Midfielders going into their third year (Adams) can compete straight away. It's not about being elite or at their peak instantly, but generally midfielders take less time than other types of players, once they have bulk and are up with the speed of the game. If Adams continues at his current trajectory, he'll be an important contributor in 2014. It will not take him another four to five years to impact games the way we'd want him to.

i do agree that midfielders develop quicker, but it is alot to do with the players around them too. he will be competitive but we need to be bringing in players who are able to take a load off the younger players, and i dont think he would be able to do that. We need players who will be able to come in and impact immediately as we already have the young players.

Having said that, my main point is the fact that howe for adams is not a trade that we should be doing and although adams is going to be a good player, we would have 3-4 targets ahead of him at the moment

Let me just put this out there...

The MFC and Roos have to think laterally and we know that Freo's big centre square mids have impacted AFL footy, which is one of the reasons Roos wants to try Watts as a mid (not centre square, but who knows), so could Howe make it as a 190cm mid ? Mundy started as a half back flanker, Fyfe started as a forward not dissimilar to Howe, both are about the same height as Howe and we know Howe has skill, courage and endurance.

Naturally there will be plenty that scoff at the idea, but I'd be interested to see Howe try out as a midfielder.

I think he could potentially make a gun midfielder one day. Has all the attributes to succed there, great below his knees, smooth in traffic and a good tackler

I think he could potentially make a gun midfielder one day. Has all the attributes to succed there, great below his knees, smooth in traffic and a good tackler

Jack is certainly great below his knees and smooth in traffic, but a good tackler he is not.

i do agree that midfielders develop quicker, but it is alot to do with the players around them too. he will be competitive but we need to be bringing in players who are able to take a load off the younger players, and i dont think he would be able to do that. We need players who will be able to come in and impact immediately as we already have the young players.

Having said that, my main point is the fact that howe for adams is not a trade that we should be doing and although adams is going to be a good player, we would have 3-4 targets ahead of him at the moment

If Adams becomes an extra contributor along with Jones that does take a load off the younger players. Viney will contribute, as will hopefully Trengove, Grimes and Toumpas. With Paul Roos, we'll see a lot of role players. There will be a number of players that share the load.

I'd say Adams would certainly be in our top 3 or 4 targets, but we'd be having a serious look at others too.

Jack is certainly great below his knees and smooth in traffic, but a good tackler he is not.

Talking about Howe.

I want an O'Keefe clone.

If he can't do it, he's trade bait with value. Unlike our other bait...

Talking about Howe.

I want an O'Keefe clone.

If he can't do it, he's trade bait with value. Unlike our other bait...

Ah. Well. My post still stands, but substitute Jeremy for Jack.

Can't see it happening, but I'll tow the party line and back Roos' decision on him.

Hogan is the only player on the list i wouldn't trade under any circumstances, so my comments on Howe are made from that perspective.

Some say he lacks defensive pressure, I agree, and it's because he's an instinctive player with flair and hasn't been coached to include that type of pressure in his game. It's purely a mindset. It's silly to think he won't evolve.

Howe is the best mark I've ever seen. I've seen Vanders and Knights - individually and toe to toe, amazing really, I've seen Modra, Barker, Snake Baker's grand final exploits, Jezza, Jumping Jack Hawkins, our own Robbie, Russell Robertson, etc, but none hold a candle to Howe. But unlike some I don't consider him a one trick pony. He has top level endurance, pace, usually good footskills, and at 190cm he's a brilliant size for a utility.

At 23 with just 56 games under his belt he's one of the last players a club bereft of talent should trade. Especially when he's finally going to have an 'A' grade coach to improve his game. It just doesn't make sense to move such a player on when you can't be sure how good he'll become.

Here's a novel approach. As well as trying to quickly inject a bit of midfield talent through trading some early picks how about we start developing our own talent.

You'd trade Viney?

I know it's not the point, but in wondering if that omission is deliberate...

You'd trade Viney?

I know it's not the point, but in wondering if that omission is deliberate...

Hogan is the only player that is untouchable.

I can't see a reason why we'd ever trade Viney, but yes, there would be deals I'd contemplate. But of course it's not going to happen.

There would be no deal I'd do for Hogan.

Hogan is the only player that is untouchable.

I can't see a reason why we'd ever trade Viney, but yes, there would be deals I'd contemplate. But of course it's not going to happen.

There would be no deal I'd do for Hogan.

Viney is an untouchable

And dont bother giving me any unrealistic trade scenarios to try and prove me wrong.

The kid will be a top 5 midfielder in 5 years time, and he has Red and Blue in his DNA.

He is as untouchable as you can get

Hogan is the only player that is untouchable.

I can't see a reason why we'd ever trade Viney, but yes, there would be deals I'd contemplate. But of course it's not going to happen.

There would be no deal I'd do for Hogan.

Fair enough.

At least you're brutally honest.

I think the type of deals that would make Viney tradeable would also make Hogan tradeable.

I think Hogan will be a much better player and more irreplaceable, but Viney will become culturally irreplaceable, I think.

Simply cannot agree with this.

I reckon every club in the competition would be interested in Howe.

I think that Howe has the attributes to be our version of Fyfe but at this point in time not the application. If Roos can get him to play a more aggressive style of football and instill in him a more competitive attitude he could be anything.

He's not just a great mark, he has a lot more, at the moment unused, strings to the bow.

As for Adams, just go and get him.

You're just making stuff up now. A second rounder and Spencer is what we're offering? GWS would just laugh at that. We will need to do far, far more than that to get close, not to mention convincing Adams to play for us.

Remember we have the first pick in the 2nd round. Most teams have their eye on a big midfield pot in the first round. And after all is the rumour time of year! This is just what I have heard. Many a Stone to be unturned b4 the big dance!

