Midfield depth

[binman 44,824]

2 hours ago, Gator said:

I completely agree.

People may scoff at reserves form, but in periods 5-7 against Richmond Salem played as a pure mid and looked fantastic.  He was moving better/quicker than I'd seen him for years, used it well and looked like a point of difference to a midfield that has probably become a little predictable.

Yes, a tiny sample size, but I'd love to see him given a crack at a midfield spot.  Historically I've been in Dazzle's corner, in that I prefer him behind the ball, but he's far more mature now and I reckon can make a fist of it in the middle, especially after seeing him in the match sim.

Agree.

Only against VFL players, but i was surprised how natural he looked as a mid.

Low centre of gravity, nuggety, and good hands are positives for a mid. Tough too.

But there's one thing I really like.

Of course we will benefit from him kicking it inside 50 more as a mid than defender.

But his ability to hit 15-20 metre targets under pressure would be even more important for us as a mid than defender.

Less turnovers, and crucially a mark allows us to control the ball, and hold it up and reset if required. 

Even some players with good technique struggle with that kick.

Clarry, tracc and viney - our starting midfield players - don't have that skill, and almost always handball, or dump kick, under pressure.

Which most of time is fine, but can lead to some chaotic ball movement and turnovers. 

Edited February 25, 2024 by binman

[Stu 1,073]

1 hour ago, binman said:

Agree.

Only against VFL players, but i was surprised how natural he looked as a mid.

Low centre of gravity, nuggets, and good hands means are positives for a mid. Tough too.

But there's one thing I really like. Of course we will benefit from him kicking it inside 50, but his ability to hit 15-20 metre targets under pressure would be super important for us.

Less turnovers and crucially a mark allows us to control the ball, and hold it up and reset if required

Even some players with good technique struggle with that kick. Clarry, tracc and viney - our starting midfield players - don't have that skill, and almost always handball under pressure.

Which most of time is fine, but can lead to create some chsotic ball movement and turnovers. 

Salem has fantastic spatial awareness and peripheral vision, that allows him to stop and use every fraction of a second he has free to assess his options before picking his kick. If used in the middle he won’t be hurried into dump kicks from perceived pressure which will only help our F50 connection.  

[Demon Disciple 12,536]

Our midfield depth is getting very thin, definitely need the likes of Sparrow, Hunter, ANB and Rivers to really step up and demand a spot in the midfield, otherwise too much will again fall to too few (Jack, Clarry and Trac can’t be on the ball all the time).

Hopefully May is good for a couple more top years, allowing Turner and Adams time to properly develop. What to do with Tomlinson? There is definitely a spot there for him in the backline if he wants it (Goody needs to give him a chunk of games - he was a walk up start to our defence for the 2021 GF prior to injury).

Poor old Max can’t keep going forever can he? He’s gonna have to do it for at least another year.

As for our forward line??? Can Roos broad shoulders carry our forward hopes……….a lot to ask of a 20 year old as Fritta no doubt will get the #1 defender.
 

Our smalls really need to form their own potent mosquito fleet this year and really be manic with their inside 50 pressure. I feel this is where we can really make an improvement from the last 2 years.

[poita 3,944]

Badly beaten by a Sydney midfield missing Mills, Parker and Adams.

Sparrow and Rivers provided nothing. Salem good in first half, then disappeared. Oliver plenty of touches, but no impact. 

Viney good and Petracca okay in parts, but that performance from a full strength midfield group was concerning. We're not getting 23 games from all of these guys. What happens when we lose a couple to injury? 

[spirit of norm smith 16,679]

Runners. Langdon. Windsor.  (Hunter) 
 

Bulls. Trac. Clarry. JV7. Sparrow. 
 

Class. Salem. 

target 2 more young running midfielders who have pace in their legs   That’s what’s needed next   

Rivers is a half back running defender.  That’s his weapon.  Keep him there. 

[Demon Dynasty 17,165]

On 25/02/2024 at 13:29, dazzledavey36 said:

Not sure how you can name Salem, Rivers and Kozzie as 'bloody good midfield' options when there is still a lot of unknowns on whether they can step up when needed.

Sparrow I would say to some degree hasn't exactly taken the next step in proving he can become a quality midfielder in years to come.

He's a role player who needs to lift his numbers and input and not continue to live off averaging 16-17 disposals per game. Based of what I saw against Richmond I saw nothing in his game that suggest he's improved. Now I'm not using that as evidence to suggest that he won't improve this year but he absolutely needs to step up now with Brayshaw gone. He's got all the tight athletic tools but we barely see enough of it.

Rivers has only had minor spurts in there and taking him away from our backline does leave it vulnerable because he is just as good down back. He's the one out of the lot I see transitioning well into full time midfield role similar to what Elliot Yeo did when he started off as a defender in his early days.

Kozzie is very unknown still. Barely used there last year and doubt he has the tank to to play big minutes in there. Good for short bursts, but against the top sides like Collingwood who are elite at two way running then he'll need to step up in that area. Like Rivers, you're also taking his strengths away being an elite small forward because no one else in our teams comes even close to his level up forward.

There is zero evidence to suggest Salem can step into the midfield role and be successful. Goodwin has already trialled Salem as a starting mid in early 2018 and he was pretty ordinary so they had to move him back in his natural position down back

We've also trialled the two tall defenders thing and it simply does not work. One of the most bizarre coaching selections moves I saw was certainly not the not using Josh Schache sub but going into our first final against Collingwood with May and Lever as our only tall defenders. What was even more bizarre is that Goodwin admitted sometime last year that he prefers the 3 talls down back as it gives some like Lever to be released as the roaming 3rd tall.

That final against Collingwood we butchered up that team selection that badly that they had no other choice but to play Rivers on Dan McStay all night which completely took away his running game because he had to play a full lock down role.

Never again.

The finals campaign should have been reviewed.  Especially the selection side for the Pies match as you've ponted out.  Along with the inexplicable non-use of the sub.

Goodwin said himself at the start of this season he's ripped off the rear view mirror.

Well i hope he at least used the 2023 side mirrors to take a good look behind prior to pulling out into 2024 traffic.

The next 5 - 6 weeks will tell us whether he did or didnt and if we're about to get into 4th - 5th gear OR be hit by a rampaging 22/23 B-Double.

[titan_uranus 25,255]

2 hours ago, poita said:

Badly beaten by a Sydney midfield missing Mills, Parker and Adams.

Sparrow and Rivers provided nothing. Salem good in first half, then disappeared. Oliver plenty of touches, but no impact. 

Viney good and Petracca okay in parts, but that performance from a full strength midfield group was concerning. We're not getting 23 games from all of these guys. What happens when we lose a couple to injury? 

Salem “disappeared” after Bowey’s injury. 

Nevertheless, yes, we have a problem if we can’t win CPs or clearances against a second-string midfield.

[godees 913]

27 minutes ago, titan_uranus said:

Salem “disappeared” after Bowey’s injury. 

Nevertheless, yes, we have a problem if we can’t win CPs or clearances against a second-string midfield.

I think they put Jordon onto him

[adonski 13,267]

[titan_uranus 25,255]

50 minutes ago, godees said:

I think they put Jordon onto him

It looked to me as though he spent more time in the back half to cover for the absence of Bowey.