The kid can play big time and i think he will perfect as the Russians' apprentice . Has the second/ third efforts to make him as good as Jimmy was and is toughening up .Gawn and Spencer are the third and fourth pillars .

The kid can play big time and i think he will perfect as the Russians' apprentice . Has the second/ third efforts to make him as good as Jimmy was and is toughening up .Gawn and Spencer are the third and fourth pillars .

didnt see it coming

i remember at one point after a game I said i never wanted to see him in red and blue again

said the same thing about Russian

i'll give big Max plenty of time

T

didnt see it coming

i remember at one point after a game I said i never wanted to see him in red and blue again

said the same thing about Russian

i'll give big Max plenty of time

Sheeds wont

I still think he needs to show the same improvement up forward.

At the moment he's shown he can be a good back up for the number 1 when he's injured, as good as Bellchambers or Hampson. He'll probably show on Monday that he's about as good as Wood, hopefully better. He also has the added string to his bow of been able to play back. But to become a consistent best 22 player I think you have to play forward as well. Otherwise he might be in and out of the side when Jamar is back and in a few years over taken by the Gawn.

I definitely think the number 1 ruck and back up ruck are two different positions with two different skill sets these days. If Martin can just keep working on his forward work he'll be a gun.

Number 1 ruck (70% ruck, 10% forward): Jamar, Martin, Gawn, Spencer

Number 2 ruck (30% ruck, 50% forward): ???? Fitzpatrick, Newton (rubbish), Dunn (not big enough), McDonald

We are embarrassed by the riches we've manged to pick and the only danger to us is laziness and other clubs cheque books .This year has helped us develop talent like Martin and Maric ,Evans and Howe .

I still think he needs to show the same improvement up forward.

At the moment he's shown he can be a good back up for the number 1 when he's injured, as good as Bellchambers or Hampson. He'll probably show on Monday that he's about as good as Wood, hopefully better. He also has the added string to his bow of been able to play back. But to become a consistent best 22 player I think you have to play forward as well. Otherwise he might be in and out of the side when Jamar is back and in a few years over taken by the Gawn.

I definitely think the number 1 ruck and back up ruck are two different positions with two different skill sets these days. If Martin can just keep working on his forward work he'll be a gun.

Number 1 ruck (70% ruck, 10% forward): Jamar, Martin, Gawn, Spencer

Number 2 ruck (30% ruck, 50% forward): ???? Fitzpatrick, Newton (rubbish), Dunn (not big enough), McDonald

Dunny cant kick on his right and gets pinged twice a game turning left.

Spencer aint gonna be as good as Stef but gawn will def play if he can kick.Can he?

Dunny cant kick on his right and gets pinged twice a game turning left.

Spencer aint gonna be as good as Stef but gawn will def play if he can kick.Can he?

Dunn's a right footer, are you thinking of Bate? Either way I don't think he's a viable back up ruck.

Gawn is a poor kick which is hardly a surprise. But he'll work on it and kicking is a ruckmans least worries. Priorities are hit outs, marks, winning contested ball and making good options with the footy which is generally a handball.

I'm a fan of big stef, very agile for a big guy and never stops trying. Very impressed with his improvement and his game against the bummers. He had more tap outs than all 3 of their ruckman combined not to mention his heap of disposals and clearances. Absolutely destroyed their ruck trio.

On ya stef!

I still think he needs to show the same improvement up forward.

At the moment he's shown he can be a good back up for the number 1 when he's injured, as good as Bellchambers or Hampson. He'll probably show on Monday that he's about as good as Wood, hopefully better. He also has the added string to his bow of been able to play back. But to become a consistent best 22 player I think you have to play forward as well. Otherwise he might be in and out of the side when Jamar is back and in a few years over taken by the Gawn.

I definitely think the number 1 ruck and back up ruck are two different positions with two different skill sets these days. If Martin can just keep working on his forward work he'll be a gun.

Number 1 ruck (70% ruck, 10% forward): Jamar, Martin, Gawn, Spencer

Number 2 ruck (30% ruck, 50% forward): ???? Fitzpatrick, Newton (rubbish), Dunn (not big enough), McDonald

He smashed Bellchambers & Ryder, beat Hille easily, thumped Hampson, and will decimate Wood.