Hogan is the only player on the list i wouldn't trade under any circumstances, so my comments on Howe are made from that perspective.

Some say he lacks defensive pressure, I agree, and it's because he's an instinctive player with flair and hasn't been coached to include that type of pressure in his game. It's purely a mindset. It's silly to think he won't evolve.

Howe is the best mark I've ever seen. I've seen Vanders and Knights - individually and toe to toe, amazing really, I've seen Modra, Barker, Snake Baker's grand final exploits, Jezza, Jumping Jack Hawkins, our own Robbie, Russell Robertson, etc, but none hold a candle to Howe. But unlike some I don't consider him a one trick pony. He has top level endurance, pace, usually good footskills, and at 190cm he's a brilliant size for a utility.

At 23 with just 56 games under his belt he's one of the last players a club bereft of talent should trade. Especially when he's finally going to have an 'A' grade coach to improve his game. It just doesn't make sense to move such a player on when you can't be sure how good he'll become.

Here's a novel approach. As well as trying to quickly inject a bit of midfield talent through trading some early picks how about we start developing our own talent.

Actually I have to agree. But I wouldn't trade Viney either. Come on people, we truly have an exciting time coming. Players coming in will add to the excitement. Next year I truly believe we will win between 8-10 games. So lets feel the love!

Taylor Adams is bound for Pies or Tigers in exchange for their 1st round pick ... his choice of clubs.

Taylor Adams is bound for Pies or Tigers in exchange for their 1st round pick ... his choice of clubs.

Have read that the tigers will/ do not trade their first round draft pick. Something in their constitution

Hogan is the only player on the list i wouldn't trade under any circumstances, so my comments on Howe are made from that perspective.

Some say he lacks defensive pressure, I agree, and it's because he's an instinctive player with flair and hasn't been coached to include that type of pressure in his game. It's purely a mindset. It's silly to think he won't evolve.

Howe is the best mark I've ever seen. I've seen Vanders and Knights - individually and toe to toe, amazing really, I've seen Modra, Barker, Snake Baker's grand final exploits, Jezza, Jumping Jack Hawkins, our own Robbie, Russell Robertson, etc, but none hold a candle to Howe. But unlike some I don't consider him a one trick pony. He has top level endurance, pace, usually good footskills, and at 190cm he's a brilliant size for a utility.

At 23 with just 56 games under his belt he's one of the last players a club bereft of talent should trade. Especially when he's finally going to have an 'A' grade coach to improve his game. It just doesn't make sense to move such a player on when you can't be sure how good he'll become.

Here's a novel approach. As well as trying to quickly inject a bit of midfield talent through trading some early picks how about we start developing our own talent.

I don't think anyone doesn't think he has those skills... it is those skills that makes him valuable to others as well. but hes lazy & undisciplined.

we don't have many of trade value at this point. that is the point & we have an opportunity for Adams & maybe others. they play the game we need now.

so it depends on the free agents we get, as to what we do with our picks & trade options. if nothing else howe needs a shake up being mentioned as poss trade bait.

if we pickup 2 tough inside mid free agents & an outside mid F/A, we may not need to trade out much.

Taylor Adams is bound for Pies or Tigers in exchange for their 1st round pick ... his choice of clubs.

most likely I think. disappointingly.... I can't wait til we are the preferred destination.

most likely I think. disappointingly.... I can't wait til we are the preferred destination.

Tigers won't trade first round pick. Pies however do have H Shaw as currency, but he is reported to be going elsewhere. What can they better our trade for TAdams with?

Tigers won't trade first round pick. Pies however do have H Shaw as currency, but he is reported to be going elsewhere. What can they better our trade for TAdams with?

what is our trade for TA?

is heath going to swans? heath is contracted so if he's going elsewhere it has to be a trade with someone? this must explain his behaviour, trying to get a release?

I don't think anyone doesn't think he has those skills... it is those skills that makes him valuable to others as well. but hes lazy & undisciplined.

we don't have many of trade value at this point. that is the point & we have an opportunity for Adams & maybe others. they play the game we need now.

so it depends on the free agents we get, as to what we do with our picks & trade options. if nothing else howe needs a shake up being mentioned as poss trade bait.

if we pickup 2 tough inside mid free agents & an outside mid F/A, we may not need to trade out much.

Don't agree with you here, I think he has lacked good direction and development.

Edited September 28, 201311 yr by rjay

Don't agree with you here, I think he has lacked good direction and development.

probably..

I'm only saying what he is... what he can be makes him valuable to all. but we need mids NOw, & he is not Now.

we need some quick effect to get us rolling.. if we get them as free agents, then we have more timer to develop kids like howe.

most of our lists over 20 years have been poorly led & taught.

this Is why we have to change our Culture now.

Tigers won't trade first round pick. Pies however do have H Shaw as currency, but he is reported to be going elsewhere. What can they better our trade for TAdams with?

Pies will get pick 13 imo as compo for losing dale Thomas, and I reckon they'll just pass that on for Adams if we don't convince him to come to us instead.

Tigers won't trade first round pick. Pies however do have H Shaw as currency, but he is reported to be going elsewhere. What can they better our trade for TAdams with?

I read the same - BUT I believe it also said without Board approval. They'll get Board approval if they need it.

Pies will get pick 13 imo as compo for losing dale Thomas, and I reckon they'll just pass that on for Adams if we don't convince him to come to us instead.

I've been getting the feeling for the last week & a half, that we're just not in the ball game re Adams anyway? as much as I'd like to get him, I think he'll end up at one of the Power clubs.

so, it must be others we're looking at... turns eyes to qld.