There is a bit of angst on here and from people I talk to about Neeld and his staff when comparing us from last year to this year. I think it needs to be a reference for people who want to compare. I only make this thread as it's quicker to do this then reply to everyone who repeats the rhetoric spoken by insipid "Journalists" like Greg Denhim who were bagging us last year and then this year they suddenly praise our 2011 season compared to this one. C'mon we have all heard the line "But we won 8 games last year and we could of made the 8" It is vomit! Do you forget? So before you say it is all Neeld's fault and sack him lets look back.

Round 1: Drew with Sydney who screwed up the sub rule by having I believe it was Seaby as their sub. Pretty sure they were the first and last team to go with a ruckmen as a sub.

Round 2: Smashed by Hawthorn.

Round 3: Just beat a pitiful Brisbane who had taken the chance on older players and it backfired plus fevola issues.

Round 4: We smashed Gold Coast. That will go down in history as a great win.Pfffft.

Round 6:Smashed by West Coast.

Round 7:We smash Adelaide who were not playing for their coach at all and eventually quit.

Round 8-10: Lose to North,St.Kilda and Carlton.

Round 11: We beat Essendon as they our are [censored].

Round 12: We get smashed by the pies.

Round 13: We smash a injury ravaged Freo who by the end of the year nearly had to apply to the AFL for extra players on their list just to field a side.

Round 14: We beat the tigers who were our equal which was probably our best win.

Round 15-17: Lose to the dogs and then beat Port who were being compared to Fitzroy at the time.

Round 18-24: This got us one win and 6 losses including 186.

We finish 13th above Adelaide who sacked their coach,Brisbane who tried to steal a flag with mature players,Port who were woeful and A first year club. If you think it's all Neeld's fault take a good hard look at what he inherited.

That sure brings back memories from all the games I went to last year.

Perspective sure does hurt sometimes.

Edited July 23, 201212 yr by Robot Devil

It's this kind of thinking that makes old folks pine for the halcyon days of their youth. Time heals all wounds, but it also makes people forgetful as Hell.

Edited July 23, 201212 yr by Chook

There is a bit of angst on here and from people I talk to about Neeld and his staff when comparing us from last year to this year. I think it needs to be a reference for people who want to compare. I only make this thread as it's quicker to do this then reply to everyone who repeats the rhetoric spoken by insipid "Journalists" like Greg Denhim who were bagging us last year and then this year they suddenly praise our 2011 season compared to this one. C'mon we have all heard the line "But we won 8 games last year and we could of made the 8" It is vomit! Do you forget? So before you say it is all Neeld's fault and sack him lets look back.

Round 1: Drew with Sydney who screwed up the sub rule by having I believe it was Seaby as their sub. Pretty sure they were the first and last team to go with a ruckmen as a sub.

Round 2: Smashed by Hawthorn.

Round 3: Just beat a pitiful Brisbane who had taken the chance on older players and it backfired plus fevola issues.

Round 4: We smashed Gold Coast. That will go down in history as a great win.Pfffft.

Round 6:Smashed by West Coast.

Round 7:We smash Adelaide who were not playing for their coach at all and eventually quit.

Round 8-10: Lose to North,St.Kilda and Carlton.

Round 11: We beat Essendon as they our are [censored].

Round 12: We get smashed by the pies.

Round 13: We smash a injury ravaged Freo who by the end of the year nearly had to apply to the AFL for extra players on their list just to field a side.

Round 14: We beat the tigers who were our equal which was probably our best win.

Round 15-17: Lose to the dogs and then beat Port who were being compared to Fitzroy at the time.

Round 18-24: This got us one win and 6 losses including 186.

We finish 13th above Adelaide who sacked their coach,Brisbane who tried to steal a flag with mature players,Port who were woeful and A first year club. If you think it's all Neeld's fault take a good hard look at what he inherited.

And this year looks so much better hey...

Yep in hindsight worse than this year as 2010 left us with great hope

And this year looks so much better hey...