The question is how can we get the most out of Jamar & Martin. How about this:

* Ruckman "A" (70% on ball, 10% forward): MARTIN

* Ruckman "B" (30% on ball, 50% forward, including all stoppages in forward line): JAMAR

Jamar doesn't actually pick up as many possessions around the ground as Martin does, he's not as fast or agile, but he's a great contested mark. He'd give defences a lot to think about in the goalsquare, especially with Jurrah & Wonna et al under his feet.

And if Martin was getting beaten, or we were against someone like Sandi or Cox (or Zac Snith in 2013!), or for a last-quarter surge, we have a perfect "Plan B"!

Dunn's a right footer, are you thinking of Bate? Either way I don't think he's a viable back up ruck.

Gawn is a poor kick which is hardly a surprise. But he'll work on it and kicking is a ruckmans least worries. Priorities are hit outs, marks, winning contested ball and making good options with the footy which is generally a handball.

Gawn is not a poor kick, although he was on Friday night. He has been a lot more convincing at Casey . I predict we will all be surprised in the next couple of weeks.

Interesting article in The Age today re: Martin. Certainly explains his drop in form last year after showing so much potential previously. Also explains his improvement this year.

With Martin developing into the super utility and Gawn getting games, do you think it is curtains for Jake Spencer?

He smashed Bellchambers & Ryder, beat Hille easily, thumped Hampson, and will decimate Wood.

The question is how can we get the most out of Jamar & Martin. How about this:

* Ruckman "A" (70% on ball, 10% forward): MARTIN

* Ruckman "B" (30% on ball, 50% forward, including all stoppages in forward line): JAMAR

Jamar doesn't actually pick up as many possessions around the ground as Martin does, he's not as fast or agile, but he's a great contested mark. He'd give defences a lot to think about in the goalsquare, especially with Jurrah & Wonna et al under his feet.

And if Martin was getting beaten, or we were against someone like Sandi or Cox (or Zac Snith in 2013!), or for a last-quarter surge, we have a perfect "Plan B"!

Second this. Anybody who can't see his abilities as a midfield utility along with his wildly improved rucking, just isn't watching. His speed and ground work are superior to any of the ruckman mentioned above, including Jamar.

He was second in the Grand Final sprint 3 years ago, and I would imagine he is top 5 fastest on our list. That he is now getting to show that, and as a ruckman, is very exciting.

By season's end, he will be absolute core selection for this team, Jamar or no.

''The coaches had a stern word to me about working hard during the break,'' said Martin of the last off-season, ''and I didn't want to go away anywhere either.'' Instead, he started his rehab program and chipped away at it every single day, feeling some urgency because he had just one year left on his contract.

Most days, he had AAMI Park completely to himself. He trained as the grand finals unfolded across the road, and he worked out on Christmas Day, too. ''I turned some music on and did my workout, and I really got into it. It was pretty much my life: wake up, work out, eat and sleep,'' Martin said. ''It pretty much filled in my break, but there was nothing else I wanted to be doing. I made sure I literally did everything I could; I didn't drink a thing, and I didn't eat a single calorie that wasn't going to help me. I wanted to show everyone I was working, and taking everything seriously. It was a really good time for me.''

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/respect-and-responsibility-20110606-1fpcg.html

The harder you work, the luckier you become...

Very good article explaining where Steffy has been in recent times...

I think that one of the three (Jamar, Martin and Gawn) need to develop a significant strength up forward if we want to truly utilize them in the best way possible.

Essendon's three ruckmen only work when they were contributing up forward but look inept when they are not contributing outside of the ruck

Very good article explaining where Steffy has been in recent times...

I think that one of the three (Jamar, Martin and Gawn) need to develop a significant strength up forward if we want to truly utilize them in the best way possible.

Essendon's three ruckmen only work when they were contributing up forward but look inept when they are not contributing outside of the ruck

Unfortunately, unless the sub-rule changes again, there will never be room for 3 ruckman in a side. Bombers have 3 absolutely awesome ones and it just doesn't work.

