Time to go Mark Neeld

[Hardnut 327]

73 pages mostly of crap posted by people who have no idea what goes on inside the club and just follow the sheep trail of the media, no facts to support their rants but still it goes on and on, he's something novel just support the club and let them deal with it.

IMO most posters on DL believe in what they post, are sincere, and above all, believe passionately in MFC - they may disagree with each other, but mostly they respect each other's views!

[Hardnut 327]

I like Baghdad saw very concerning signs almost from day one. Neeld needed to be sent to management school before being given the job as he is no natural manager. Many of his mistakes are text book and something you woudl expect in the 2nd division of a country league. People will write studies in future years about this....... as what not to do.

I have selectively quoted because I was very troubled when MN's name was even suggested as a coaching candidate - I make no apologies for standing by my opinion!

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

Yes, i think so. I guess you don't think so. But again it matters not a jot what you or i think.

I would imagine the position of the board would be that yes, Sunday, unlike the first 2 rounds, was ok and that the effort, spirit and intensity were at the required level - a level that if maintained will ensure they, rightly or wrongly, won't sack Neeld mid season.

At the risk of repeating myself i simply don't see the point arguing whether Neeld should be sacked, better to postulate whether he will be.

If the board are happy with Sunday then they should go as well. I can't believe any club ( other than MFC) would be happy with that uncompetitive performance. The only upside was that Carlton did not hit the gas and we would have lost by 100+ points. The palpable relief is the only positive and we continue to deliver football that unbelievably worse than last year and 2011.

[Hardnut 327]

I want to ask you this. At the end of 2010 did you think we had such a bad list? 8 and a half games won, young but promising was the consensus. Do you agree?

Then, in 2011, was the list all that bad? Same number of wins, 3 by 16 goals. There were problems defensively but we had a gameplan and knew how to attack.

Why then is the list so much worse now?

Why are so many players a shadow of their 2010 selves?

How was it correct to recruit 5 players who couldn't get a game elsewhere?

Why ignore the fact that Petterd had Achilles problems last 2 years but was now better. We KNEW he could play. Ditto Moloney. How inadequate to simply clear him rather than get on top of the issues.

I dispute hat Neeld inherited a bad list, or that they were unfit. (though I haven't checked it, my impression is that Bailey's teams ran out the game better than Neeld's.) I have found his excuses pathetic, demeaning of both himself and his predecessor.

+1 SS12

[Dee Fan 3,247]

blaming Neeld for the lose of senior players - they were leaving long before Neeld arrived... judging from Neelds press conference - he has already decided which players will form the basis for the future - secondly once the game plan become more natural - we will more than likely improve alot quicker.

Neeld may have a list of players that he believes will form the basis for the future but what if they don't want to be the basis of the future, what if they have had enough and want out?

We don't want to replace those that leave with Rodan/Gillies/Pederson mark 2, we don't want to lose experienced players only to replace them with spuds .

The other side of the coin is, replacing the coach mid term may not go down with the players, it's a fine line we tread.

I've seen nothing but a bit of perseverance from the players this year, and that's been in one game, our skill level is appalling and our immediate future is not looking good.

[demon3165 2,718]

IMO most posters on DL believe in what they post, are sincere, and above all, believe passionately in MFC - they may disagree with each other, but mostly they respect each other's views!

Hardnut yes some posters believe what they post and I don't have a problem with that but a majority just rehash what they have posted over and over because they have nothing further to add but still post it. As for respecting others views that is slowly diminishing on this post.

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Everyone keeps repeating the groupthink that the longer we keep Neeld, the more irreparable harm will be caused.

What is this irreparable harm he is apparently causing?

Why is it groupthink if people arrive at the same conclusion independently?

[binman 42,919]

If the board are happy with Sunday then they should go as well. I can't believe any club ( other than MFC) would be happy with that uncompetitive performance. The only upside was that Carlton did not hit the gas and we would have lost by 100+ points. The palpable relief is the only positive and we continue to deliver football that unbelievably worse than last year and 2011.

Bollocks - and at odds with every analysis i have read in the media about the game. Or do you only like what the media have to say when it supports one of your arguments?