Never said it was better but I wasn't expecting much from the list of players we have anyway.

It's this kind of thinking that makes old folks pine for the halcyon days of their youth. Time heals all wounds, but it also makes people forgetful as Hell.

Interesting - here's the 'Season Predicting' poll . Chook , you had us finishing 6th . There's a few of us that got it horribly wrong though , including me . I had us pegged for 8th . Doink !

Now , we don't want anyone changing their vote - I'll be watching .

http://demonland.com...son +prediction

Edited July 23, 201212 yr by Macca

Never said it was better but I wasn't expecting much from the list of players we have anyway.

Good work, you managed to make an excuse for all of the opposition that we beat last year, then in turn, we are making a number of excuses for our poor performances this year (ie Jurrah, injuries, Stynes, racism, blah blah).

So are we saying that the only reason why we won certain games last year was because we were playing teams at their weakest point, then in turn, we are losing more games this year because teams are playing us at our weakest point?

Obviously you're a Neeld fan, and good luck with that. But don't pi$$ down my back and tell me it's raining.

Good work, you managed to make an excuse for all of the opposition that we beat last year, then in turn, we are making a number of excuses for our poor performances this year (ie Jurrah, injuries, Stynes, racism, blah blah).

So are we saying that the only reason why we won certain games last year was because we were playing teams at their weakest point, then in turn, we are losing more games this year because teams are playing us at our weakest point?

Obviously you're a Neeld fan, and good luck with that. But don't pi$$ down my back and tell me it's raining.

Wow.... ummm wow.

I think he was trying to point out we were still $hit last year...

In 2011 even before we travelled down to Geelong, there were heaps of media coverage looking at the fact that our style of play meant that we were getting smashed by teams who knew how to make us play accountable football, not sure if you are pining for the Halcyon days of Bailey or not, but last year was not a good year, and yes it's sad that we have regressed in order to play a more competitive brand of football.

nah screw continuing down that line of argument, at this point I'd rather tell you to put up your umbrella!

2012 has been worse than 2011 i dont care what anyone says.

yes 2011 wasnt pretty either but at when we played against teams like port, north, richmond and lions or an interstate team at the G I'd sit down with hope of a win. This year I sit down to watch the games knowing we will loose.

injuries have taken a toll but i enjoyed watching our guys win every now and then! It was nice to see the potential on the list show what it could do every so often. This year our team looks to be giving a good effort but just look very very average all over the ground.

In summary, 2012 might be the shocker year we had to have to turn the wheel back the other way, but surley things didnt have to hit rock bottom like they have to teach a bunch of professional footy players to play a different game style. 2011 was bad but 2012 is also not acceptable IMO

2012 has been worse than 2011 i dont care what anyone says.

yes 2011 wasnt pretty either but at when we played against teams like port, north, richmond and lions or an interstate team at the G I'd sit down with hope of a win. This year I sit down to watch the games knowing we will loose.

injuries have taken a toll but i enjoyed watching our guys win every now and then! It was nice to see the potential on the list show what it could do every so often. This year our team looks to be giving a good effort but just look very very average all over the ground.

In summary, 2012 might be the shocker year we had to have to turn the wheel back the other way, but surley things didnt have to hit rock bottom like they have to teach a bunch of professional footy players to play a different game style. 2011 was bad but 2012 is also not acceptable IMO

At the risk of boring everyone senseless I kept saying all summer this is almost the same team that produced 2011 and 186.

I Suspected in 2011 that our team was mainly made up of players that were not AFL standard or could take us out of the bottom half of the ladder.

The further 2012 has gone the more I believe that to be true.

The problem DemonWA is that our "bunch of Professions footy players " is that in name only.

Most of them do not have the required skill level.

It is another result of having 18 teams.

The talent pool is stretched way too far.

There are currently at least 100 players spread across the league that are not AFL standard.

But that is another story.

The sad part is we seem to have a disproportional number of them.