But that doesn't diminish the importance of having some good ruck depth.

Jamar (27) and Martin (24) hopefully will be ruck duo for the next 2-3 seasons.

In 3 years, once Jamar starts to nudge closer to 30 years old, Spenser and Gawn will be 22 and 23 years old and just about ready to take on the number one ruck spot.

Number 1 ruck (70% ruck, 10% forward): Jamar, Martin, Gawn, Spencer

Number 2 ruck (30% ruck, 50% forward): ???? Fitzpatrick, Newton (rubbish), Dunn (not big enough), McDonald

In terms of how to play Jamar and Martin together...

When Jamar is fit and firing, he should always have at least 70% ruck imo. Martin should be aiming to play the Leigh Brown role (major roles in defence and up forward and ruck relief), rather than the Darren Jolly role.

Jamar is the 3rd best RUCKMAN in the competition. Anyone who watched him last season knows he plays his best footy when he's got the number 1 ruck responsibility- in fact he played his best footy when he was the lone ruckman in the team.

Edited June 7, 201114 yr by sylvinator

The article in The Age really gave me the impression that Stef's a very "switched on" individual.

I like how he spoke about Jamar telling him he wanted them to become the best ruck duo in the comp. If Jamar comes back and returns to his best form, they'd certainly be up there as the best combo.

Over the previous couple of years I'd often see Stef outside gate 5/4 before the match, pacing around chatting with the mobile glued to his ear. Always wanted him out there. Nice to see his determination and hard work speaking for themselves.

In terms of how to play Jamar and Martin together...

When Jamar is fit and firing, he should always have at least 70% ruck imo. Martin should be aiming to play the Leigh Brown role (major roles in defence and up forward and ruck relief), rather than the Darren Jolly role.

Jamar is the 3rd best RUCKMAN in the competition. Anyone who watched him last season knows he plays his best footy when he's got the number 1 ruck responsibility- in fact he played his best footy when he was the lone ruckman in the team.

Martin is a quandry. I don't think he is a forward, can play as a defender but as a ruckman plays as another follower, and he plays this role very well.

I think he is a first ruck or a defender/second or third ruck.

I guess he will get another chance to play forward when Jamar comes back and we will see what he can do there with his new form.

jamar should be our stay at home forward...martin should play majority of the ruck...Martin doesn't fit into our defence and forward line. Jamar is very capable of playing in the forward line and taking contested marks. I believe he once kicked 5 or so against the blues years back.

When martin wants a reset he can go onto the bench. Jamar from the goal square to ruck...bring someone off the bench intot he forward line....Just one of many approaches.

jamar should be our stay at home forward...martin should play majority of the ruck...Martin doesn't fit into our defence and forward line. Jamar is very capable of playing in the forward line and taking contested marks. I believe he once kicked 5 or so against the blues years back.

When martin wants a reset he can go onto the bench. Jamar from the goal square to ruck...bring someone off the bench intot he forward line....Just one of many approaches.

I just cannot reconcile this.

We have an elite ruckman who happens to be a B grade FP/FF.

And we are going to play him as a B grade FP/FF?

Love Martin, yay for him, but it is up to him to develop some presence in the forward line because he will spend more time there than Jamar.

Edited June 7, 201114 yr by rpfc

Having said that, we might go with the 'lazy Jamar' option of having Jamar in for the bounces and Martin rucking around the ground.

However, this is easier said than done. And a good ruckman would ruin them on the transition.

If Jamar is going to become our big forward, he damn well better learn how to kick for goal. That is one aspect of his game that is definitely "B-Grade".

Martin is a quandry. I don't think he is a forward, can play as a defender but as a ruckman plays as another follower, and he plays this role very well.

I think he is a first ruck or a defender/second or third ruck.

I guess he will get another chance to play forward when Jamar comes back and we will see what he can do there with his new form.

He's a Ruckman/Follower. These guys learn the ruck role first, and as they grow confidence, they feel more composed in front of Goal. Just as Mark did. IMO the same will take place with Steph.