[The Song Formerly Known As 6,479]

[demon3165 2,718]

Brilliant...............

[Dees Win 1]

I hope someone from the club has sat our players down and shown them footage of Brock, and how he is contributing to a disciplined team now. He was useless with us, but he can be used as an example of how if we can improve our culture and discipline we can raise even ordinary players to play important roles in a machine.

Cheers

[Axis of Bob 11,804]

Why is it groupthink if people arrive at the same conclusion independently?

Because nobody has yet articulated why they came to that conclusion. Since it remains oft repeated but never explained, one can only lean towards the conclusion that most people are sheep.

[swampy 20]

Hi. First post. I'm from Geelong and so have followed Neeld's career for a while. Melbourne supporter for 45 years. There was a moment after the drawn Grand Final when Neeld was the midfield coach (I think) for the Pies. A minute or two after the final siren, the TV coverage was zooming in on players and coaches in shock, trying to deal with the fact that they had another week to go. The camera then panned past Neeld and he already had his midfield group in a huddle and he was busy preparing them for the following week. Meanwhile Buckley, Malthouse et. al. were falling about looking helpless. I said to myself then that Collingwood would win the following week...

If you track his coaching career, he's had nothing but success. 4 consecutive premierships at Ocean Grove. He turned Western Jets from perennial whipping boys (could barely win a game) to finalists in three seasons. In between he was at St. Josephs in the GFL for a year and he completely turned over the list and went with youngsters but then was offered assistant positions at Bulldogs and Collingwood. Wherever he's been he has won friends and made enemies - because he is clear about what is needed for clubs to be successful and he just goes for it. Players liked him at Collingwood.

He identified a soft culture at MFC - a whole host of players who were just happy being AFL players (win, lose or draw. He's given them a chance to show that they want to win and those who haven't shown enough have been shown the door. There'll be more. Not exactly a recipe for making friends. I sense (I don't know) that there are still players who are dark on him for having lost mates from the club. For Neeld, he wouldn't care less. His job is to find a group of players who will work hard together to become successful. That's my take on him.

He's made mistakes but he won't die wondering. Stick with him. Give him his three years. On Sunday I saw a far more competitive effort by a group who were hopelessly outclassed and still low on confidence. We need another go at the draft table for Neeld to assemble the kind of group that he'd be happy with.

Leave him be. Support the club. When the wins come, enjoy them.

[Hardnut 327]

And if what I have heard about certain players' parents expressing dissatisfaction with the coach and they way the coach treats them, has any modicum of truth, then I am worried.

Selective partial quote.

Any connection with a previous post re the Western Jets?

[Roost It 1,434]

If the board are happy with Sunday then they should go as well. I can't believe any club ( other than MFC) would be happy with that uncompetitive performance. The only upside was that Carlton did not hit the gas and we would have lost by 100+ points. The palpable relief is the only positive and we continue to deliver football that unbelievably worse than last year and 2011.

You've taken to scrawling your dribble with a vegance since you were turfed as a mod

We had carltons measure in many aspects of that game.

You are in the minority with your views on Sunday

[Dee Fan 3,247]

Because nobody has yet articulated why they came to that conclusion. Since it remains oft repeated but never explained, one can only lean towards the conclusion that most people are sheep.

Does that equally apply to those that want to keep Neeld, there are quite a few of them and they don't seem to have any idea why they want to keep him other than the opposite of those that want him gone.

Those that want him gone because it will harm the club the longer he stays and he's had is chance

Those that want him to stay because it will hurt the club if he goes and he deserves a chance

Spot the sheep.

[Axis of Bob 11,804]

Does that equally apply to those that want to keep Neeld, there are quite a few of them and they don't seem to have any idea why they want to keep him other than the opposite of those that want him gone.

Those that want him gone because it will harm the club the longer he stays and he's had is chance

Those that want him to stay because it will hurt the club if he goes and he deserves a chance

Spot the sheep.

I asked a question about the apparent harm caused because posters have continually stated that he must be sacked now to prevent more harm.