Good work, you managed to make an excuse for all of the opposition that we beat last year, then in turn, we are making a number of excuses for our poor performances this year (ie Jurrah, injuries, Stynes, racism, blah blah).

So are we saying that the only reason why we won certain games last year was because we were playing teams at their weakest point, then in turn, we are losing more games this year because teams are playing us at our weakest point?

Obviously you're a Neeld fan, and good luck with that. But don't pi$$ down my back and tell me it's raining.

It's a great quote from Denis Pagan. You obviously like it so much you use it any chance you get even when it doesn't make sense in the context of a conversation. Our wins were over rated last year. That is a fact when you look at who we won against and how bad those opponents were last year. If a team this year plays Melbourne,GWS and GC twice that's six wins without breaking a sweat! I haven't made a judgement on Neeld as a coach yet as this is not his team. Once he has sifted out the crud and he gets the players he wants then I will judge him.

Must i remember 2011 whilst 2012 is still in motion!!

One nightmare at a time please...

Until the list is culled to the bone and Neeld recruits who he wants we are non competitive.

Which is an indictment on the MFC...

Must i remember 2011 whilst 2012 is still in motion!!

One nightmare at a time please...

Until the list is culled to the bone and Neeld recruits who he wants we are non competitive.

Which is an indictment on the MFC...

I know it sucks but I was guilty of over rating our list and thinking Bailey had lost the plot but this year just confirms that the reason we are not winning games is because we are just plain bad. I have a truck and will transport the axe grinder to Neeld's office if the MFC need me to.

Thank god for the Dons.

I know it sucks but I was guilty of over rating our list and thinking Bailey had lost the plot but this year just confirms that the reason we are not winning games is because we are just plain bad. I have a truck and will transport the axe grinder to Neeld's office if the MFC need me to.

Sure Bailey had to go, but he was the scapegoat.

Our recruiting of little boys to play against men is just so wrong...and we can all see it in the results.

If in fact recruiting kids rather than a balance of ages is the backbone of Schwab's "Red & Blueprint" then god help us....

It's a great quote from Denis Pagan. You obviously like it so much you use it any chance you get even when it doesn't make sense in the context of a conversation. Our wins were over rated last year. That is a fact when you look at who we won against and how bad those opponents were last year. If a team this year plays Melbourne,GWS and GC twice that's six wins without breaking a sweat! I haven't made a judgement on Neeld as a coach yet as this is not his team. Once he has sifted out the crud and he gets the players he wants then I will judge him.

Obviously I have misunderstood, hence me using that line. It was relevant with what I was thinking you were thinking. Wow, too much thinking! I apologise for reading your post incorrectly.

However, you can't dismiss wins from last year, regardless of the state of the opposition. We won games fair and square, and looked very good in some of those victories, to say that some people overrated those wins is and should be totally incorrect. You only had to look at our losses to know that we were a long way off the mark. the fact that we were still in a position late in the season to sneak a place in the 8 was more about the competition, not us.

This year, we have absolutely gone backwards on 2012. I will not use any excuses for our losses, just as you should not use any excuses for our wins in 2011. I don't understand why a team that showed so much improvement in 2010 has managed to be such a basket case in 2012.

Did I expect us to improve this year, based on performances last year? Absolutely, and I don't think I'd be on my own there. It's not a case of overrating our wins, it's just that level of expectation that we should place on our players, regardless of new coaching styles or game plans. I am also guilty of believing that when a team gets flogged by 186 points that improvement has to come. It hasn't. That's one of the reasons I'm disappointed with Neeld coming out saying how it's a blank canvas for him, and that he hadn't watched any replays of games from previous years. That's a bullsh!t attitude to have, and I'm in no doubt that is a major reason why we have actually gone backwards this season.

Sure Bailey had to go, but he was the scapegoat.

Our recruiting of little boys to play against men is just so wrong...and we can all see it in the results.

