KozzyCan

Lol if you think Clarkson and Cameron weren't tapped on the shoulder then I have a bridge to sell you.

Collingwood won a flag two years after sacking Buckley. If any of Gold Coast, Hawthorn or Giants win the flag this year they will be doing so under a relatively new coach. Regardless I'm not even thinking about premierships right now. The club is in freefall

He really has no answers. Decided to go with a smaller forwardline but changed nothing else so now we're just completely undersized and making the bombers defence look amazing. The Bombers! They havent been able to defend for 15 years.

Just call it Goody. There's no coming back from this.

Dons will roll us and give their fans some false hope.

Agree, we've been very lucky. It almost happened again with Jackson too. Unfortunately, we haven't had a proper key forward since Neitz. (Not including having a baby Hogan for two and a half years.)

It makes me think there is a bit of a disconnect between the recruitment and the coaching.

Yeah well that's kind of my point. All these guys cost us absolutely nothing. So don't worry about it and just keep an eye on the rucks who are playing well in the VFL and pick one up for like pick 40 or something. Most rucks are just tall limited workhorses who do the gruntwork and that's really all you need.

I'm not really concerned about a ruckman. Most teams just trade in a random 25 year old who can do the job when they need one. Geelong have gotten away without having a proper ruckman since Ottens. Having a great ruckman is a bonus but not worth spending a lot of currency on. We're never going to find someone who can fill Gawn's shoes so we shouldn't get hung up chasing the dragon. Our priorities should be Key forwards, small forwards and key backs. All far more important positions in modern footy than the ruck.

Clarkson obviously had a golden era with Hawthorn, got moved on during their rebuild. Will be interesting to see if he's still got what it takes with North.

Interesting we're going in with a smaller forwardline. Not sure I've ever seen Goodwin go with this setup but it also makes me wonder if he actually has any idea how to fix our forward entries or if he's just throwing [censored] at the wall to see what sticks. A small forwardline means that bombing the ball in long as we like to do is useless as it will be picked off all day, but a mosquito fleet set up requires a lot of gut running and fast ball movement which we also look afraid of doing.

Scott is easily one of if not the best coach in the competition and measurably better than Goodwin. He's missed two finals series in 15 years, made 8 prelims, 3 grand finals and won two flags and holds a 70% win rate.

Being 2m tall goes a long way in this game.

Cats players have openly spoken about meeting Oliver during the trade period, he also has had several years of off-field issues that have not helped his position. Playing okay at the moment but still nowhere near his best. Petracca the same, he tested the market last year and we essentially had radio silence from him for weeks. He's back in the fold but I'm hardly convinced he's 100% committed to this team. I get that your position on these things is essentially that until a player has left or openly stated their intentions it's a big nothing to see here. But I think these off-field episodes have left a visible disunity in the team. A big part of a coaches job is to manage the egos of their players and I think both Petracca and Oliver have been allowed to do a lot more than what would be accepted of other players. Both have had issues around them that I don't believe have been managed well and that mismanagement has exaccerbated a bad situation. Goodwin has boasted that over the off-season some heart-to-heart conversations have given the club clear air but I'm not convinced. The players look less unified than ever on the field and I don't think saying love a lot is going to heal the wounds left by everything that has gone on over the past couple of years. Goodwin still has some time on his side. I don't see us sacking him until the middle of the year at least. We'll need to see a big big turnaround though and if we don't I believe it's likely we'll have even more players looking to go elsewhere.

Personally don't think it's great for the team to have some of the most highly paid and decorated players trying to facilitate moves out of the club.

How'd that work out?

I find it odd that we've never played at Norwood Oval for Gather Round. Would be a nice connection for Melbourne to play at the home of the Redlegs.

I agree with all of that and ultimately it's on Goodwin to implement those sorts of changes.

The whole thing about our inside 50s is it doesn't seem like it's an issue at all for any other side regardless of their list profile. What other side has had their forward entries be such a massive issue for so long? I can accept that we don't have a brilliant forward line but it really shouldn't be as hard as we make it. We should be taking at least 10 marks inside 50 per game. We should be able to hit a short pass to a lead far more than we do. I can't accept that our list is so incapable of this stuff. It's absolute basic footy.

Balme being sacked lead to Daniher coming in, making a prelim the following year and a Grand Final two years after that. Also you seem to be forgetting one coach in particular.

Few things. Everything from clearance starts from the midfield so if those guys aren't getting it done then maybe they need to be moved out of there? Goodwin can make those moves but so far he's backed them in. Petracca is the only one who gets moved forward despite being a more damaging midfielder than either Viney or Oliver. Max is old and not impacting games like he used to but you can get by without a ruck dominating games. We rely too much on him saving us with his marking. Need to adapt to that. Other thing is we are absolutely horrible at the turnover game which is far more important to modern footy than clearance. We struggle to force turnovers and when we do we don't score from them. That's a whole team thing and an issue with how we rebound.

Think Goodwin knew we were in for some pain late in the pre-season which was why he was tempering expectations. It shouldn't matter as the club planted their stake firmly in the ground last year that the expectation was finals. I can't think of any moments so far this season that have really shown how we're trying to play in a way that will actually stand up. The players look completely confused and are second guessing themselves, the running patterns are a mess, and guys who won a flag together look like they've never played football with eachother before. I can't see it suddenly clicking and the team looking like a threat again any time soon. The best we could hope for is that Goodwin releases the shackles and lets the players play on instinct, but to do so would be yet another failure to change the gameplan.

Ultimately, the moment the club no longer believes he is the man to take us forward is the moment he should go. Past achievements count for nothing in that respect. You simply can't afford to be sitting on your hands as a club.

That record really says more about our club's shortcomings than Goodwin as a coach. The results we are seeing right now are as bad as we saw in Neeld's first year with a far superior list. That trend simply cannot continue for a whole season. I've seen some argue that it takes time to learn a new gameplan, and I agree to an extent, but the transition cannot and should not be this bad. We've been told the team is working on their forward entries for years they are as bad as they've ever been. Collingwood learned a new gameplan in one off-season that took them from second last to top 4 in 2022. Ditto for GWS in 23. Geelong also changed the way they played after 2021 and won a flag the following year. There are teething issues and there's being completely uncompetitive and out of sync with each other. If we're in the same position at the bye I would say he absolutely does not deserve to finish out the season. It will be incumbent on the club to start looking towards the future.

The fact is the club was expecting finals and we currently look like bottom four and have several stars who have tried and are trying to leave the club. How much patience do you give him to turn this around? The rest of the season? The rest of his contract? Do you reset expectations and embrace a rebuild? Is he even the right coach to take on that task? Better coaches than Goodwin have been sacked by stronger clubs than Melbourne.