You have dodged the question twice in a row now, so one can only assume that you can't answer it. Will someone else help save RobbieF?

[bing181 9,219]

- a level that if maintained will ensure they, rightly or wrongly, won't sack Neeld mid season.

... and will ensure that, eventually, the wins will start coming.

[The Song Formerly Known As 6,479]

Hi. First post. I'm from Geelong and so have followed Neeld's career for a while. Melbourne supporter for 45 years. There was a moment after the drawn Grand Final when Neeld was the midfield coach (I think) for the Pies. A minute or two after the final siren, the TV coverage was zooming in on players and coaches in shock, trying to deal with the fact that they had another week to go. The camera then panned past Neeld and he already had his midfield group in a huddle and he was busy preparing them for the following week. Meanwhile Buckley, Malthouse et. al. were falling about looking helpless. I said to myself then that Collingwood would win the following week...

If you track his coaching career, he's had nothing but success. 4 consecutive premierships at Ocean Grove. He turned Western Jets from perennial whipping boys (could barely win a game) to finalists in three seasons. In between he was at St. Josephs in the GFL for a year and he completely turned over the list and went with youngsters but then was offered assistant positions at Bulldogs and Collingwood. Wherever he's been he has won friends and made enemies - because he is clear about what is needed for clubs to be successful and he just goes for it. Players liked him at Collingwood.

He identified a soft culture at MFC - a whole host of players who were just happy being AFL players (win, lose or draw. He's given them a chance to show that they want to win and those who haven't shown enough have been shown the door. There'll be more. Not exactly a recipe for making friends. I sense (I don't know) that there are still players who are dark on him for having lost mates from the club. For Neeld, he wouldn't care less. His job is to find a group of players who will work hard together to become successful. That's my take on him.

He's made mistakes but he won't die wondering. Stick with him. Give him his three years. On Sunday I saw a far more competitive effort by a group who were hopelessly outclassed and still low on confidence. We need another go at the draft table for Neeld to assemble the kind of group that he'd be happy with.

Leave him be. Support the club. When the wins come, enjoy them.

AT LAST!!!!!!! Well done.

Edited May 6, 2013 by The Song Formerly Known As

[Roost It 1,434]

Hi. First post. I'm from Geelong and so have followed Neeld's career for a while. Melbourne supporter for 45 years. There was a moment after the drawn Grand Final when Neeld was the midfield coach (I think) for the Pies. A minute or two after the final siren, the TV coverage was zooming in on players and coaches in shock, trying to deal with the fact that they had another week to go. The camera then panned past Neeld and he already had his midfield group in a huddle and he was busy preparing them for the following week. Meanwhile Buckley, Malthouse et. al. were falling about looking helpless. I said to myself then that Collingwood would win the following week...

If you track his coaching career, he's had nothing but success. 4 consecutive premierships at Ocean Grove. He turned Western Jets from perennial whipping boys (could barely win a game) to finalists in three seasons. In between he was at St. Josephs in the GFL for a year and he completely turned over the list and went with youngsters but then was offered assistant positions at Bulldogs and Collingwood. Wherever he's been he has won friends and made enemies - because he is clear about what is needed for clubs to be successful and he just goes for it. Players liked him at Collingwood.

He identified a soft culture at MFC - a whole host of players who were just happy being AFL players (win, lose or draw. He's given them a chance to show that they want to win and those who haven't shown enough have been shown the door. There'll be more. Not exactly a recipe for making friends. I sense (I don't know) that there are still players who are dark on him for having lost mates from the club. For Neeld, he wouldn't care less. His job is to find a group of players who will work hard together to become successful. That's my take on him.

He's made mistakes but he won't die wondering. Stick with him. Give him his three years. On Sunday I saw a far more competitive effort by a group who were hopelessly outclassed and still low on confidence. We need another go at the draft table for Neeld to assemble the kind of group that he'd be happy with.

Leave him be. Support the club. When the wins come, enjoy them.

Lets hope Rhino and his minnions read this and take a step back from attacking Neeld and the club

[Pennant St Dee 13,173]

Good summary, I'm no longer a fan of Neeld, but you have to give credit where it's due and the effort by the players was much better this week; the skill level was the huge difference between the two sides.