If in fact recruiting kids rather than a balance of ages is the backbone of Schwab's "Red & Blueprint" then god help us....

I have No doubt he was a scapegoat for a poorly run and under financed FD and we are paying for it big time. But remember it's all Neeld's fault.

Obviously I have misunderstood, hence me using that line. It was relevant with what I was thinking you were thinking. Wow, too much thinking! I apologise for reading your post incorrectly.

However, you can't dismiss wins from last year, regardless of the state of the opposition. We won games fair and square, and looked very good in some of those victories, to say that some people overrated those wins is and should be totally incorrect. You only had to look at our losses to know that we were a long way off the mark. the fact that we were still in a position late in the season to sneak a place in the 8 was more about the competition, not us.

This year, we have absolutely gone backwards on 2012. I will not use any excuses for our losses, just as you should not use any excuses for our wins in 2011. I don't understand why a team that showed so much improvement in 2010 has managed to be such a basket case in 2012.

Did I expect us to improve this year, based on performances last year? Absolutely, and I don't think I'd be on my own there. It's not a case of overrating our wins, it's just that level of expectation that we should place on our players, regardless of new coaching styles or game plans. I am also guilty of believing that when a team gets flogged by 186 points that improvement has to come. It hasn't. That's one of the reasons I'm disappointed with Neeld coming out saying how it's a blank canvas for him, and that he hadn't watched any replays of games from previous years. That's a bullsh!t attitude to have, and I'm in no doubt that is a major reason why we have actually gone backwards this season.

I get that you are frustrated and so am I but I would like to think that Neeld will be making his canvas blank at the end of the year with a mighty big axe. If I could pull the pin on our year and we don't play any more games in 2012 I would so Neeld can start his clean out. Give him a chance to build his team and coach that team. I think it can be done quickly and I expect improvements next year and if not then Neeld will be under pressure.

I get that you are frustrated and so am I but I would like to think that Neeld will be making his canvas blank at the end of the year with a mighty big axe. If I could pull the pin on our year and we don't play any more games in 2012 I would so Neeld can start his clean out. Give him a chance to build his team and coach that team. I think it can be done quickly and I expect improvements next year and if not then Neeld will be under pressure.

Yet you have a crack at people who expected improvements this year?

If we cull 5 or 6 of our older players (and it wouldn't be unfair), replaced them with 5 or 6 kids, our list will be worse for 2013. It hopefully will be a lot better by 2015!

Yet you have a crack at people who expected improvements this year?

If we cull 5 or 6 of our older players (and it wouldn't be unfair), replaced them with 5 or 6 kids, our list will be worse for 2013. It hopefully will be a lot better by 2015!

You don't replace senior players with Kids Billy that mistake has been proven beyond reasnoable doubt.

Problem is the challenge of finding/trading in mature men who are talented. Adding three more 22-24 yr old "honest toilers" from the VFL, SAFL, WAFL, etc won't win us a flag. That said, it may stop us winning another spoon, which would be a start.

Problem is the challenge of finding/trading in mature men who are talented. Adding three more 22-24 yr old "honest toilers" from the VFL, SAFL, WAFL, etc won't win us a flag. That said, it may stop us winning another spoon, which would be a start.

Sure it aint easy. A recruiters job is bloody hard but we need to get it right. We failed last time.

Yet you have a crack at people who expected improvements this year?

If we cull 5 or 6 of our older players (and it wouldn't be unfair), replaced them with 5 or 6 kids, our list will be worse for 2013. It hopefully will be a lot better by 2015!

I'm not having a crack at people bloody hell stop being so sensitive. I was just pointing what I believe were over hyped wins last year against crap teams. We both agree players need to be gone and that will happen but who said that the players coming in would be kids? Mature aged bodies with young talent from the draft plus a better FD will enable improvement and will give Neeld a chance to show if he can coach. If all these things happen and we still suck then I will be looking at Coach's to replace Neeld in two years like i'm sure plenty will be doing on here.