at the Demon Summit - it's got that simple-but-effective element which was common to a lo of the things people suggested. Anyone else getting the feeling we're actively building relationships with all the Melbourne 'Icons'? We've already held the Captaincy announcement at the Observation Wheel thingy. Next up, Melbourne Zoo, Melbourne Aquarium, maybe the Arts Centre. Small steps. But then, all of a sudden we can make a legitimate claim to being the Melbourne Football Club in more than just name (and get in on some tasty tourism promotion dollars which also get our name out there globally).

Devoted Demon, you're observation that there's a lot of people a bit edgy at the moment is true, especially when it comes to the board. It's shame, but there have been a couple of boards now that have left the fans feeling betrayed, and I think there's a lingering sense for a lot of people that the various boards have been significantly responsible for the crisis we're in. Consider - there was the 'non-merger' with Hawtorn, where a lot of people were angry and a lot of people felt like the numbers had been stacked (people not able to get in to the meeting) to get the vote in favour of the merger at the special general meeting. - then there was the 'saviour' Gutnick, who bailed the club out to an extent, but was then a very abrasive and intrusive president which it turned out also had a somewhat unscrupulous edge that, in the final count, cost us Matthew Pavlich at pick four in the 1999 draft. - Gabriel Szondy, as CEO in the early 2000s, can be fairly held accountable for a couple of million dollars in losses, according to many. - finally, the Garnder as president and Steve Harris as CEO period... always just barely ok, never any major progress. Under, and by many reckonings because of, Harris, there was a huge turnover of staff and steadily degenerating morale among the staff at the club. Then there were the 'Team Melbourne' and 'China Strategy' initiatives, both of qhich were put forward loudly but then not followed through on properly. After three years of profits of about three dollars and fifty cents, Harris was sacked (and paid out $250,000), MacNamee recruited, then the whole Garnder board got 'pushed out', MacNamee was sacked, and the club left with a multi-million dollar loss to deal with that seemed to come out of nowhere - there was nothing in the previous few year's reports to suggest a financial slump was on the cards. So you see, the fans have been kept in the dark for a long time, the club administration is widely seen as the core problem for the Demons, rather than a solution, and people are worn out from always trying to be upbeat everytime there's a change or a new half-baked initiative. I know I felt burnt a number of times, when I'd put by heart behind some new initiative, saying 'this will be the beginnings of a turnaround'... only to be disspointed again. Right now everyone is nervous about the major sponsor - and we have no good information on what the situation is. Until that is sorted out, we're still all tense as hell - this club can still die. So, while I personally think the club is going in the right direction now, it's worth acknowledging that people are entitled to be really, really edgy. Welcome to the club, Devoted Demon, it's gonna be an interesting ride.

It seems odd to suggest that MacNamee was CEO under more difficult circumstances than Schwab, or that Schwab has not achived much in his time. There are a number of administrative issues which we simply can't say how well they might have gone under MacNamee, for instance - - the negotiations with the AFL/MCC to secure $2mil in support - the significant cuts to expenditure set in place for next year - the final deal with Casey (though due recognition to Gardiner for setting this in motion) - the successful delisting of Nathan Carroll - would he still be on our list? - the Demon Summit and the beginnings of a new level of contact with supporters. The two publicly raised negatives regarding MacNamee, the holiday during a crisis and the somewhat absurd focus on recruiting Jonathan Brown, don't paint a great picture, though they are obviously somewhat stage-managed bits of information release. I think the issue of more substance is the fact that Schwab has only been the CEO for less than one month longer than MacNamee, but in the relatively similar timeframes MacNamee's only action of note was the 'kick on the 'G' after a game, which appeard to boost crowd numbers by a couple of thousand for one game. September, October, November, December, half of January. That's all Schwab has had so far. The only thing missing, and I'll keep saying it, is the major sponsor. Hands up anyone who reckons securing a major sponsor during a global financial crisis when the club is bottom of the ladder with a likely couple of years more of 'developing' is an easy run. Anyone want to do all the above things at the same time? I hate having to sound like I'm a 'Cameron Schwab apologist', but it becomes necessary when people are ready to turn on the club's leadership the moment things aren't going well. If there hadn't been the change in the board and executive, we'd be a dead club walking.

Here's an interesting twist, just a little extra note here from The Age - "As part of the joint venture with the Bulldogs the club's new training and learning facilities at Whitten Oval will be known as the Mission Elite Learning Centre." I think we can safely say we've identified the clincher for that sponsorship. Naming rights to a major western suburbs sports complex, I gotta admit, I'm a little less impressed by the $1.5million number. Still, good for doggies, and we've still got [secret awesome sponsor] to come.

I guess the reason we get so excited by good young players is that there is always a chance they will take a big step up and become stars, while the older players will probably just carry on, maybe make incremental improvement. Would it be fair to say that a 'champion / elite / whatever you call it' player is one who is consistently in the picture for honours like All-australian selection, year in year out? By that measure, it has been a while since we've had someone at that level - a fair few players at the next step down who might be considered for All-Australian in a good year (for example Neitz, Robertson, White, Yze, McDonald, Woewodin, Johnstone, Davey, Bruce) but nobody who has been so good for so many years in a row that they have become a 'keep your eye on' kind of player. Not since guys like Stynes, Lyon, and of course Flower. But, in the decade that I've been a close follower, I've never felt it was more likely that we'd have a couple of real stars come through. Except, possibly, for a few days just after the 2000 Preliminary final win. Gotta love that 1999 draft. Two in a row of that quality and we would have been a superpower instead of a finals also-ran from 2002-2006. But alas, we all know how the 2000 and 2001 drafts went. POO. In perspective, we've had five years or so of reasonably good drafting, heavily over-represented in the Rising Star award ever since Rivers and Davey came first and second in 2004. We've had at least two players nominated every year since then. If the 07-08 drafts deliver on their promise, we'll really be cooking.

Don't the Demons still have a minor sponsorship deal with 'Just Fruit'? They supply boxes of fruit to offices and things like that - I was udner the impression that they were going to be a handy part of the kids programs in Casey, I know the school groups which toured the stands were given fruit for a snack, I asume something like that will carry on.

Guys, I thought we already established that this is not a dating site.

A friend of mine has a car with a giant scorpion painted on the hood, and the gearstick head has a scorpion embedded in glass inside it. They only got it because it was cheap and it goes, but maybe we can raffle it? Looking forward to developing a love-hate relationship with the Scorpion's stars who will off course be "a great player and I have nothing but respect for him but he's stopping x from getting a chance to develop". It's gonna be fun having both teams developing young squads at the same time. And it's just fantastic to see Nathan Brown back close to the club.

Uhhh... major jump in memberships... major improvement in relations with AFL and MCC major improvement in engagement with suporters (e.g. Demon Summit) substanital increase in positive media coverage (e.g. Martin Flanagan is going to be running a series of special articles on the Demon fightback over next year, and even Caroline Wilson has had positve things to say about us) highly energetic engagement with City of Casey In fact, at this point the only thing that hasn't gone exceptionally well is the major sponsor. When that sponsorship clicks in, this board and executive team will be able to turn around and say it's the most effective administration we've had in at least half a century. Don't forget there are a finite number of hours even in Schwab and Stynes days. Running Debt Demolition, negotiating the MCC/AFL arrangements, (these two items represent $5million we WOULD NOT HAVE if Gardiner/MacNamee were still in place) confirming and completing the Casey deal, processing the summit and just getting an overall handle on the place is a pretty good effort for half a year. So you might not want to spit your bile at them just yet.