We turned the ball over so much it was laughable and we could have been a little bit closer if we'd taken advantage of the shots on goal we missed. What Bail had in mind when we had players loose and he was running in towards goal is beyond me. Terlich needs to dispose of the ball quicker, he's not playing SANFL any more and Spencer needs to develop strength so he doesn't get pushed aside in the contest.

Some of the players turned the corner and if they can continue it we may win a game or two before the end of the season.

Agree Robbie but think all of these things can be worked on and will improve with greater exposure at the higher level. Hardnut who I swear is a Cats fan who just comes on here to beat his chest speaks of how great the Cats are along with other deelanders. Well it took a lot of their list to reach 80/100 games before the composure, trust in each other and confidence in their ability saw them become the players and team they are.

As I said before a lot of positives on the weekend (and negatives) but we need to continue with the positives week by week.

[Lil_red_fire_engine 11,175]

I thought we were due about 8 wins this year to be on a true improve. I expected we would still gets pantsed by mature sides but be in those games a bit longer before we caved. At this stage of the season I had us at 2 wins and expected we would beat the rookie sides in GWS and GC and overtake Port (wrong there), StKilda and the Bulldogs. Based on what I have seen I am still confident that we will beat the Saints and Western and subject to having Dawes and Clark second half of the year a few more as they are surrounded with players that form the basis of what he is trying to achieve.

I am willing to back Neeld in this year and wait it out because as frustrating as it is I can see the signs. Granted it is not translating into game end scores or possession counts but I can see the willingness to compete and run from the new players and those who will make up our team going forward. I can also see the wreck he was left with poor recruiting and lazy senior players resting on their laurels who he was willing to turf. I support the recruitment of mature players who aside from Dawes (quality player worth the gamble) and Pederson (we overpaid for a second tier player) cost us nothing. I can see the type of competitive beasts we have drafted in Viney, Hogan, Kent, Terlich and Jones and saw enough of Toumpas last year to know he will prove a quality pick.

People who want Neeld gone believe that a new coach is the magic answer but seem to ignore the sh1te he was left with. To my knowledge he told those that hired him that this was no easy task and would take time. He should be given at least until the end of this year for a proper evaluation of where we are.

Edited May 6, 2013 by big_red_fire_engine

[Pennant St Dee 13,173]

What the hell do you think that keeping Neeld as coach will achieve? Have you been watching our games? Compare our games this season to the last 6 in 2011 (when we were suposed to be under-perfoming and rubbish). We re going backwards..... big time, keeping Neeld will result in the mass loss of players.

I know as a fact Carlton are all over Watts. I here there are many that are over Neeld and over being a basket case and will ask for trade or take free agency come season end. This could be the begining of the end.

So what Freo are also keen on him just remember everybody has a price and we hold the aces if he wishes to leave and these clubs all over him really want him. HTFU and don't be swayed by everything you here, it's part of footy! Not much of a dig in and fight type against all odds are you!

[Pennant St Dee 13,173]

Geelong had 9 players each of whom had played under 50 games on the weekend. They have several pushing for senior selection in their 2's. Yes, before you jump down my throat, I know the core of Geelong's list is as rock solid as any in the AFL. The point i make, is they never bottomed out and they have a culture which has never seen then with a losing average of over 10 goals.

Yes they did and they did it properly between 1999 and 2001/2. It's just that long ago everyone choses to forget, they changed from the Top down, Club and Footy Dept

[Rhino Richards 1,467]

You've taken to scrawling your dribble with a vegance since you were turfed as a mod

We had carltons measure in many aspects of that game.

You are in the minority with your views on Sunday

Scoreboard. Scoreboard!

MFC vs CFC

Scores 60 vs 121

Possessions: 270 vs 378

Tackles 64 vs 79

Hit outs 30 vs 60

We don't get the ball. We don't apply pressure. We don't make tackles.

Oh for joy for joy! We won the free kicks.

Frees 26 vs 16

Game plan working!